Connecticut school massacre

[Jiro]

If we have 88 guns for every 100 Americans, how many more guns would we need to have a safe country?

actually - in America... the number of guns outnumbers the number of Americans. and yet... most of massacres occurred at "gun-free" zones.

Anti-tank rifles and landmines cannot be sold. Why assault rifles?

assault rifle is already illegal. the only way to get it is to buy it from black market... or from ATF agents running Fast and Furious Operation.

I guess I have 2 hands so 2 semi-automatic handguns each firing 17 rounds in 10 seconds, or so. Or, 30 rounds . . .

in NJ and in probably several states - we have laws on magazine capacity. in NJ, the maximum capacity is 15 rounds.

and firing 2 handguns with 17 rounds each.... my guess? your accuracy rating would be much less than 50%. and you most likely would either get shot or tackled by the time you need to reload both guns. ever tried reloading 2 handguns at same time?

beside.... why are we punishing law-abiding citizens in this scenario? it was a criminal who did the shooting.... not law-abiding citizen. you do realize that it's illegal to kill people? and you do realize that it's illegal to carry weapons on school property? that's why the school was completely defenseless until police officers arrive... 15 minutes later and more officers 30 min later.

since you seem to be on blaming rampage - why don't we blame a high school principal Ms. Hochsprung who buzzed the shooter in? what was Ms. Hochsprung thinking? I mean... a guy wearing a combat gear and armed with a rifle and 2 handguns? what was she thinking???

 

[Jiro]

My guess is that our national trauma over mass murders will always evolve into a polite, decline to discuss.

Some will say that rural dwellers need guns because they are at a distance from law enforcement, etc. Some will say that urban dwellers need guns because they are in high crime areas. It would seem that everyone needs guns.

I am suggesting that we have guns spilling out of our homes. "1.7 million firearms were stolen from homes and elsewhere over the period between January 1993 and August 2002."

US Department of Justice (link)

It would seem that law-abiding US citizens are having a good deal of trouble keeping guns out of the hands of criminals.

It would seem that law-abiding US citizens are having a good deal of securing their own households. Perhaps we should mandate that all homeowners should convert their home into concrete bunkers with steel bars, barbed wire fences, and guard dog? that would probably significantly reduce the incidents of thefts, break-ins, murders, etc. everybody would be safer.

 

[AdamFencepost]

Let me quote the UK Guardian: "US has the highest gun ownership rate in the world - an average of 88 per 100 people. That puts it first in the world for gun ownership - and even the number two country, Yemen, has significantly fewer - 54.8 per 100 people."

Is this Yemen? Do you want it to be Yemen? It seems that hunkering down in concrete bunkers would be the next step.

You would not call a knock-off of an M16 an assault rifle. Okay.

Larry is real small here. Maybe we can pretend that he is just any human, from a small child to a grandmother - from any country. Here is Larry, a victim of homicide in any of the 22 richest countries of the world, other than the US:

Now that he is dead in one of those other countries, here is how many Americans have died in the same population, in the same amount of time:

7 Americans to 1 non-American, victims of murder. I see the course that we are on as just continuing to do the same thing and expecting a different result. Punishing Americans? If we use your numbers, the 300 million guns in the US aren't going to go away in my lifetime by limiting the sale of guns.

 

[Jiro]

Let me quote the UK Guardian: "US has the highest gun ownership rate in the world - an average of 88 per 100 people. That puts it first in the world for gun ownership - and even the number two country, Yemen, has significantly fewer - 54.8 per 100 people."

Is this Yemen? Do you want it to be Yemen? It seems that hunkering down in concrete bunkers would be the next step.

You would not call a knock-off of an M16 an assault rifle. Okay.

Larry is real small here. Maybe we can pretend that he is just any human, from a small child to a grandmother - from any country. Here is Larry, a victim of homicide in any of the 22 richest countries of the world, other than the US:

Now that he is dead in one of those other countries, here is how many Americans have died in the same population, in the same amount of time:

7 Americans to 1 non-American, victims of murder. I see the course that we are on as just continuing to do the same thing and expecting a different result. Punishing Americans? If we use your numbers, the 300 million guns in the US aren't going to go away in my lifetime by limiting the sale of guns.

1. Assault Rifle means an assault rifle is fully-automatic. a fully-automatic weapon aka Assault Rifle is already illegal in America and has always been illegal for a long time. if there is somebody with assault rifle, then he most likely has obtained it from extremely dangerous gangs with deep connection to powerful drug cartels

2. most of gun victims were shot/killed by criminals who obtained guns illegally despite of strict gun laws. in fact - failed stricter gun law has been proven extremely costly. that's why many cities and states have already started to abandon this failed logic when they realized they could no longer afford police officers.... such as Camden, NJ - the worst crime-infested city in America. couple of wealthy towns near me have already closed their own departments to consolidate with County Sheriff Department due to budget issue.

3. if you look at Yemen or Somalia or any other country with dictatorship... ever wonder why these civilians cannot revolt against their own tyrannical government?

4. if living in a country with gun ban law, cameras on every block, and government operating under assumption that every single law-abiding citizen is a hostile criminal sounds great to you.... feel free to move to England

5. ever wonder why England lost war against America? (hint - we didn't have an army at that time)

 

[TXgolfer]

Let me quote the UK Guardian: "US has the highest gun ownership rate in the world - an average of 88 per 100 people. That puts it first in the world for gun ownership - and even the number two country, Yemen, has significantly fewer - 54.8 per 100 people."

Is this Yemen? Do you want it to be Yemen? It seems that hunkering down in concrete bunkers would be the next step.

You would not call a knock-off of an M16 an assault rifle. Okay.

Larry is real small here. Maybe we can pretend that he is just any human, from a small child to a grandmother - from any country. Here is Larry, a victim of homicide in any of the 22 richest countries of the world, other than the US:

Now that he is dead in one of those other countries, here is how many Americans have died in the same population, in the same amount of time:

7 Americans to 1 non-American, victims of murder. I see the course that we are on as just continuing to do the same thing and expecting a different result. Punishing Americans? If we use your numbers, the 300 million guns in the US aren't going to go away in my lifetime by limiting the sale of guns.

We are in America son, The UK folks you cite are still butthurt over the ass-kicking we gave them over 200 years ago when citizens with guns decided they were sick of the King's shit. As for me and my house we will cite the United States Constitution. The 2nd Amendment will never be repealed, nor should it. Best seek a different "solution"

 

[AdamFencepost]

I don't quite understand your #3. It is my understanding that an uprising in 2011 resulted in the replacement of Saleh. Somalia is a failed state without any real central government. Yes, I am sure that there are lots of guns in Somalia.

TXgolfer, my father's family were in this country before the Revolution and the writing of that Constitution. Some of them were here before the coming of the Europeans. I have no intention of thinking that I am less of an American than anyone else. And, I doubt if you are old enough to logically call me "son."

If I was to choose countries with less of a homicide problem than the US I could decide on Canada with 1/5th the gun death rate, Germany with less than 1/10, Australia with nearly 1/20th the gun deaths, as well as Great Britain. I won't be moving but, you see, there are many choices.

 

[Jiro]

I don't quite understand your #3. It is my understanding that an uprising in 2011 resulted in the replacement of Saleh.

uprising... why now and not before? because they didn't have guns back then.

Somalia is a failed state without any real central government. Yes, I am sure that there are lots of guns in Somalia.

yes lot of guns in Somalia but many Somalians do not have guns to protect themselves from rogues and corrupted soldiers.

TXgolfer, my father's family were in this country before the Revolution and the writing of that Constitution. Some of them were here before the coming of the Europeans. I have no intention of thinking that I am less of an American than anyone else. And, I doubt if you are old enough to logically call me "son."

do not confuse yourself with them. just because they were here long time ago doesn't mean you have the same intention and thought as them. your posts sound as if you have forgotten the true meaning of America and the Constitution... something that your ancestors have fought for unless they were Quakers

If I was to choose countries with less of a homicide problem than the US I could decide on Canada with 1/5th the gun death rate, Germany with less than 1/10, Australia with nearly 1/20th the gun deaths, as well as Great Britain. I won't be moving but, you see, there are many choices.

well thank god Americans have made a choice to take back this country from people with similar opinion of yours.

 

[Foxrac]

The revolution, civil war or overthrow of government require guns to make successful event.

 

[TXgolfer]

uprising... why now and not before? because they didn't have guns back then.


yes lot of guns in Somalia but many Somalians do not have guns to protect themselves from rogues and corrupted soldiers.


do not confuse yourself with them. just because they were here long time ago doesn't mean you have the same intention and thought as them. your posts sound as if you have forgotten the true meaning of America and the Constitution... something that your ancestors have fought for unless they were Quakers


well thank god Americans have made a choice to take back this country from people with similar opinion of yours.

 

[CrazyPaul]

.
since you seem to be on blaming rampage - why don't we blame a high school principal Ms. Hochsprung who buzzed the shooter in? what was Ms. Hochsprung thinking? I mean... a guy wearing a combat gear and armed with a rifle and 2 handguns? what was she thinking???

I am sure that you may already hear by now that the witnesses said the shooter shot or smashed the glass of the front door to get in. Don't jump to conclusions next time. OK? That's an order!

BTW, Pres. Obama said it well. Our hearts are broken today.

 

[CrazyPaul]

2. most of gun victims were shot/killed by criminals who obtained guns illegally despite of strict gun laws. in fact - failed stricter gun law has been proven extremely costly. that's why many cities and states have already started to abandon this failed logic when they realized they could no longer afford police officers.... such as Camden, NJ - the worst crime-infested city in America. couple of wealthy towns near me have already closed their own departments to consolidate with County Sheriff Department due to budget issue.

As you said "most", that's correct but what can we say about the rest of the victims killed by legal gun owners with a clean record who became murderers later in life?

To tell you the truth, I had a deaf friend who owns or owned a gun legally and I usually was afraid of him because of that and God only knows that he might get hot-tempered and kill me with his legally-owned gun.

In other words, people are unpredictable no matter what. Having a gun makes you feel powerful. That's true, right?

 

[Steinhauer]

I was just gonna say, cue up the gun control people. It is crimes like these that polarize that issue, because the gun owner types will insist that if enough people had guns, they could have stopped this.

There is no accounting for this kind of sheer insanity. He could have made a bomb, I guess. He could have poisoned them. It will be a sad holiday season. Lots of toys returned...

Could have made his own flamethrower:

Cologne school massacre - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

But yes, if it wasn't a felony for a teacher to protect her class from a deranged gunman, I am sure some of them would have been armed.

 

[CrazyPaul]

As I read the news about the tragedy repeatedly today, I cried. My 18 yrs old daughter asked why I cried so I told her that it's breaking my heart. She thought that it was funny but I said it was not. I told her if she was one of those dead children, I would go VEERRYY CRAZY. God bless those innocent children and their parents/family/friends.

 

[Chevy57]

All schools should establish the metal detectors for school safety.

School Metal Detectors and School Safety

 

[SneakerNet]

All schools should establish the metal detectors for school safety.

School Metal Detectors and School Safety

Metal Detectors is not going to solve the problem, it's a great target for all the students standing in line going through the metal detectors while shooter outside of the school will start shooting all the students.

I can't remember which school that one guy start shooting all the students and teachers when they all coming out at the end of school day. (I maybe guessing wrong but for some reason it came to my mind recalling it)

 

[whatdidyousay!]

actually - in America... the number of guns outnumbers the number of Americans. and yet... most of massacres occurred at "gun-free" zones.


assault rifle is already illegal. the only way to get it is to buy it from black market... or from ATF agents running Fast and Furious Operation.


in NJ and in probably several states - we have laws on magazine capacity. in NJ, the maximum capacity is 15 rounds.

and firing 2 handguns with 17 rounds each.... my guess? your accuracy rating would be much less than 50%. and you most likely would either get shot or tackled by the time you need to reload both guns. ever tried reloading 2 handguns at same time?

beside.... why are we punishing law-abiding citizens in this scenario? it was a criminal who did the shooting.... not law-abiding citizen. you do realize that it's illegal to kill people? and you do realize that it's illegal to carry weapons on school property? that's why the school was completely defenseless until police officers arrive... 15 minutes later and more officers 30 min later.

since you seem to be on blaming rampage - why don't we blame a high school principal Ms. Hochsprung who buzzed the shooter in? what was Ms. Hochsprung thinking? I mean... a guy wearing a combat gear and armed with a rifle and 2 handguns? what was she thinking???

How about the shooter's mother ,what the HELL was she thinking having 3 guns in the house when she had a mentally ill kid??!! Was Ms. Hochsprung able to to see the guns and the cloths the shooter was wearing? His mother worked as a part time teacher or was a volunteer teacher so Ms. Hochsprung unfortunately may had thought the kid was safe to let in the
school.

 

[MCB]

No-- the principal, asst. principal and sch psych were having a meeting when he broke the window on the door to get in.

 

[whatdidyousay!]

Not all schools have same security measurement.

I know that! I was talking about the school the shooting happen at!

 

[Chevy57]

Metal Detectors is not going to solve the problem, it's a great target for all the students standing in line going through the metal detectors while shooter outside of the school will start shooting all the students.

I can't remember which school that one guy start shooting all the students and teachers when they all coming out at the end of school day. (I maybe guessing wrong but for some reason it came to my mind recalling it)

Lets make sure these congressmen and senators and judges are safe and people have to pass through a metal detector. We need to lock these schools up during school hours and no one gets in without permission.

 

[AdamFencepost]

SneakerNet, you may be thinking of the shooting in Jonesboro, Arkansas.

Two boys took their grandfather's guns: 2 semi-automatic rifles, a bolt-action rifle and 4 handguns. Waiting outside the school, 1 boy pulled the fire alarm. They killed 4 kids and 1 adult.

I am not sure that "Americans have made a choice to take back this country from people with similar opinion of yours." It seems to me that every American is entitled to his or her opinion. We may simply be in a time period when 1 or 2 generations must grow old and die before 1 or another opinion becomes a matter of "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness."

Opinions last awhile. Guns last longer. My father, who will soon be 95, owns a rifle that was made before World War 2. It can and has killed a bull elk. I own a rifle that is even older than his. Both would be antiques in a military sense. Neither will be unusable, not this year nor next.

Considerable confusion seems to happen whenever there is a suggestion of more controls on gun sales. Some folks equate controls of gun sales with black helicopters dropping into yards and the police taking away their guns.

There are laws about guns in every country that isn't a failed state. Comparing laws worldwide is also reason for some to begin tipping over lawn furniture and barricading themselves behind American exceptionalism.

My patriotism is questioned altho' you know nothing more about me than that I question the wisdom of having so many guns in this country and the ease with which they fall into the hands of those who would misuse them. Insulting non-Americans also seems to come easy. Here is one more group that the NRA has insulted in their efforts to limit gun deaths - the Australians.

Of course, these places like Canada and Australia have very limited wide open spaces for using firearms for hunting . . . I'm being sarcastic. But, for all the hunting that may go on in these countries, there is a concern about Unintentional Gun Deaths. Let's take a look at how Australia compares to the US from the University of Sydney:

Nearly 14 times the number of people killed "by accident" here, than there. (I won't bring back "Larry" to try to show 14 Americans versus 1 Australian). Please, you have done such a good job insulting most everyone else - go ahead and make some nasty comments about the Australians. Other countries can be easily compared (& insulted) by using the link.