Do Jews believe in Jesus and still be Jewish?

[hottiedeafboi]

hottiedeafboi,

I cut you off because what you said is NOT true. There's no shred of evidence in what you said.

Don't cut part what I said of that phrase and can't remember which part I meant. But as I said this is not under this one, its on other thread, don't remember which, but I don't know which phrase I'm talking about by you cut part of it with no point.

 

[hottiedeafboi]

hottiedeafboi,

I cut you off because what you said is NOT true. There's no shred of evidence in what you said.

Now, I found it, I want you to understand, the God we worship as teresh mentioned is this, with each religion worship same God, but other religion coundnt see the realm of God of who He is, that is this, true all of us worship one Lord God Almighty, but missed the realm of God as of Triune. Its a debative part, the reason by saying they didn't worship same God we worship bec they didn't believe Triune God and has misconcept of who God is and the position as Oneness. Don't need to bash at me by saying that.

 

[Throwstones]

Teresh doesn't want to admit that I am Jewish so that she can say no Jew ever believed in Jesus but the truth is that many Jews do believe in Jesus!

 

[Teresh]

Teresh doesn't want to admit that I am Jewish so that she can say no Jew ever believed in Jesus but the truth is that many Jews do believe in Jesus!

Did you even read my post? You're a Jew, no amount of rejecting your heritage or your religion will ever change that. That does not mean, however, that you are practicing Judaism.

Christianity is not and has never been a form of the Jewish religion.

 

[hottiedeafboi]

Christians is for all kinds of people, and its lead by God from the prophet who are jewis themselves to prophesied and as reigning is to come, bot in prestent, what Jesus is and was and will be is a pattern what God has planned, what God is doing is leading people now for preparation of His Kingdom of His reign. That's the whole purpose of the cross.

 

[Throwstones]

Teresh is more narrow minded than most Jews who will readily admit that I am Jewish

 

[Teresh]

Teresh is more narrow minded than most Jews who will readily admit that I am Jewish

I said (twice, no less) "You're a Jew". Stop lying about what I think. It makes you look like a fool.

 

[web730]

Yes, because Christians, Muslims and Baha'i all worship the same God that the Jews do.

Oh, you still don't know what you talking about after this long time. Spirit-blind and blah-blah like you think you know everything. Sorry, you don't.

Get back to the Bible and learn more and more then you should see the difference.

To add: Messianic Jews are still Jews by blood, however. It remains as a fact no matter what you believe or say.

 

[Reba]

...And, might I add, the "deity" Jesus of Nazareth is dead (and buried)?

Jesus was dead, and in the tomb three days. He was resurrected (bodily and spiritually) from that grave, and now lives eternally.

 

[Y]

Jesus was dead, and in the tomb three days. He was resurrected (bodily and spiritually) from that grave, and now lives eternally.

Teresh, Do you know what that means ? I have only
one word that describe this whole paragraph.

What is the only one word describe this?

 

[Reba]

I sure can. I can say that Christian scripture is inaccurate....

That's pretty much your bottom line. If you refuse to accept that the Scriptures are true, then you can justify denial of all that it contains.

The Bible clearly states that Jesus arose after three days in the grave. That you can't deny. So, it's easier for you to deny the accuracy of the entire New Testatment Scriptures than to accept the truth therein.

If something in the Bible doesn't fit your personal beliefs, just push it aside.


And yet . . . it is still there . . . .

 

[pek1]

Teresh doesn't want to admit that I am Jewish so that she can say no Jew ever believed in Jesus but the truth is that many Jews do believe in Jesus!

The Devil and demons in Hell believe in Jesus, too, but they don't belong to Him. If you mean that many Jews (old translation of such) know Christ as Savior, that's great!

 

[pek1]

Christianity is not and has never been a form of the Jewish religion.

It's the completion of Judiasm. You must not know the Torah very well or any of the Old Testament prophets of what they've said.

 

[pek1]

That's pretty much your bottom line. If you refuse to accept that the Scriptures are true, then you can justify denial of all that it contains.

The Bible clearly states that Jesus arose after three days in the grave. That you can't deny. So, it's easier for you to deny the accuracy of the entire New Testatment Scriptures than to accept the truth therein.

If something in the Bible doesn't fit your personal beliefs, just push it aside.


And yet . . . it is still there . . . .

 

[sculleywr]

I sure can. I can say that Christian scripture is inaccurate.

So your argument is that they were mythological. Good try, but read this very comprehensive argument:
http://www.leaderu.com/offices/billcraig/docs/fales.html

Then you have a profound misunderstanding of what the covenent with God means. A covenant doesn't get "fulfilled".

The covenant was that God would renew His relationship with man. That is His covenant in a peanut shell. Jesus's death made the possibility of a relationship with the holy God a reality.

Many ancient religions worshipped their ancestors who were, as you may recall, quite dead.

Name one where the person was the center of scorn, a political enemy of the state, beaten so much that he was in hypovolemic shock and you could see his vital organs, then hung nude on a cross to die. Or you could tell me of one who suffered a like death and is still worshipped. Good luck.

Christianity has not suffered persecution on the scale that Judaism has. Maybe it would be more appropriate to say that there must be something in Judaism for it to have survived?

have you forgotten that God promised in BOTH the Old and New Testament that the Jews would survive.

I don't believe in a hell, so your point is moot, but assuming there is a hell... Following the mitzvot was a stipulation of the covenant with Israel (the nation). Abraham, Isaac, Noah, Judah and Israel were around (well, maybe not Noah) prior to that time and are therefore not bound to that covenant. They were, however, bound to the Noachide laws.

So what happens to people like Hitler, Osama Bin Ladin, Satan, the fallen angels, Suddam Hussein, etc. If they are in heaven, I sure as hell am not going. There is a hell in every Jewish piece. In fact, the belief in hell's non-existence is one of the reasons the Jews were in captivity. Another reason they were out is because they didn't believe in God. I tell you, you are not Jew in race or religion. You want the morality and not the consequences of following the rules. You know very little of the Jewish laws and prophecies, and you are the only Jew I have EVER met (and that names quite a few, online and off) who claimed that any part of the scripture was not inspired. You are not only a non-Jew, but you are a hypocrite. period. End of debate. bye.

 

[Teresh]

Oh, you still don't know what you talking about after this long time. Spirit-blind and blah-blah like you think you know everything. Sorry, you don't.

Sorry, but as someone who is not versed in the subject, you've no qualification to make that statement.

Get back to the Bible and learn more and more then you should see the difference.

The Bible doesn't say anywhere in it that Muslims and Baha'is worship a different God.

To add: Messianic Jews are still Jews by blood, however. It remains as a fact no matter what you believe or say.

I've never said anything different. You, like Throwstones, put words in my mouth when I don't say the things you want me to. Sorry, but that doesn't cut it. If you can't discuss my opinion based on what I actually said, sorry, but you lose automatically. Changing what I said does not work here.

Jesus was dead, and in the tomb three days. He was resurrected (bodily and spiritually) from that grave, and now lives eternally.

According to Christian Scripture..

That's pretty much your bottom line. If you refuse to accept that the Scriptures are true, then you can justify denial of all that it contains.

Indeed. The validity of a particular text is a matter of faith.

If I were so inclined, I could consider the plot of Final Fantasy VII to be divinely inspired and therefore worship Sephiroth. That would, of course, be nonsense, but you

The Bible clearly states that Jesus arose after three days in the grave. That you can't deny.

I can't deny what Christian scripture says, no. The books are there and assuming no one editted or translated them improperly, yes, they say what they say.

So, it's easier for you to deny the accuracy of the entire New Testatment Scriptures than to accept the truth therein.

Accept the truth therein? That's a loaded statement. You speak as if I'm denying a set-in-stone fact. Now, obviously, that is what you believe (you are, in your own words, a fundamentalist Christian), but you're also blind to the fact that not everyone has the same view of the world as you do.

If something in the Bible doesn't fit your personal beliefs, just push it aside.

Bacon cheeseburgers, Reba, bacon cheeseburgers... Oh, and four-cornered garments with fringes, too, can't forget those.

And yet . . . it is still there . . . .

And yet, the Tao Te Ching, the Qur'an, the Upanishads, the Vedas, the Zohar, etc. are still there. Just because the book exists does not make it true. You deny the legitimacy of every sacred text other than your own, why do you have a problem with someone denying the legitimacy of yours?

It's the completion of Judiasm. You must not know the Torah very well or any of the Old Testament prophets of what they've said.

That's the typical Christian vantage point, though it's not true if the individual actually knows anything about Judaism. When you go and get educated in Judaism (and I mean from Jewish sources, not Christian sources), then, and only then are you allowed to discuss Judaism intelligently. As you are, at this time, ignorant, you have no basis on which to make the claim that Christianity is the completion of anything.

So your argument is that they were mythological. Good try, but read this very comprehensive argument:
http://www.leaderu.com/offices/billcraig/docs/fales.html

All religions are equally mythological, but that's what you (and a lot of the other people who have posted on this thread) simply don't get. Whether or not the text is true is not, and should never be, the most important thing. The most important thing should, in a religion, be what you do with the text you have.

Name one where the person was the center of scorn, a political enemy of the state, beaten so much that he was in hypovolemic shock and you could see his vital organs, then hung nude on a cross to die. Or you could tell me of one who suffered a like death and is still worshipped. Good luck.

Jesus was not the center of scorn or a political enemy of the state. If anything, he was fairly well respected. He was an enemy of Rome, yes, but the Jews in Judea didn't like Rome (and Rome didn't like them) anyway so that wasn't a problem.

have you forgotten that God promised in BOTH the Old and New Testament that the Jews would survive.

And yet, Christians to this day persecute them...

So what happens to people like Hitler, Osama Bin Ladin, Satan, the fallen angels, Suddam Hussein, etc.

If there is a punishment in the afterlife, they receive it.

I tell you, you are not Jew in race or religion.

As a gentile who has no legitimate understanding of Judaism, yeah, it'd be easy to make that determination on your part. You think you know more about Judaism than the people practicing it do. Why don't you just claim to be God too? You obviously believe you are.

You are not only a non-Jew, but you are a hypocrite. period. End of debate. bye.

I take it scathing criticism doesn't suit you. Sorry, but I won't bend over backwards and let you treat me poorly. If you want my respect, you have to respect me. There are several people on this forum that have earned that, people who I do not always (or even frequently) agree with, but I nonetheless respect them.

You have disrespected me, and therefore, unless you start treating me as an equal rather than as an inferior, I will respond in kind.

 

[hottiedeafboi]

Teresh, as you said about quaran, other, don't forget even respect babylon, egyptians, greek, romans and other, even Ba'al, respect religion. Hmmm, those where God destroyed them. Also, as the follower of Jesus, they followed jewish traditions. So don't say christians are not hand down from the jewish. Even amazing, even Zechariah received the message from God the coming of Messiah and that is also finger Jesus. Again, as the Ruler of the Kingdom, again I say, all the planned God has given us from the cross is preparation of His returning as reign.

 

[sculleywr]

I take it scathing criticism doesn't suit you. Sorry, but I won't bend over backwards and let you treat me poorly. If you want my respect, you have to respect me. There are several people on this forum that have earned that, people who I do not always (or even frequently) agree with, but I nonetheless respect them.

You have disrespected me, and therefore, unless you start treating me as an equal rather than as an inferior, I will respond in kind.

I am not treating you like a Jew at all. I am treating you like what you act like. I would say the same to my own mother if she were like you. I have a line of people that I have treated like this and are still my friends. The last was a guy named Gary who is one of my schoolmates. Within three days we were back on joking basis. I don't mind you having your own beliefs, but I can't condone you claiming to be something you are NOT. You claim to be a Jew yet have the beliefs of a New Ager. Why don't you go join the clan of Meishu Sama. I respect people who deserve it. Hypocrites do not. God does not respect hypocrites and liers. Matter of fact, hell has its own place for liars and hypocrites. I may have Christian love, but my way of presenting it is putting the truth up. Your beliefs are PATENTLY New Age. Mitzvot=Karma, works=man's deity (if a person can work his way to heaven, there is no need for God). How about you quit lying and I will quit getting agitated. Otherwise, go talk to your and don't respond, because my eyes are shut to your lies.

 

[Teresh]

Hmmm, those where God destroyed them.

God didn't destroy the Muslims, the Taoists, the Hindus, the Buddhists or the Native Americans. You can't base religious significance on which cultures died out as a great many survived that are not Jewish or Christian.

Also, as the follower of Jesus, they followed jewish traditions.

Like? By my observation, Christianity didn't adopt many (or any) Jewish traditions.

 

[Teresh]

I am not treating you like a Jew at all.

You're treating me with disrespect. I don't care whether or not that's how you treat Jews. You are treating *me*, the girl sitting on the floor of her room, keyboard in hand, with disrespect.

I am treating you like what you act like. I would say the same to my own mother if she were like you.

You disrespect me, I will disrespect you. Respect me, and you will receive my respect. All you need to do to get my respect here is to respect me. I'm not going to extend you something you don't want if you're not willing to return that.

I don't mind you having your own beliefs, but I can't condone you claiming to be something you are NOT. You claim to be a Jew yet have the beliefs of a New Ager.

I never claimed to be a Jew. You have, once again, said I said something that I have not. Try, just for once, actually READING what I say rather than skimming and guessing what I said. I've read every word you've posted in the threads where we have discussed anything. If you're not willing to extend me the same courtesy, don't even bother posting at all.

This forum is a forum for discussion, not a soapbox.

Why don't you go join the clan of Meishu Sama.

And that is...?

I respect people who deserve it. Hypocrites do not. God does not respect hypocrites and liers.

Fortunately, I am neither. You might have noticed that I only discuss my theology in reaction to someone else stating theirs. My theology is self-sufficient as it is, I do not require the validation or acceptance from someone else to be happy with it. I do not require

How about you quit lying and I will quit getting agitated.

I don't lie. However, if I'm inclined to learn about Judaism, I read Jewish books rather than Christian books. If you sincerely want to learn about a group of people or their beliefs, you're far better served by talking to them and reading books written by them. If you consider a source that is outside that group to have an accurate and full understanding of it, you're just fooling yourself.

Having an objective understanding of another faith requires consulting the adherents of it and requires practicing it.

Otherwise, go talk to your and don't respond, because my eyes are shut to your lies.

I don't speak to angels. That would be idolatry. I pray only to God.