Deaf Lesbians Criticized For Efforts to Create Deaf Child

[kuifje75]

Well, I don't criticise oral deaf people for their own choices, so why should you criticise manual deaf people for their own decisions just because you had bad experiences with Deaf miliants?

I don't blame hearing people because of my deafness. However, one have to admit that sometimes one would have those "dumb hearing person days" where one is just shocked at the level of disrespect that a hearing person would have towards a deaf person. Some people, INCLUDING DEAF PEOPLE, need to take sensitivity training to deal with different people.

As for this article, I wouldn't want to try to design my own child. Just let the nature take its own course, and if it happens that I have a hearing child, I'm fine with it. If it happens that I have a deaf child, I'm fine with it too. But it is not my position to tell people what they can do with their child or can't do, nor to judge them. People want to make their own choices, it doesn't affect me, so why should I get mad and try to dictate their lives? I say laisser tomber, laisser vivre!

 

[netrox]

Well, I don't criticise oral deaf people for their own choices, so why should you criticise manual deaf people for their own decisions just because you had bad experiences with Deaf miliants?

Whoever said that I have bad experiences with Deaf Militants? I don't agree with them but never had a bad experience with them - believe me, I'd had my shares of arguments with deaf militants and it's been a lot of fun! And I never said I am against manualism.

I am NOT oral either. Just because I can speak doesn't make me an oralist. I know some culturally Deaf people who speak far better than I do.

-jeff

 

[deafdyke]

I HAVE THE RIGHT TO CALL THEM DYKES BECAUSE THEY ARE DYKES!

Jeff, they are lesbians or gay women. You don't have the right to call them dykes, since it is a slur. It would be like me calling you a honky. As for my username I choose that b/c of the irony inheirent in the nickname. (I am bisexual and I am also hard of hearing)

I wouldn't want to try to design my own child. Just let the nature take its own course, and if it happens that I have a hearing child, I'm fine with it. If it happens that I have a deaf child, I'm fine with it too. But it is not my position to tell people what they can do with their child or can't do, nor to judge them

WORD!

 

[netrox]

Jeff, they are lesbians or gay women. You don't have the right to call them dykes, since it is a slur. It would be like me calling you a honky. As for my username I choose that b/c of the irony inheirent in the nickname. (I am bisexual and I am also hard of hearing)

It is a delibrate slur - I have no issues about lesbians, trust me. It's THOSE lesbians that deserve to be called dykes. Tough sh*t if you can't deal with that. As for you to call me a honky, you can call me that because I am a white male but call me that when you're really pissed off! :fruit:

-jeff

 

[kuifje75]

Whoever said that I have bad experiences with Deaf Militants? I don't agree with them but never had a bad experience with them - believe me, I'd had my shares of arguments with deaf militants and it's been a lot of fun! And I never said I am against manualism.

I am NOT oral either. Just because I can speak doesn't make me an oralist. I know some culturally Deaf people who speak far better than I do.

-jeff

I didn't say you were an oralist. I speak with my voice too, and ofc there are some deaf ppl who speak better than me too. As for having bad experiences, I think everyone had bad experiences with all groups of Deaf community, so you would be really too lucky enough to never had a bad experience.

 

[LinuxGold]

Please, we're here to discuss, not to degradate others or to mock. If you can't discuss reasonably, then do not say anything on any given thread.

Thanks.

 

[Sailor Aurora]

And it wasn't stupid people that created hardships, it's your deafness. Your deafness PREVENTS YOU TO HEAR SPEECH. Get it?

-jeff

I could not care less if I am not able to hear speech... I can UNDERSTAND PEOPLE JUST FINE WITHOUT SOUND. I read lips and their body langue, got that?
So there are no barriers between me and hearing people other than the really stupid hearing people who treats me like I'm some retard when I'm not.

Granted, the stupid hearing people are all but few, but there are still plenty of them around to cause all sorts of trouble for deaf or any other people when otherwise they would had NO problems in life.

Take the part-job I had once for instance… I would wear my hearing aids to work, but still the manager there acted like an asshole and always spoke more loudly than he should had when he was talking to me…which always hurt my ears so much when I had my hearing aids turned on. He also spoke very slowly to me when it was not necessary… after all, I can understand speaking lips at the normal speed. He was like: “HELLO AURORA! I…WANT…YOU…TO…REFILL…THE…ICECREAM…MACHINE…GOT…THAT?” In addition, to top it off, he would tell me that like seven times as if I did not understand him the first time.

My hold on my temper was very strained thanks to the manger, and all too often, I would say: “Yes, I understand you.”
And he would also give me all the jobs that an child could easily do but not give me any other things that I could had easily done too as well… like refill the frying vats with the oils and the like. He would not even let me cook too as well.
You know why? Because he was worried that I would not do it correctly or possibly, injure myself as if I was a weak 7-years old.

All because he had the conception that Deaf people could not do ANYTHING that hearing people could not, despite the fact that they’re not handicapped when it comes to being able to walk around normally, handling things and or other things.

And then the final straw was when he fired me, saying that I was too much of a liability for the workplace, that I couldn’t do very much… whose fault was that, you asshole?!

**Sighs**

Moreover, there are always people like that around in the workplace and in schools; always acting like not being able to hear also affects the mind or something equally silly.

I'm very capable of many things, Anything that hearing people can do, I can do too.... even listen to music if I want to. My favortive kind of music is Jazz and other types of classic music.

so I always get amused when people first find out that I'm deaf, and then they're like: "Oh, I feel kind of sorry for you... you can't even hear music and the like!" :sure:

don't feel sorry for me.... really.

 

[BigSpike]

I could not care less if I am not able to hear speech... I can UNDERSTAND PEOPLE JUST FINE WITHOUT SOUND. I read lips and their body langue, got that?
So there are no barriers between me and hearing people other than the really stupid hearing people who treats me like I'm some retard when I'm not.

Granted, the stupid hearing people are all but few, but there are still plenty of them around to cause all sorts of trouble for deaf or any other people when otherwise they would had NO problems in life.

Take the part-job I had once for instance… I would wear my hearing aids to work, but still the manager there acted like an asshole and always spoke more loudly than he should had when he was talking to me…which always hurt my ears so much when I had my hearing aids turned on. He also spoke very slowly to me when it was not necessary… after all, I can understand speaking lips at the normal speed. He was like: “HELLO AURORA! I…WANT…YOU…TO…REFILL…THE…ICECREAM…MACHINE…GOT…THAT?” In addition, to top it off, he would tell me that like seven times as if I did not understand him the first time.

My hold on my temper was very strained thanks to the manger, and all too often, I would say: “Yes, I understand you.”
And he would also give me all the jobs that an child could easily do but not give me any other things that I could had easily done too as well… like refill the frying vats with the oils and the like. He would not even let me cook too as well.
You know why? Because he was worried that I would not do it correctly or possibly, injure myself as if I was a weak 7-years old.

All because he had the conception that Deaf people could not do ANYTHING that hearing people could not, despite the fact that they’re not handicapped when it comes to being able to walk around normally, handling things and or other things.

And then the final straw was when he fired me, saying that I was too much of a liability for the workplace, that I couldn’t do very much… whose fault was that, you asshole?!

**Sighs**

Moreover, there are always people like that around in the workplace and in schools; always acting like not being able to hear also affects the mind or something equally silly.

I'm very capable of many things, Anything that hearing people can do, I can do too.... even listen to music if I want to. My favortive kind of music is Jazz and other types of classic music.

so I always get amused when people first find out that I'm deaf, and then they're like: "Oh, I feel kind of sorry for you... you can't even hear music and the like!" :sure:

don't feel sorry for me.... really.

Your not alone, I experienced many difficulties from stupid managers/supervisors/foremen before I became case manager for the deaf mean my own flexiable schedule...I loved it...yes we share same frustrating...I happened to chat with one of my dearly co worker...she told me the wheelchaired people cant get up or down on stairway...as they need elevator accessible or ramp accesible. It is similar with deafness this cant hear as their communication system was blocked, so they need sign language interpreter in order to communicate more clearly and smooth, agree?

It is not needed to say dont feel sorry for me...because I do adore your courage because you dont want to be felt sorry, I support you 100 percent.

Aurora, we all who have whatever of disability will always have some blocking from accessing freely....

Blessing...

 

[netrox]

And then the final straw was when he fired me, saying that I was too much of a liability for the workplace, that I couldn’t do very much… whose fault was that, you asshole?!

Well, I am deaf and I own a business. The goal of business is to make a profit, not take care of your disability. Deafness is a liability in some workplaces. Mine is already a liability thus I'm in process of finding a hearing person. We live in a hearing world, not a deaf world and my buiness does not cater to only deaf people.

I don't know you enough but from the way you wrote, I suspect it's your social skills that need some work.

-jeff

 

[Banjo]

I don't know you enough but from the way you wrote, I suspect it's your social skills that need some work.

Hate to say it, but I do agree with Netrox. I do detect the bitterness in your writing and you already have shown some obvious signs of bitterness toward the hearing people even though you said there's no barriers.

 

[Sailor Aurora]

I gerenally show no bitterness to hearing people, and I'm very social when I have to be. I can speak freely and I work very hard, so there should had been no problem.

however, the boss of who I was speaking about, he was like: "No, no.. don't cook the burgers! what if you get your hands burned because you were stupid enough to touch the surface?!" (as if I would actually touch the hot surface....*rolls eyes*) and he was like that too with many other things. He wouldn't let me do my Job properly as seeing he was too busy telling me HOW to do things rather than letting things be.

I wasn't asking to be taken care of and such... all I wanted was to work for money to pay for bills, but I can't work with an boss like that.

to top it off he also reduced the pay and only gave me like 1 dollars per hour where others who was working normally got like 5 per hour. Tell me, is that fair? I don't think so.

Also, in this type of workplace I was reffering to being deaf shouldn't had been an libality... after all, it was an workplace that was simlar to Mcdonald's.... working was very simple.. all I had to do was refill things, turn on machines, start up the cooking area, etc.

but this boss of mine worried too much about things that it was getting VERY annoying. He inffered with my work because he thought I couldn't do things like fill the empty icecream machine or the frying vats. Things that was just so easy for me to do.

That's the sort of idiot I was talking about.

 

[Banjo]

to top it off he also reduced the pay and only gave me like 1 dollars per hour where others who was working normally got like 5 per hour. Tell me, is that fair? I don't think so.

It's illegal for a person to pay an employee a dollar per hour. In many states, they have made laws on what the minimum wages should be set at. It's nowhere as low as the dollar per hour wage you mentioned. You should had set a lawsuit up against your employer because he broke the law.

 

[Sailor Aurora]

Unfountely, I was too pissed off and trying very hard to keep my cool with him to think about an lawsuit like that...

In other words, I was too busy trying to prove to him that I could do the things I metioned above without him watching me or telling me how to do it.

and I can't start an lawsuit up now conidsering it's been like years now and it would look downright silly to start it now... it'd only look like I was after money.

No use crying over spilled milk.... espeically if the milk was spilled a long time ago.

 

[deafdyke]

Just because I can speak doesn't make me an oralist

Excellent quote Jeff, and it ties in to what I've been saying all along. Oral skills do not make an oral deaf person.
I have to say I agree with Saioir Aurora, it's not nessacily the disabilty that's a barrier...it's the fact that some hearing people are dumbasses and overprotective. A lot of people don't think twice about the fact that I'm hoh, but there are people who treat me like I'm a retard or more handicapped then I actually am.
One of my friends who's a disabilty rights advocate says " It's not the disabilty that's the barrier....it's the way people treat me that's the barrier"
Sort of like the way that skin color isn't a barrier per se, but it's the way that the majority class treats black people is the barrier.

 

[netrox]

however, the boss of who I was speaking about, he was like: "No, no.. don't cook the burgers! what if you get your hands burned because you were stupid enough to touch the surface?!" (as if I would actually touch the hot surface....*rolls eyes*)

to top it off he also reduced the pay and only gave me like 1 dollars per hour where others who was working normally got like 5 per hour. Tell me, is that fair? I don't think so.

As for 1st paragraph, I would tell the boss to stop that shit. I would be firm and question him, "You actually think I'm gonna touch the surface?" You can challenge a boss.

And for the second paragraph, a dollar per hour?!?!?! If that is true, I'd sue his ass for compensation and punitive damages. Why aren't you doing anything about it?

-jeff

 

[BigSpike]

Unfountely, I was too pissed off and trying very hard to keep my cool with him to think about an lawsuit like that...

In other words, I was too busy trying to prove to him that I could do the things I metioned above without him watching me or telling me how to do it.

and I can't start an lawsuit up now conidsering it's been like years now and it would look downright silly to start it now... it'd only look like I was after money.

No use crying over spilled milk.... espeically if the milk was spilled a long time ago.

My most important advice for you, Sailor Aurora...just show your positive attitude and it really can change thing even it wont..but it will change urself from inner most of u. For example...if someone dis at you or wont respect your disability, just confront them with positive attitude. Never, Never, Never talk in very anger word or being cruelity toward someone who disrespect you. It is NOTHING wrong to be anger, U have every right to be anger but most important is this you control yourself innermost of u, understand? You cannot get people to focus on you all the time...some people are stupidity even their educated and knowledge are still fooled because they dont even understand what is deafness. Therefore, we are to educate them and make them understand...if they decline THEN ITS THEIR LOSS...and leave them alone and do your job. I experienced alot of tough time with supervisors in past before I positioned myself within Deaf Human Service. Be positive ok?

 

[JesKlu]

It is up to God to what he want to do with the child, if he want to make the child deaf, then it will be deaf, if he want to make child hearing, then it will be hearing. It is not up to the parents to make the child deaf, THAT IS WRONG, and SELFISH. Plus, the kid will be in an environment that I don't know, weird. because of the parent's homosexuality.

 

[ScrappyKat]

the thing is... "same disability as the rest of teh family"
i don't find deafness to be a disability.. i find this whole thing a little confusing... but thruth is.. deaf or hearing it is a new life in this world... that is what truely matters

 

[deafdyke]

i don't find deafness to be a disability..

Yeah, it's not like it's quadupligia or something like that. I also don't find deafness to be a huge tragedy...it's not something that I would chose to be, but I could say that about a lot of minorities....like if I'd had a choice, I wouldn't choose to be bi. I'd choose to be STRAIGHT!

 

[Oceanbreeze]

I think it's stupid for a couple to try to make a handicapped child. That would probably make the kid think, "My parents wanted me to be deaf?" That wouldn't be good. I can understand parents wanting to have babies who are born with no life-threatening physical defects, but... with a non-life-threatening handicap is stupid.

I agree with you, Vampy. The whole idea of "designer babies" is disturbing to me. What if the opposite was true, and a couple wanted the "perfect baby"? It almost seems as if this borders on eugenics, and I'm very comfortable with that. I can see not wanting to have a child with life threatening disabilities. That's reasonable, but, that's really the only instance I would say is ethical.

As for how it applies to this deaf couple, I don't agree with it. What if the child grows up teased and rediculed, and goes to his parent and asks "Did you mean for me to be teased, too, Mommy?" What's THAT gonna do to the child's emotional well being?

I think medical science is wonderful, but I also believe in limits. Just because we CAN do things like manipulate genes, does that mean we should?

I'm honestly not sure.