Children Of Deaf Adults!

[JonRobrt]

Hello everyone,

This past weekend I watched an ASL performance by Keith Wann! Since I am only a first year ASL student I did not understand most of it. However, it appears to me that attaining that level of proficiency would be very difficult for a hearing person aspiring to be an interpretor. Keith is a CODA!

It was also explained how "blunt" most deaf people are/can be regarding their feelings/opinions and I have heard some stories from some of the other students that seem severe. Would you say this is a stereotype or a common trait as perceived by the hearing?? I hate to suggest such a stereotype and hope it does appear to suggest cultural division but, more than one person has explained that 'frankness' is an common thread among the deaf...

Just wondering,
John

 

[JonRobrt]

I guess I should mention that Keith Wann is hearing and during his routine referred to himself as a 'CODA'!!!

John

 

[joshy2328]

Hello everyone,

This past weekend I watched an ASL performance by Keith Wann! Since I am only a first year ASL student I did not understand most of it. However, it appears to me that attaining that level of proficiency would be very difficult for a hearing person aspiring to be an interpretor. Keith is a CODA!

It was also explained how "blunt" most deaf people are/can be regarding their feelings/opinions and I have heard some stories from some of the other students that seem severe. Would you say this is a stereotype or a common trait as perceived by the hearing?? I hate to suggest such a stereotype and hope it does appear to suggest cultural division but, more than one person has explained that 'frankness' is an common thread among the deaf...

Just wondering,
John

Hi my name is Josh and I am a CODA. I am also in my 1st year of NZSL interpreting course.

Although I am from New Zealand, It is my assumption that Deaf communities are the same all over the world, more particular, America (english speaking country) and NZ are very similar as to your mentioned sterotype. It is in my experience that I have also notice a "bluntness."

Deaf people are "straight-up-people" they say what is on their minds. However, the level of bluntness is up to that person. There are variety of different natured Deaf people but if I was you, when in you 1st years, is to be honest and don't be afraid of holding your own.

 

[HoHGuyOhio]

However, it appears to me that attaining that level of proficiency would be very difficult for a hearing person aspiring to be an interpretor. Keith is a CODA!

Difficult? Yes. Impossible? No.

If that's what you want, go for the gold!

 

[joshy2328]

I know several NON-CODAs that are very good, some that are better than CODAS. I think it depends on how hard your willing to work, how much involvement you have with Deaf....stuff like that

 

[Interpretrator]

It was also explained how "blunt" most deaf people are/can be regarding their feelings/opinions and I have heard some stories from some of the other students that seem severe. Would you say this is a stereotype or a common trait as perceived by the hearing??

Neither. It is a well-known aspect of Deaf culture. There's no shame in identifying traits that differentiate American hearing and American Deaf culture. It doesn't mean that every d/Deaf person behaves the same way; it's simply one of the hallmarks of Deaf culture, along with the value placed on information sharing and a collectivist stance.

In fact interpreters are often trained to mediate between a Deaf person who makes a statement that without cultural knowledge could be seen as rude, when the intention was not to be rude. It's tricky.

 

[joshy2328]

I agree,

 

[JonRobrt]

Thanks for the vote of encouragement "HoHGuyOhio" Currently it seems there are not enough hours in the day. If I practice ASL signs...inevitably my teacher will go over numbers and you learn quickly that the learning curve is almost vertical. Keith's performance was incredible from an ASL standpoint.


Interpretrator wrote:

In fact interpreters are often trained to mediate between a Deaf person who makes a statement that without cultural knowledge could be seen as rude, when the intention was not to be rude. It's tricky.
__________________

I know little about this but, was able to observe an interpreter during our first class and noticed (or thought I noticed) how he relayed EVERYTHING that was being said without modification... I guess on some level this is a split second judgment call on changing the contextual meaning based on the interpreters own personal assessment of the setting!!?? However, like I said...I am talking 'out of school' here!


John

 

[robbielyn]

Thanks for the vote of encouragement "HoHGuyOhio" Currently it seems there are not enough hours in the day. If I practice ASL signs...inevitably my teacher will go over numbers and you learn quickly that the learning curve is almost vertical. Keith's performance was incredible from an ASL standpoint.


Interpretrator wrote:



I know little about this but, was able to observe an interpreter during our first class and noticed (or thought I noticed) how he relayed EVERYTHING that was being said without modification... I guess on some level this is a split second judgment call on changing the contextual meaning based on the interpreters own personal assessment of the setting!!?? However, like I said...I am talking 'out of school' here!


John

Yes it's imperative to know the cultures you will be dealing with because everyone has their own and the rules in each culture are not universal. So what may be ok to say in one isn't necessarily ok to say in another and you have to be discerning in this regard and still be faithful to the message it is a real fine line and easy to cross if you don't know the different cultures you will be dealing with. That is why preperation is so important before you go to an assignment so you can fascilitate accurate communication and at the same time respecting the rules of both cultures. But sometimes a deaf person may mean to be rude therefore you can't change it to match what you think it should be but you have to render the message faithfully and that can be hard but must be followed no matter how you feel.

 

[shel90]

Neither. It is a well-known aspect of Deaf culture. There's no shame in identifying traits that differentiate American hearing and American Deaf culture. It doesn't mean that every d/Deaf person behaves the same way; it's simply one of the hallmarks of Deaf culture, along with the value placed on information sharing and a collectivist stance.

In fact interpreters are often trained to mediate between a Deaf person who makes a statement that without cultural knowledge could be seen as rude, when the intention was not to be rude. It's tricky.

That was a big adjustment for me when I was first exposed to Deaf culture...the bluntness. I still cant do it!

 

[fredfam1]

I think cultural misunderstandings occur in all languages. We had a young
woman from Germany staying with us. Her family attends the same denomination Church over there as ours does here. My husband and I have both been missionaries and we have both been in the military so we have
an awareness of "cultural differences". However we are still snickering at
the reactions this young woman created in in our Church with her liberal
use of explicatives. Particularly the four letter one that begins with the letter F. Apparently where she comes from it would be the equivalent of us saying, "shoot, or darn". Some of the Blue Hairs are still picking their dentures up off the floor.
chuckle

 

[Info Officer]

Straight talkers

Neither. It is a well-known aspect of Deaf culture. There's no shame in identifying traits that differentiate American hearing and American Deaf culture. It doesn't mean that every d/Deaf person behaves the same way; it's simply one of the hallmarks of Deaf culture, along with the value placed on information sharing and a collectivist stance.

Yes, directness is a cultural phenomenon... and not only in Deaf communities. In fact, just about every culture that does not trace its roots back to England seems to be more direct than those that do! At least, that was my experience when travelling.

Of course, it happens for different reasons. When you are communicating with a visual language, it makes no sense at all to say "two people were sleeping together" (zzzzzzzz), when in fact they were having sex (not zzzzzzzzz )

In fact, more than just a part of the culture, it is a very *valued* part of communication. One of the reasons hearing people get criticised in Australia when they are signing is when they "talk around in circles".

 

[Info Officer]

Neither. It is a well-known aspect of Deaf culture. There's no shame in identifying traits that differentiate American hearing and American Deaf culture. It doesn't mean that every d/Deaf person behaves the same way; it's simply one of the hallmarks of Deaf culture, along with the value placed on information sharing and a collectivist stance.

Having just posted on this, I saw a fantastic (and humerous) VLog on this precise subject by the Coda Brothers ... check it out...

 

[Interpretrator]

I know little about this but, was able to observe an interpreter during our first class and noticed (or thought I noticed) how he relayed EVERYTHING that was being said without modification...

Not all situations require cultural mediation. School classes, especially relatively straightforward ones like language or math, largely do not.

I guess on some level this is a split second judgment call on changing the contextual meaning based on the interpreters own personal assessment of the setting!!??

First of all interpreters do not (usually, on purpose,) change meaning. They take a message from one language, deconstruct it to its meaning, and express that meaning in another language. Usually that entails changing grammatical features; sometimes it also means changing the words so that the intended meaning is expressed.

Deaf person: "I haven't seen you in so long, you got so fat!"

If the Deaf person's intention is simply to express amazement at how long it's been since they saw each other, a possible English interpretation: "I haven't seen you in so long, you look so different from last time."

The interpreter has to judge the situation and the participants for every encounter to determine how to interpret things like this. You may call it her "own personal assessment" but that assessment includes information from schooling, the Deaf community, experience, etc. A good interpreter doesn't just randomly change words around. Also, just because from what you saw in your class the interpreter conveyed everything "exactly" doesn't make her a good or bad interpreter.

 

[Tousi]

Dare I say the degree "frankness, bluntness", etc is directly related to the linguistic sophistication of individual deaf persons? Like Interpretator said, not all deaf people are this way and I notice that some of the more sophisticated deaf folks are in their second language, English, the degree of this "bluntness, etc" goes down. Too, I have seen those same "sophisticates" reserve this "bluntness" to utilize within the deaf community.

 

[Interpretrator]

Dare I say the degree "frankness, bluntness", etc is directly related to the linguistic sophistication of individual deaf persons? Like Interpretator said, not all deaf people are this way and I notice that some of the more sophisticated deaf folks are in their second language, English, the degree of this "bluntness, etc" goes down.

My guess is based on what you observe it has more to do with the people being affected by the culture of their second language, i.e. American hearing culture. There is a "third culture" which is often learned by interpreters who have to mediate between cultures, and it might also occur with deaf ASL users who also occupy a place in hearing culture with their knowledge of English.

My point is I don't believe it has to do with "sophistication" in a language but more like the inevitable influence that the culture of a second language has on the person who learns it.

 

[Tousi]

So you don't think that those deaf folks bereft of the command of English, a second language for them.....make for more "blunt" people? In anyone else, wouldn't it be called acting rude?

 

[Kaitin]

I don't think "blunt" is the correct word really. "Direct" maybe. In ASL you use movement and facial expression to say so much. So you can be gentle or angry with same signs but different emphasis, manner, face etc. No need to use different signs and probably no different signs exist really.

Speech and writing is different. Writing has so many ways to say the same thing, even the same emotion too. You add so many little words for the polite way of writing. The same words can't mean a different emotion. Speech also adds all the little words to make polite. And speech has tone and inflection with movement and facial expression. But many hearing people don't think about facial expression so much - watch hearing learn ASL and sign "I am happy" with a :| or . Hearing people like these aren't stupid - just different. So deaf/HoH not using all the little words in writing or speech to explain or make more gentle aren't "blunt" - just different. Maybe hearing are more sensitive about "blunt" in speech and writing and deaf/HoH are more sensitive about "blunt" in facial expression and movement.

ASL is a different language so different standards and thinking.

I don't think I make much sense. I tried. :P

Edit: My roommate read the thread and said hearing are too sensitive. But she is blunt hearing.

 

[Silentwolfdog]

I think it is bluntness not direct. Because deaf people would comment on how other person look without think of how he would feel.

"Why didn't you go to doctor to get your face fixed?" "Wow, you are so fat!" "She looks like she is pregnant." (another word for woman being fat) "Are you pregnant?"

Bluntness is one of my least favorite trait of deaf culture. I am trying to get rid of that. It's hard...lol. Being in hearing culture does help a lot. You become more sensitive to how other people feels.

 

[Interpretrator]

So you don't think that those deaf folks bereft of the command of English, a second language for them.....make for more "blunt" people? In anyone else, wouldn't it be called acting rude?

Again, you are saying it is the language itself causing the behavior. I am saying people whose first language is ASL and who move mostly in ASL-using circles and identify as Deaf exhibit the features of Deaf culture, one of which is "straight talk" as Mindess calls it (and explains it well).

Language and culture are inextricable. People who identify with either Deaf culture or even just ASL (because the language itself is geared towards straight talk) will come across as "rude" to people who aren't aware there is a cultural difference. Same with Mindess' example of Israelis, who are often seen as rude by Americans because there are a lot of cultural differences.

To people who are aware of the difference in culture, Deaf people don't seem rude, they seem perfectly appropriate. Unless they really ARE being rude! (I'm serious, that was a lesson I had to learn early on before I was really comfortable with Deaf culture.)