District files appeal against deaf student

[jackiesolorzano]

You know jackie, it will not be necesary for me to forward anything tothe court system. They ahve the records of your daughter's performance in hand. That speaks for itself. And, if you are called to testify, I have no doubt that you will look as foolish as you have right here, as well as in the other forum. You can't keep your story straight when you have a written record to refer to. How the heck will you remember what you said, and not contradict yourself without a written record?

Perhaps I should just show your employers an example of your grammar.

I forgot to add, would you like to know the name of my prinicipal and who I work for, I am sure she would love to hear from you.

 

[jillio]

It really is none of your business or anyone else's but I will explain. I am from a working class family. I am actually the first in both of our families to finish college. My husband did not finish high school.

We do have a large house for us it is the biggest home we have ever lived in. My husband works really hard and puts in a lot of overtime. We are able to afford our home for now because of a funny mortgage we have. As a teacher and because I have taken all of the college classes I can, I am at the end of the education side.

Quite frankly, the size of a person's mind and heart is much more of interest to me than the size of their house. You are the one that volunteered the information, and then contradicted yourself.

Ah, that explains it. One should never reach the "end" of the education side. You should contiunue to learn as long as you live. It is the only way to stay informed. Nor have you taken all of the college classes you can. You have not earned a Ph.D., nor have you exhausted all of the classes offered that you could audit as non-degree simply to keep yourself current and to expand your knowledge base. Education is not an end you arrive at after a few years....it is a life long process because there is always something new to learn.

Right now if you look at our bank account yeah it would look like we are currently working class family. If you look at my home then we would be middle class.

I am from a working class family and all of my extended family is working class. And I do not expect my kids to go an Ivy League college. We are thinking Cal State or UC system.

I am so sorry that both my husband and I have worked so hard to try to get out of the working class. It is like we have one foot in and one foot out.

Perhaps you have been working toward the wrong goal.

 

[jillio]

Please do

I'm certain that they would find it as revealing as did I and others. But I don't share your penchant for vindictiveness toward those who disagree with me. By the way, what did you score on your writing section of the GREs?

Oh, and it hasn't escaped notice that you have totally ignored the positive post regarding a signing CI user and the wonderful accomplishments he has made.

 

[rick48]

Oh, and I would like to share some good news. One of the students I work with...CI but still sign based and uses a terp in class...referred him an internship program through the VA. They had some grant money, and he fulfilled the stipulations inthe grant, so he was hired for a paid internship through the grant funding. He just came into my office to tell me that starting Oct. they will be putting him on staff and he is going to be making $33,000/yr. Not bad for a signing college sophomore, huh? Oh, and he is also teching sign classes at the VA to vets who have been adventitiously deafened.

Success story!

Not bad for any sophomore.

 

[rick48]

No, I am not, nor do I function as one.

So then, I take it your beef is what, that Jackie offered her services to assist someone or tht the school district did not provide a certified interpreter or both?

 

[rick48]

Jillio,


Back on August 19th in post # 1210 I asked you to come up with the following:

"...please show me one post wherein I said a child should not be introduced to sign language until they have not been able to develop oral skills, because the child will learn to rely on the easier (sign) language."

Are you still looking or do you admit that you cannot find a single post wherein I made the statement you claim I made?

 

[rick48]

I'm certain that they would find it as revealing as did I and others. But I don't share your penchant for vindictiveness toward those who disagree with me. By the way, what did you score on your writing section of the GREs?....

BS and that last sentence proves it. You are one of the most vindictive and mean-spirited people I have ever come across.

Jackie,

You should hope she calls, when you get through with the lawsuit for defamation and tortious interference with a business relationship, you and you family will be living in the house of your dreams!
Rick

 

[rick48]

Pete,

"So you're not deaf yourself,..."

Correct

"... but yet you think jackie's method is better?"

No, I have never subscribed to the theory that there is only one way to raise all deaf children, but I do think that Jackie knows far better then you or I what is best for her children.

"...Now, the last time I checked, "proof" is defined here Definition of proof - Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary ..."


While we are on the subject of "proof" have you come up with any to support your false accusation that I have "trashed" deaf children? Still waiting.

"...I'm deaf/hoh, are you telling me that you know better than I do for what I need? Are you telling me that you know what's better for all kids that are deaf/hoh without weighing in on everything?"

Never made such a statement, Pete. Go back and look through my posts and you will see that I consistently support the right of parents to make reasoned and well informed choices on behalf of their children. I have also stated that there is no one "best" or "prefect" method for all deaf children.



"...What's happened to shel and I, in the school system of mainstreaming, cannot continue as it is..."

I think its clear from both your posts that your relationship with one or both of your parents is involved with the issues you had growing up, so rather than blame the school system for all your troubles perhaps you should be looking elsewhere and no, I am not going be saddled with the baggage from how other parents raised their deaf children for that is definitely not how we raised our daughters.

"...Way too many deaf/hoh kids are being left behind and, by the way, isn't that what the president said he didn't want, or did it just pertain to hearing children only? That statement in itself would be enough to have a jury side with me; did you not read the last line of the pledge of allegiance, where it says, " . . . with liberty and justice for all!" It wasn't pertaining to white kids only or white kids who can hear, it said "ALL."


Eh, thanks, I guess for the civics lesson but it has nothing to do with our discussion and now you are bringing race into the issue?? Very bizarre but yet reading it I am reminded of the scene from "Animal House"

Bluto: "Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor...."
Boone: "Germans?"
Otter: "Forget it he's rolling."

 

[jillio]

Not bad for any sophomore.

Absolutely. So much for increased success and more opportunity for the oral deaf.

 

[jillio]

Jillio,


Back on August 19th in post # 1210 I asked you to come up with the following:

"...please show me one post wherein I said a child should not be introduced to sign language until they have not been able to develop oral skills, because the child will learn to rely on the easier (sign) language."

Are you still looking or do you admit that you cannot find a single post wherein I made the statement you claim I made?

Yes rick, and once again you are assumming that every post about an oralist is made about you....which is an incorrect assumption. The quote you are using from my post was a response to shel in a question regarding the philosophy of the John Tracy Clinic, and absolutely nothing to do with you.
as difficult as you may find it to believe, you weren't even a consideration in that discussion. So, since you seem to be fond of challenges, I would challenge you to go back and read the discussion, and particularly my post, in its entirety before jumping to the assumptionthat it had anything to do with you. Why so defensive?

 

[jillio]

BS and that last sentence proves it. You are one of the most vindictive and mean-spirited people I have ever come across.

Jackie,

You should hope she calls, when you get through with the lawsuit for defamation and tortious interference with a business relationship, you and you family will be living in the house of your dreams!
Rick

Its a valid question. Do you even know what a GRE is?

Can't quite be considered defamation when examples abound to support the conclusion. And I think the word you are looking for is tortuous.

 

[jillio]

I forgot to add, would you like to know the name of my prinicipal and who I work for, I am sure she would love to hear from you.

Are you offering that information?

 

[rick48]

Absolutely. So much for increased success and more opportunity for the oral deaf.

Wow, yes one kid getting a $33K grant proves your point. If you want to cling to the belief that there are no advantages to having fluent oral skills, go right ahead.

Difference between you and me is that I am not threatened by the success of another, for it does not detract from our decision one iota. There's plenty of room for successful young deaf people.

 

[jillio]

Wow, yes one kid getting a $33K grant proves your point. If you want to cling to the belief that there are no advantages to having fluent oral skills, go right ahead.

Difference between you and me is that I am not threatened by the success of another, for it does not detract from our decision one iota. There's plenty of room for successful young deaf people.

What are you talking about, one kid getting a 33k grant? You have misread again. I have never said that oral skills are not a useful tool...what Ihave said is that they are not the only thing that determines success in a deaf indiviual, nor that the oral skills are completely responsible for increased opportunity. This student participated int he grant funding for the summer alone. He has been hired, based on his performance and ability, at a salary of $33,000/yr. So, yes, it does assist me in proving a point. And, as you have so often accused me of being incometent in what I do, finding the original grant opportunity for him that has led to his employment at $33,000 per year supports the fact of my competence in what I do.

And of course I would expect you to minimize his accomplishment. He was a CIer who is sign based who went out there and proved himself as a result of the recommendation of a counselor who believes that sign is not a detrimental influence on success.

 

[rick48]

And, as you have so often accused me of being incometent ..."

Incontinent? or Incompetent? Either way you are full of it.



"And of course I would expect you to minimize his accomplishment."

Minimize his accomplishment??? How so, I said it was good for any sophomore. You of course had to turn it into an oral v. sign issue.

Do you ever give it a rest?

 

[jillio]

And, as you have so often accused me of being incometent ..."

Incontinent? or Incompetent? Either way you are full of it.



"And of course I would expect you to minimize his accomplishment."

Minimize his accomplishment??? How so, I said it was good for any sophomore. You of course had to turn it into an oral v. sign issue.

Do you ever give it a rest?

Post 1285. I didn't turn it into an oral vs. sign issue. Just offereing a little evidence that oral only does not necessarily create more opportunity for a deaf kid. BTW, this kid is not sign only. He is a CIer who was educated using sign and speech. Can't answer the tough questions, huh?

 

[rick48]

Post 1285. I didn't turn it into an oral vs. sign issue. Just offereing a little evidence that oral only does not necessarily create more opportunity for a deaf kid. BTW, this kid is not sign only. He is a CIer who was educated using sign and speech. Can't answer the tough questions, huh?

If you mean like, solving quadratic equations, then yes but as to questions from you, I believe I have answered all the relevent ones.

I do not think I ever said that being oral only creates more opportunities but that having good oral skills does. My beef with you, well one of many, is your contention that oral only is detrimental to all deaf children, when I know for a fact that it is not.

 

[jillio]

If you mean like, solving quadratic equations, then yes but as to questions from you, I believe I have answered all the relevent ones.

I do not think I ever said that being oral only creates more opportunities but that having good oral skills does. My beef with you, well one of many, is your contention that oral only is detrimental to all deaf children, when I know for a fact that it is not.

Didn't make any difference in this case, now did it? And yes, rick, you have said that raising and educating a child in an oral environment creates more opportunites for them.

How about the most recent one: do you know what a GRE is?

 

[deafdyke]

jackie, ever hear of sarcasm? You may be working class/ lower middle income class,(at least on paper) but your values and goals are pretty much those of suburban high acheiver generic whitebread families. There's nothing wrong with that per se...........but the way you're fighting for a VERY expensive accomondation, when your child is doing wicked good already, b/c you don't think that she's acheiving to her potentional, is pretty much akin to those parents who misuse IEPs and sped labels so that their kids can get an edge.
God, its pretty much akin to those parents who buy their kids toys that will increase their SAT scores!
You know............I just thought of something. Does your daughter have a disreprency between her verbal and nonverbal IQ, despite being gifted? MANY dhh kids do. (usually the verbal IQ is lower then the nonverbal IQ) Her not working up to (what you think is) par might be the result of that disreprency. Not nessarily the fact that she doesn't have the most modren accomondation out there.

Jackie, think about it. An education that focuses solely on speech skills (a weakness for most dhh kids) does not really lend itself to development of healthy self esteem. I mean how well would someone who is gifted in English, but defiencent in math, acheive if the SOLE focus of their education was their defiency in math? And yes, I know that you chose that route........but I mean it just seems like you're complaining about the disadvantages of a particualr methodology. "Oh no! What the experts told us isn't true. A dhh kid can't just automaticly make honor roll with just using their speech and hearing skills. Therefore they need the most expensive accomondation out there!" (and you haven't even tried something like passing a runners relay baton around the room, to serve as a visual cue as to who is speaking, or a "discussion circle" setup for the classroom)

If you want to cling to the belief that there are no advantages to having fluent oral skills

rick, we're not anti fluent oral skills........we're just wondering why being fluent in oral skills means not also buidling a strong communication toolbox with other tools.
I am VERY glad I can hear and speak. That said, there ARE disadvantages to just hearing and speaking. Its not a foolproof perfect methodology.........but yet AG Bell types(and insistutions and therapists) seem to act like it is!

 

[rick48]

Didn't make any difference in this case, now did it? And yes, rick, you have said that raising and educating a child in an oral environment creates more opportunites for them.

How about the most recent one: do you know what a GRE is?

In your specific example, no it did not but in general, a child raised orally with good oral skills will have more opportunities then a child without good oral skills.

GRE, now its either Green Rotten Eggs or Graduate Record Exam, can I phone a friend Reeg?