Change.org petition for CI coverage

[Frisky Feline]

its time to change for better. Such as the small town need to be aware more about the Deaf culture, Deaf community and Deaf events. Like I met a hearing guy who lives in a very small town and country and he s from west Virginia. He first time met me at the training classes years ago. He said to me, I mean he wore a plaid shirt and jean and tan boots. His first react to Deaf person like me and he said he is so happy to meet and learn so much from me. He did educate his collogues about me and always asked me for some tips. Then he ended up met more deaf people where he works. He said, "ohh ASL is much easier for Deaf people as he can see that."

don't be afraid of "change"

 

[ambrosia]

well well, its Shel90's opinion, and she CAN say it is society's view of deafness.

There ARE such thing as social impact, as much as you might find hearing society may find you abit different that's because they are conditioned to 'see a hearing person's behaviour' and they dont get it from you, so they -hearing people DO see you as different, as a deaf person. I have seen a number of times that you shared stories of how you dont like hearinf people assuming certain things about you...it is exactly the same of reaction hearing people have about CI...try askingo a stranger hearig person or people (plural if you dare) what they know (or think they know) about deaf people or Deaf people, you'd be suprised, that much of it comes from popular views...and you'd soon suspect its from the media, and you're right...its from the media, and what do the media 'represent'? == of course its gong to be 'society's view'

this sort of variation that we have amongst ourselves as the deaf community makes it very awkward, and even it become a ground of contestation.....however overall...society DO sees 'all deaf people CI, signing. HA-oral, latened, sudden at teens gone deafs...converted from oral to sign (and other way around?)...all get under that one 'view' that a ONE hearing person is going to hold a view of 'deafness' and that will vary too...BUT overall..Hearing society DO consider deaf as somewhat inferior, ..that bit isnt going to change much, unless deaf people become more active in changing society view of it..how? influence and media and new knowledge..and awareness...

to recap a tiny bit...you any strange hearing people, you'd see the awareness of deafness is rather outdated and mean...so there . AND you'd see they might even say 'oh that space age hearing aid, the one with an operation i heard it can make you hear again, technology is incredible these days, look at this mobile phone i have...it does everything except making me a coffee"

that is soceity's view

Sure she can have her own opinion on society's view of being deaf, but he wasn't speaking for society he was speaking about his own feelings of becoming suddenly deaf.

I can have my own opinion too......and here it is. I think many many deaf are defensive about deafness, they developed insecurities about it and project those feelings onto hearing society. Attributing opinions and motivations to hearing people that they don't actually have, the deaf just think they think that, because they feel insecure about it.

Let's see if you can play devils advocate, see something from someone else's view, I'm very annoying about doing that. I don't let others opinions sway me, I play devils advocate a lot, and develop my opinions by thinking about things from all sides. Granted it's especially easy for me to do this with hearing vs deaf, because I have been both.

Anyway let's use Frisky's case as an example. She has ocular rosacea, it's irritating, but not fatal. If left untreated it could cause loss of vision. Being blind won't kill her. I bet you think she should keep up the treatments, so she doesn't go blind. You value your sight right, and feel compassion and concern for anyone who might be or become blind. How do you think the blind feel about your feeling of making sure she doesn't go blind? Should they be insulted? That you put so much value on sight? That they must be broken and if they could be fixed they should do that because it's sooooo much better to see than not see? They've been living their whole life blind, and they're fine, why is it so important one sees?

You see where I'm going with this? I bet you don't think any of those things, but they might think you do because they'd be being defensive and insecure, projecting those feelings onto you.

And yes, I'm audist, I'm totally audist and I don't think there's anything wrong with that either. But of course I am, I grew up hearing, of course I place a lot of value on it, I miss it. The deaf might not miss it, but they're still missing sounds, whether they miss it or not. I don't like the idea of anyone missing those things, and neither do the "hearies".

 

[KarissaMann05]

Sure she can have her own opinion on society's view of being deaf, but he wasn't speaking for society he was speaking about his own feelings of becoming suddenly deaf.

I can have my own opinion too......and here it is. I think many many deaf are defensive about deafness, they developed insecurities about it and project those feelings onto hearing society. Attributing opinions and motivations to hearing people that they don't actually have, the deaf just think they think that, because they feel insecure about it.

Let's see if you can play devils advocate, see something from someone else's view, I'm very annoying about doing that. I don't let others opinions sway me, I play devils advocate a lot, and develop my opinions by thinking about things from all sides. Granted it's especially easy for me to do this with hearing vs deaf, because I have been both.

Anyway let's use Frisky's case as an example. She has ocular rosacea, it's irritating, but not fatal. If left untreated it could cause loss of vision. Being blind won't kill her. I bet you think she should keep up the treatments, so she doesn't go blind. You value your sight right, and feel compassion and concern for anyone who might be or become blind. How do you think the blind feel about your feeling of making sure she doesn't go blind? Should they be insulted? That you put so much value on sight? That they must be broken and if they could be fixed they should do that because it's sooooo much better to see than not see? They've been living their whole life blind, and they're fine, why is it so important one sees?

You see where I'm going with this? I bet you don't think any of those things, but they might think you do because they'd be being defensive and insecure, projecting those feelings onto you.

And yes, I'm audist, I'm totally audist and I don't think there's anything wrong with that either. But of course I am, I grew up hearing, of course I place a lot of value on it, I miss it. The deaf might not miss it, but they're still missing sounds, whether they miss it or not. I don't like the idea of anyone missing those things, and neither do the "hearies".

Then you would support ASL and sign langauges are being abolished as well... all after you claim you're an audist...

 

[ambrosia]

Then you would support ASL and sign langauges are being abolished as well... all after you claim you're an audist...

No, I believe the deaf need sign, especially the children. you guys accuse everyone that values hearing, that feeling being able to hear us a better situation than not being able to hear, as being audist.

 

[KarissaMann05]

No, I believe the deaf need sign, especially the children. you guys accuse everyone that values hearing, that feeling being able to hear us a better situation than not being able to hear, as being audist.

No. It's pretty clear that it's me, not general AD'ers, who "accuse" everyone that values hearing. But, I am not accused you of anything. I pointed out that if you're an audist, then you would have no problem with against sign langauges and signers, and don't mind paternealism(sp?), phonocentrism, and (sub-)cultural oppression. If the definition doesn't fit you, then why call yourself "audist"?

 

[ambrosia]

No. It's pretty clear that it's me, not general AD'ers, who "accuse" everyone that values hearing. But, I am not accused you of anything. I pointed out that if you're an audist, then you would have no problem with against sign langauges and signers, and don't mind paternealism(sp?), phonocentrism, and (sub-)cultural oppression. If the definition doesn't fit you, then why call yourself "audist"?

Because that word gets thrown around a lot on here, and apparently not everyone really knows what it means. I have been accused a few times of audist thinking, and we weren't even talking about sign language.

 

[deafdyke]

. Granted it's especially easy for me to do this with hearing vs deaf, because I have been both.

Anyway let's use Frisky's case as an example. She has ocular rosacea, it's irritating, but not fatal. If left untreated it could cause loss of vision. Being blind won't kill her. I bet you think she should keep up the treatments, so she doesn't go blind. You value your sight right, and feel compassion and concern for anyone who might be or become blind. How do you think the blind feel about your feeling of making sure she doesn't go blind? Should they be insulted? That you put so much value on sight? That they must be broken and if they could be fixed they should do that because it's sooooo much better to see than not see? They've been living their whole life blind, and they're fine, why is it so important one sees?



And yes, I'm audist, I'm totally audist and I don't think there's anything wrong with that either. But of course I am, I grew up hearing, of course I place a lot of value on it, I miss it. The deaf might not miss it, but they're still missing sounds, whether they miss it or not. I don't like the idea of anyone missing those things, and neither do the "hearies".

Well bear in mind you're late deafend, and you didn't experiance growing up dhh. Of course you miss it..And of course you're approaching this from a formerlly hearing person...but for US it's normal....We don't consider outselves "hearing impaired" it's like.............male vs female or black vs white. Your comparision of blind vs dhh is wrong, b/c after all you're approaching it from a formerlly sighted persective.
Actually only a VERY small percentage of blind/low vision folks are blind from birth.....Even less are "just blind" Most blind/low vison as kids people are multihandicapped...and many are severely multi (due to premature birth or drug exposure) The stereotype of a little boy in short pants with a white cane learning Braille is obsolete.

 

[Grummer]

There are two concepts to highlight, audism and disablism. As aformentated earlier in this thread (or another?) the concept ‘disablism’ is used to explain why it is society that does the oppressing.
I have copied and pasted two extracts from my work; I hope this explains as does I hope this would settle the heat in this thread.
Grum.
Audism - In 1975, during the period of flourishing radical social concepts, Tom Humphries was working on his doctoral thesis. Humphries was compelled to fill the void and to describe this oppressive phenomenon based upon the mode of communication, used for over nine decades, alienating deaf people.
He coined the term audism, to refer to the notion “that one is superior based on one’s ability to hear or behave in the manner of one who hears” (Humphries, 1975, p.2). Audism was forged from joining Latin audire, and –ism together, respectively, to hear, or to listen, and as a system of practice, behaviour, belief, or attitude. As Humphries observed ” It appears in the class structure of the deaf culture when those at the top are those whose language is that of the hearing culture or closest to it. It appears when deaf people in positions of power keep that power by oppressing other deaf people” ( 1975, p2).
Disablism - This includes d/Deaf people who consider disability to be something we 'own' as a problem, which doesn’t belong to anyone else but ourselves. Put another way, it is not [d/Deaf] disabled people who need examining but able-bodied society; it is not a case of educating [deaf and hearing people] disabled and able-bodied people for integration, but of fighting institutional disablism; it is not disability relations which should be the field for study but disablism.

 

[Frisky Feline]

How do you know if I were not born Deaf and happen to have an ocular rosacea. will I have the same opinion as if I were Deaf?

 

[ambrosia]

Well bear in mind you're late deafend, and you didn't experiance growing up dhh. Of course you miss it..And of course you're approaching this from a formerlly hearing person...but for US it's normal....We don't consider outselves "hearing impaired" it's like.............male vs female or black vs white. Your comparision of blind vs dhh is wrong, b/c after all you're approaching it from a formerlly sighted persective.
Actually only a VERY small percentage of blind/low vision folks are blind from birth.....Even less are "just blind" Most blind/low vison as kids people are multihandicapped...and many are severely multi (due to premature birth or drug exposure) The stereotype of a little boy in short pants with a white cane learning Braille is obsolete.

Way to go missing the point. good job

edited to add....and for someone who is forever comparing being deaf to being gay to say that I can't compare being deaf to being blind?? That's freaking hysterical, really.

 

[ambrosia]

There are two concepts to highlight, audism and disablism. As aformentated earlier in this thread (or another?) the concept ‘disablism’ is used to explain why it is society that does the oppressing.
I have copied and pasted two extracts from my work; I hope this explains as does I hope this would settle the heat in this thread.
Grum.
Audism - In 1975, during the period of flourishing radical social concepts, Tom Humphries was working on his doctoral thesis. Humphries was compelled to fill the void and to describe this oppressive phenomenon based upon the mode of communication, used for over nine decades, alienating deaf people.
He coined the term audism, to refer to the notion “that one is superior based on one’s ability to hear or behave in the manner of one who hears” (Humphries, 1975, p.2). Audism was forged from joining Latin audire, and –ism together, respectively, to hear, or to listen, and as a system of practice, behaviour, belief, or attitude. As Humphries observed ” It appears in the class structure of the deaf culture when those at the top are those whose language is that of the hearing culture or closest to it. It appears when deaf people in positions of power keep that power by oppressing other deaf people” ( 1975, p2).
Disablism - This includes d/Deaf people who consider disability to be something we 'own' as a problem, which doesn’t belong to anyone else but ourselves. Put another way, it is not [d/Deaf] disabled people who need examining but able-bodied society; it is not a case of educating [deaf and hearing people] disabled and able-bodied people for integration, but of fighting institutional disablism; it is not disability relations which should be the field for study but disablism.

So let me ask you a very simple question. Do you think being able to see, is better than not being able to see?

 

[green427]

 

[Frisky Feline]

 

[ambrosia]

But to address something you mentioned earlier Grummer....no I have never had anyone assume things about me because of my hearing loss. I've had people assume I'm a snob, because I "ignored" them when they were saying goodbye/hello, or that I'm dumb because I didn't understand what they said, or misunderstood sound didn't answer the question properly....BUT that was before they knew I had hearing loss. I don't wear a sign "Hi, my name is Amber and I'm pretty stinking deaf". Once they find out that I did what did, said what I said, is because I'm deaf, they generally feel like a right and proper jackass.

 

[shel90]

You had different results than I did from taking a class!

There are a few differences including date and location.

I took beginning sign at my local community college as an evening class twice in the mid 1980s. Neither time did I make any contacts to continue actually using it.

I get the impression that even when you took the courses you were in an urban area. I was, and still am, in a small community in Southern Illinois. It has been years since I am seen anyone signing when out shopping or such. Seeing it used has always been rare to non-existent.

But at least you tried. Some people don't and then they tell general society that the CI will solve all their problems with deafness and then society gets the idea that CIs is a "cure" or will improve all deaf people's lives when it is not true.

 

[green427]

All I am going to say is:

When we are surrounded by others like us, we feel like an equal. When we are surrounded by others that are not like us, we feel inadequate and will want to be included, and will find ways to be included.

Late-deafened adults have it much worse than those of us that have learned to adapt.

It is easy for us to tell others to learn ASL, when in reality, it is not easy to do. Why learn ASL if no one around you is going to learn for your sake? No one in my circle of friends & family cared to learn for my sake. It wasn't until I entered the deaf world at 18 before I was able to use it. Late deafened adults do not always have the option to uproot their lives and move to another lifestyle, so they need to adapt....which is the hardest part.

As for insurance companies denying coverage....it all is a crock of political shit.

 

[shel90]

All I am going to say is:

When we are surrounded by others like us, we feel like an equal. When we are surrounded by others that are not like us, we feel inadequate and will want to be included, and will find ways to be included.

Late-deafened adults have it much worse than those of us that have learned to adapt.

It is easy for us to tell others to learn ASL, when in reality, it is not easy to do. Why learn ASL if no one around you is going to learn for your sake? No one in my circle of friends & family cared to learn for my sake. It wasn't until I entered the deaf world at 18 before I was able to use it. Late deafened adults do not always have the option to uproot their lives and move to another lifestyle, so they need to adapt....which is the hardest part.

As for insurance companies denying coverage....it all is a crock of political shit.

No, it is not easy to do. It wasn't for me but that person who commented on that website really made it sound like being deaf is like being doomed to a life of not being independent and of misery forever. That is how society views deafness no matter how much the Deaf community tried to educate society that it doesn't have to be that way. People are so stuck in the "hearing" box that they don't look outside of it and give it a try.

Just my 2 cents of the impression I get from society and some people here on aD.

 

[HOH-ME]

Can use Video Relay. When I learned ASL, I didn't know anyone. I took the classes as a foreign requirement for my BA degree. Once I started learning, I started finding others who were fluent in ASL even hearing people! All a person has to do is take that first step....instead of saying "I don't know anyone who uses it"..just give it a try and who knows..u could meet a whole community of ASL users, deaf and hearing both. I was amazed by how many people I have met in the Deaf community since 1995. Before that, I only knew a few because of my brother and I never saw anyone using ASL out there.

No one in my family signs, none of my friends sign, none of my co-workers sign...should I just find all new friends and family then....maybe a new job too?

 

[Bottesini]

No one in my family signs, none of my friends sign, none of my co-workers sign...should I just find all new friends and family then....maybe a new job too?

Yes you should.Or at least if you are deaf and no one accomodates you.

HOH is a different matter... Which one are you? You still easily communicate with the hearing segments of your life.?

 

[shel90]

No one in my family signs, none of my friends sign, none of my co-workers sign...should I just find all new friends and family then....maybe a new job too?

Nobody in my family, except for my deaf brother, signs. I didn't find a new family. *shrug*

However, I found new friends....those who could sign and I interact with them often. I am still friends with my non-signing friends but they are a part of my old life.

My point is people who gives society the impression that CIs are the only answer are spreading misinformation.