Differences - sign language & local spoken language

Jiro said:
trust me - you will like ASL better than foreign sign languages (except LSQ/LSF/LSFS). foreign sign languages such as chinese, japanese, etc. are dependent on speech while ASL isn't. many foreign sign languages have same signs for many things. that's just terrible. that's why it's dependent on speech.
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Wow, so we got lucky with ASL, being so independent of spoken language. That makes me really curious as to what would cause a signed language to develop with more vs less dependence.
 
amylynne said:
Wow, so we got lucky with ASL, being so independent of spoken language. That makes me really curious as to what would cause a signed language to develop with more vs less dependence.
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ASL is just very "well-developed" to the point where it's actually a language with its own syntax, grammar, vocabularies, etc. many foreign sign languages are bastardized or incomplete which is why you may see one sign may means several things and the only way to differ it is by speaking/lip-reading as well as depending on context of the convo.

in foreign countries - just about all deafies have either CI or HA and the mindset in their countries is very audist/oralist-based. so their sign languages are structured around as an "aid" for their speaking.

thanks god ASL is not like that.
 
VacationGuy234 said:
Not that I'm big on the English language as a standard, but I think the point is whether be easier for non-deaf to embrace it were it more like their native language.

Still, that is NOT the original question of the thread. The original question is how closely other sign languages follow their native language. If they do follow it more closely, it would be interesting to know if more non-deaf embrace it there.
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interesting? did you forget already? we already have SEE for that and we already have several threads for past few years that many deafies hated it.

the only non-deaf people who embrace it are hearing parents of deaf children and the sad part? most of them are not even 100% (or close to it) fluent in it... that's why you always hear the term "home signs" which means a combination of made-up signs and ASL/SEE.
 
Sign languages have a grammar structure according to visual perception. In my experience studying both Auslan (Australian Sign Language); ASL; TSL (Thailand) etc., that the grammar is very similar. It is completely different to the spoken languages of any particular country. A point to note: Sign languages which have origins linked to other signed languages such ASL and Auslan, originated from Signedlanguages, not Spoken.
 
Sighs. Oh, Jane.

Look-- Thomas Gallaudet did go to British for English, but professors disagreed with the sign language because they had their audist thinking and attitude against it. He had no choice so he traveled to find an another country for help. He did need a help! Gallaudet did tell Cleru that Deaf children need a help and know English. So, Clerc was only one who will to help unlike those another snobby professors. Therefore, Gallaudent now had two languages to help Deaf children.

You should realize that Alice was a late learner, due to her age, and never went to school. No, oralism will not work on her. Nothing did success anything on her. Well, at least, she was lucky to be taught at young age.
 
ASL is very powerful awesome is skills good cool expertiment.. awesome. ASL is empowerful is give your skills you level. they you regain your empower skill strong give you development grow ASL. expert how ASL. we are development to ASL. I love ASL. It is successfully ASL. I final old on my own skills ASL but ESL replace. I modify ASL. whom is people have research teach best teach mentor. I love ASL is very awesome. It is very enjoy teach. I am happy ASL is very impressive. I knew skills ASL. I know powerful clear to understand fast to visual ASL :)
 
Because English is a "mud" language honestly. No other way I can think to put it. Seriously, English takes words from Latin and all these other places and made it's own. Most of English words have a "foreign base" to them... Just simply put.
 
there is island off coast of some South Amrican country or it may be samall area in South america not sure..the people in this island have alot of gentic deafness so they got together and have sign lanuage grammer is still being worked on...i wish i could remember the name of the place because lots of research and study going on in how sign develops
 
caz12 said:
there is island off coast of some South Amrican country or it may be samall area in South america not sure..the people in this island have alot of gentic deafness so they got together and have sign lanuage grammer is still being worked on...i wish i could remember the name of the place because lots of research and study going on in how sign develops
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Martha's Vineyard
 
BecLak said:
Martha's Vineyard
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You are right about a history of a lot on deafness in Martha's Vineyard. But . . . it is NOT the location that caz12 is trying to think of because Martha's Vineyard is in the USA not South America.
 
KarissaMann05 said:
Sighs. Oh, Jane.

Look-- Thomas Gallaudet did go to British for English, but professors disagreed with the sign language because they had their audist thinking and attitude against it. He had no choice so he traveled to find an another country for help. He did need a help! Gallaudet did tell Cleru that Deaf children need a help and know English. So, Clerc was only one who will to help unlike those another snobby professors. Therefore, Gallaudent now had two languages to help Deaf children.

You should realize that Alice was a late learner, due to her age, and never went to school. No, oralism will not work on her. Nothing did success anything on her. Well, at least, she was lucky to be taught at young age.
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How did someone named Alice (whoever that is) get into this? I made no mention of an "Alice".
 
amylynne said:
Wow, so we got lucky with ASL, being so independent of spoken language. That makes me really curious as to what would cause a signed language to develop with more vs less dependence.
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Lucky???
 
Phoenix23 said:
Because English is a "mud" language honestly. No other way I can think to put it. Seriously, English takes words from Latin and all these other places and made it's own. Most of English words have a "foreign base" to them... Just simply put.
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Correct..
 
dogmom said:
see, here's something I was thinking about this that Jane wrote

".....expressing language in a country would be very similar rather than as completely different as ASL and spoken American English. "


......BUT- ASL and English -are - completely different. Why should they be the same? The two don't parallel and you keep trying to put them there.
Why should English - spoken or written - be the standard to which other languages used in America, are held?
Seems that the original question is an ethnocentric one.
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My expectation would be that when developing another way to communicate in a country that already has a majority language that new way to exchange information would closely follow the grammar of what has been in use. I am well aware that in the case of American English and American Sign Language it did no.
 
Jane B. said:
My expectation would be that when developing another way to communicate in a country that already has a majority language that new way to exchange information would closely follow the grammar of what has been in use. I am well aware that in the case of American English and American Sign Language it did no.
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It depends on the goal of the new language. If the goal is to break away from the other language and present a better one, it's a noble goal. Although, if the language isn't adopted the goal might not be fully met. On the other hand, if the goal is to get more people to use it then your logic would be correct. This was the case in the development of Modern English given the diverse amount of native speakers(the language became a Kluge).

To answer the question you have to look at the usage and satisfaction of a sign language that went that route from a native perspective. You need the native perspective to see if it meets the majority of user needs(English is far from perfect, but fits the needs). On here, the majority of people(who post, or are the loudest) use ASL. Because of the amount ASL users this forum might not be the best place for answers to your original post.
 
Jane B. said:
You are right about a history of a lot on deafness in Martha's Vineyard. But . . . it is NOT the location that caz12 is trying to think of because Martha's Vineyard is in the USA not South America.
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Caz12 appears to be uncertain of the location. Martha's Vineyard is indeed an island off the U.S. as you say, yet I have no knowledge of any other such like communities.
 
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