Do we have a challenge ahead of us to avoid becoming Hearing?

Here's another attempt to get back to the main point of the thread...

I liked what Grummer wrote near the beginning about not being stupid. When we pretend to be Hearing, we are being stupid in that we're not being true to ourselves, and the result is emotional damage. So my question is "How can we be intelligent - mentally, emotionally & socially?"

Personally, I think developing compassion is an important part of the answer. Compassion to ourselves, and compassion to others - especially if they are "different" from yourself. Showing compassion demonstrates strength. I'm not talking about a weak love than gets trod down, but rather a strong love that protects the weak and challenges the dominant. Plus challenges the powerful in an emotionally intelligent way. If the only thing hearing people see are deaf people moaning, bickering and being negative, then there's no attraction for them to change and accommodate us. I'm thinking of how Martin Luther King courageously challenged a racist society using non-violent methods.
 
BecLak said:
Perhaps we should step back into history for a bit. What did those who were born deaf in deaf families introduce themselves as, what did they call themselves to differentuate themselves, even before big D came into the picture? Does anyone know?
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Depends on how far back in the history you go. Most of the earliest history about deafness as we know it, came into existence with the first deaf schools. The D thing is a western, postmodern concept, where one have to construct ones identity, AFAIK.

In the middle east, you'll find several bedouin tribes with many deaf members due to inbreed. How they differenate, if they have the need for that, is a good question. Is deafness something else in a tribal, collective culture, than in a indivdual culture?

Boy, now I'm confusing myself :)
 
My ears are totally plugged at the moment. That goes with being filled with 70 mph wind.
 
AJWSmith said:
Here's another attempt to get back to the main point of the thread...

I liked what Grummer wrote near the beginning about not being stupid. When we pretend to be Hearing, we are being stupid in that we're not being true to ourselves, and the result is emotional damage. So my question is "How can we be intelligent - mentally, emotionally & socially?"

Personally, I think developing compassion is an important part of the answer. Compassion to ourselves, and compassion to others - especially if they are "different" from yourself. Showing compassion demonstrates strength. I'm not talking about a weak love than gets trod down, but rather a strong love that protects the weak and challenges the dominant. Plus challenges the powerful in an emotionally intelligent way. If the only thing hearing people see are deaf people moaning, bickering and being negative, then there's no attraction for them to change and accommodate us. I'm thinking of how Martin Luther King courageously challenged a racist society using non-violent methods.
Click to expand...

Exactly, and compassion from this self-contentment is a demonstration of character> Conformity doesnt reward with inner strength and respect. Conformity is really about obeying from fear, fear from what? Fear from being seen as ashamed about ones own deafness, that is no respect from society. We owe nothing to society but aside from 'law obedience' respect which is really a matter of civil, not of personal and social. We owe to ourselves that personal and social respect (and power), it is ALLOWED. So other than its not being 'recognised' as in 100%, it isn't without commission from the powers-that-be, once we have it- this will be a lot easier for Deaf children to look into future with honesty and true selfhood from the start, not some chaotic confusions that so many of us had endured and shared in here.
 
i hope im making sense, had a few beers just now, (the imported hand-made variety, i never drink the cheap stuff now)
 
Those who mind don't matter, & those who matter don't mind

Walking stealthily on the road of life
Full of happiness & at times strife
But, I overcome the plights that come my way
And move on a step at a time day by day

On my way, people come & people go
But, life’s a river, & so it carries on its flow
It crosses all the obstacles that come in its trail
It never stops & moves on & on without fail

I move along the river like trout on its surface
Paying no heed to those who come & go in life’s race
Continuing further with the flow, I find a friend
Who promises to stay with me till the end

She tells me to change—to change my attitude
She tells me to show off, be pompous & a little rude
And so for my friend I try to change my way
But, in that false attire, I could no longer stay

I told my friend what I bore in my heart
I am what I am & I haven’t changed from the start
My friend just didn’t understand, & so she took a different route
I first did moan, but then I forgot her & followed suit

And so like this false friend, many others came by
When I refused to change, they left without a sigh
As each one passed by, I knew
That forever friends are very few

Then one fine day, I met another
Who also held my hand & we moved together
She did just what the others had done
Like the others, she was my friend & we had fun

But, soon I knew she wasn’t like he same
For she needed only friendship & no fame
She accepted all my good & bad things
And taught me fly as if I had wings

Fly & be who I am without caring for what they say
For it’s my life & they are only guests for a day
It was then that I found out
What life was all about

That you must say what you feel & be who you are
Never change yourself & no goal is too far
Those who mind don’t matter, & those who matter don’t mind
Cause this is way of life & at every step this is what you’ll find




Prerna Chikersal
 
Berry said:
Those who mind don't matter, & those who matter don't mind

Walking stealthily on the road of life
Full of happiness & at times strife
But, I overcome the plights that come my way
And move on a step at a time day by day

On my way, people come & people go
But, life’s a river, & so it carries on its flow
It crosses all the obstacles that come in its trail
It never stops & moves on & on without fail

I move along the river like trout on its surface
Paying no heed to those who come & go in life’s race
Continuing further with the flow, I find a friend
Who promises to stay with me till the end

She tells me to change—to change my attitude
She tells me to show off, be pompous & a little rude
And so for my friend I try to change my way
But, in that false attire, I could no longer stay

I told my friend what I bore in my heart
I am what I am & I haven’t changed from the start
My friend just didn’t understand, & so she took a different route
I first did moan, but then I forgot her & followed suit

And so like this false friend, many others came by
When I refused to change, they left without a sigh
As each one passed by, I knew
That forever friends are very few

Then one fine day, I met another
Who also held my hand & we moved together
She did just what the others had done
Like the others, she was my friend & we had fun

But, soon I knew she wasn’t like he same
For she needed only friendship & no fame
She accepted all my good & bad things
And taught me fly as if I had wings

Fly & be who I am without caring for what they say
For it’s my life & they are only guests for a day
It was then that I found out
What life was all about

That you must say what you feel & be who you are
Never change yourself & no goal is too far
Those who mind don’t matter, & those who matter don’t mind
Cause this is way of life & at every step this is what you’ll find




Prerna Chikersal
Click to expand...

That you must say what you feel & be who you are
Never change yourself & no goal is too far
Those who mind don’t matter, & those who matter don’t mind
Cause this is way of life & at every step this is what you’ll find


"Beautiful!...Thank you, Berry, for this posting this poem...it's the first time I've seen it....and it holds TRUE!"
 
kokonut said:
Speedy hawk,

What about those with profound hearing loss who communicate by primarily through speaking and listening?
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Read what Bottesini below. I thought my post was pretty clear.

Last pargraph is BSL users (ASL to you), so that must be if you are not signer you must be in 1st paragragh. Simples.

Bottesini said:
Cover in the first paragraph and separate from BSL users. :doh:
Click to expand...

Yep, that right. My post is clear afterall.
 
deafskeptic said:
You have an excellent point here. Personally, I don't think deaf can ever be fully assimilated despite all the current or even future devices that are supposed to help us hear. There will always be gaps in communication in the foreseeable future for for deaf and hearing so ASL or BSL or any other kind of sign system will not die out.
Click to expand...

:fingersx:
 
ASL/QLS?BSL et all will be used as long as there are persons who sign. Is it factual there re LESS-- persons using sign communication due to increase use of Cochlear Implants with the consequence of decrease in learning ASL et al?

Implanted A B Harmony activated Aug/07
 
AJWSmith said:
I thought it would be useful to share this from Paddy Ladd's book.

hearing/Hearing: The lowercase 'hearing' is a term originating in the Deaf community to describe non-Deaf people (including 'deaf' people). I have sometimes capitalised this to indicate an additional dimension expressed by Deaf people - for example, 'Hearing world' or 'Hearing Ways', akin to the capitalisation of 'White' or 'Male' by Black and feminist theoreticians.


Note how he labels 'deaf' people as 'hearing'. No wonder these debates get so muddled!!! It gets particularly confusing when an individual chooses a label for themselves and the same word gets used differently by another person, or the other person uses a different word to label you.

For example, I label myself 'deaf' to distinguish myself from a 'hearing' person. But a Deaf person may label me as 'hearing' because I'm not part of the Deaf community. And this labelling by Deaf people got my back up as I don't use the world 'hearing' to describe myself. But when I read carefully, I discover that the word 'hearing' is being used in a different way. I'm using it to distinguish myself from hearing people, Paddy Ladd is using it to distinguish me from Deaf people. We saw another example of this earlier between DeafCaroline and kokonut with the use of the word 'hoh'.

The important thing is to find the label you want to use to describe yourself and to be happy with it, accepting that other people may apply a different label to you. For me, I'm happy with the label 'deaf' even if I may get called 'hearing' or 'hoh' by others. I'm secure about being 'deaf' rather than 'Deaf'. At this point in time, though people may want to put these labels on me, I'm neither a Hearing wanna-be or a Deaf wanna-be. I'm just me.
Click to expand...


It is all about perspective, point of view (POV).

One of the biggest difficulties in communication is that 90% of hearing people believe words have meanings and those meanings have a direct relationship to reality. Even otherwise highly educated hearing people believe this fallacy. The entire system of reasoning called logic depends heavily on the mistaken notion that somehow, someway, a direct correspondence between reality and words can be achieved. Our legal system is largely based on the mistaken notion that either something is true or it is not true, either a law was broken or it was not -- All supported by the written and/or spoken word.

Bilingual people, no matter how uneducated or illiterate have to deal with the fact that the words and signs from one language do not fit neatly into the words and signs of another language and that reality changes from one language to the next. Bilingual people do not have the luxury of believing there is a neat fit between words or signs and reality.

Often hearing people fall back on a predefined definition. In the U.S. this is often the legal definition. "He is your father if the law says he is your father." Your "real" father is therefore your legal father. However the law allows science to trump all other forms of definition. If a paternity test is performed then the results will become the legal results.

This is a neat little trick. It allows most Hearing people to go their entire lives without ever having to think about what they believe or what they are saying. They don't have to question, research, or wonder.

As long as they stay in this little word box everything is nice, neat, ordered, safe, and simple.

To most hearing people it is perfectly reasonable to have a legal definition of deaf, hard of hearing, hearing impaired, and hearing. These legal definitions would be chosen from the agreements audiologists formed among themselves as they are the scientific experts on the subject.

Remember to most of them this is REALITY we are talking about here. THEY do not want to QUESTION or THINK about it. To do so is to face the fact they do not live in the comfortable reality they believe they live in. It means admitting that at least one small part of the world they live in is a fantasy built from a web of words that do not have the connection to reality they think they do.

Yet this is exactly what everyone in the Deaf, deaf, HOH, cultures and signing communities are asking, nay, demanding, that they do.

Naturally they are going to be antagonistic.

Here is an interesting conundrum:

Most Hearing don't accept anyone's internal experience as valid because it cannot be legally defined nor scientifically proven.

And by doing so they force everyone connected with the Deaf and Signing community to develop strong internal structures to deal with the lack of understanding and acceptance Hearing give them.
 
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