Censorship

...How was it like living through it?

Did people do the "blackout curtains" - I think that's the name for pretending no one was home - stuff? Terminology came from WW2 I think.
That's WWII, not Cold War. As a Baby Boomer, I remember air raid sirens being tested, home bomb shelters for sale, and places that were designated as public bomb shelters. When I was teenager, I worked at a movie theater (the old kind that long ago did double duty as a vaudeville stage, with dressing rooms in the back). It was a designated bomb shelter. In the storage rooms behind the stage we kept bottled water and other supplies.

I remember the Cuban Missile Crisis. It was a tense time. My dad, an electrical engineer for Lockheed and working for the government, had to go to Cuba for a couple weeks after the crisis. We weren't allowed to tell anyone where he went, and he never told us what he did there. I still have his Geneva Convention ID card from that time. He was a civilian but it said if he was captured he was to be treated as a commissioned officer. :eek3:

During the mid to late 60's, I lived in southeastern Connecticut, between the Submarine Base and NYC. We assumed that when the missiles came, we would be one of the first targets, or at least get the fallout.

When the whole Eastern seaboard had a blackout in 1965, there was some paranoia. The power went out at our house, no big deal. Then, we noticed the whole street was out. On our transistor radio we heard that the whole city was out. Then, the whole state, then all New England. Then, New York. Finally, parts of Canada blacked out. Whoa! We didn't know if it was aliens from space, commie sabotage, or what! It was kind of scary. I was 14 years old.


Do you think the government should've censored it to prevent all that outbreak from happening or was it worth it to have?
It depends on what you mean by "it." The government should let people know if there's a threat or dangerous situation but it doesn't need to give out every technical detail.
 
Ok, only because it's not been brought up a few times, but I have to mention the page on 9/11 that's on that site.
The World Trade Center Demolition and the So-Called War on Terrorism
Obviously this is way more "conspiracy-theory"-ish than I would like, but it does actually cover a lot of important information. Especially parts 2-6. For any hearing people on here, I would recommend watching "9/11 Loose Change", the 2nd edition, you can just youtube, or google video the title. (I haven't found a captioned version anywhere). But for those who can't, if you read these pages and try to ignore the heavy, heavy conspiracy tones, it is actually worth reading.

It amazes me how many people are still hugely misinformed about the events of that day.

Censorship like that scares me. The fact that the government refuses to address any of the lingering questions and issues about what is probably one of the biggest things that will happen in this country (at least in my lifetime), is definitely scary.
 
Ok, only because it's not been brought up a few times, but I have to mention the page on 9/11 that's on that site.
The World Trade Center Demolition and the So-Called War on Terrorism
Obviously this is way more "conspiracy-theory"-ish than I would like, but it does actually cover a lot of important information. Especially parts 2-6. For any hearing people on here, I would recommend watching "9/11 Loose Change", the 2nd edition, you can just youtube, or google video the title. (I haven't found a captioned version anywhere). But for those who can't, if you read these pages and try to ignore the heavy, heavy conspiracy tones, it is actually worth reading.

It amazes me how many people are still hugely misinformed about the events of that day.

Censorship like that scares me. The fact that the government refuses to address any of the lingering questions and issues about what is probably one of the biggest things that will happen in this country (at least in my lifetime), is definitely scary.

the reason why the government refuses to address any of the lingering questions and issues is because they have no conclusive answer. It's best to answer everything with surety - evidence, testimonies, etc. That takes decades. They are not covering it up. They are just doing their job and they will tell you.... eventually. It's impossible to give you regular updates on weekly basis without compromising the classified ops/investigation to unravel it.

Police investigation does exactly same thing. Look at what happened to high profile cases like Jon Benet and OJ Simpson. Now you know why those cases got messed up and murderers got away. If you want answers to 9/11, then stfu and sit tight. let them do their job.
 
the reason why the government refuses to address any of the lingering questions and issues is because they have no conclusive answer. It's best to answer everything with surety - evidence, testimonies, etc. That takes decades. They are not covering it up. They are just doing their job and they will tell you.... eventually. It's impossible to give you regular updates on weekly basis without compromising the classified ops/investigation to unravel it.

Police investigation does same thing.

I'm not sure we're talking about the same things.
 
I'm not sure we're talking about the same things.

whoops! you missed my last-minute edit

Police investigation does exactly same thing. Look at what happened to high profile cases like Jon Benet and OJ Simpson. Now you know why those cases got messed up and murderers got away. If you want answers to 9/11, then stfu and sit tight. let them do their job.

We are talking about same thing. My comment is directly in response to your last paragraph.
 
Right, but the thing is, that they are covering up a lot of things, and that the "concrete" reports that they have presented are so ridiculous, but they refuse to admit it, or comment on any of it. You can give a plausible explanation for things while you continue an investigation, without having to reveal all the information you have. Fine. But almost every bit of information that the government has released about 9/11 has been shown to be blatantly false.

Both the fact that they are able to do that, and the fact that the majority of our country doesn't seem to have any idea scare me.
 
Censorship I must admit is a foreign concept for me because I live in Canada and we very rarely censor.

I know this doesn't relate to the topic, on TV, I see vulgar language all the time. "F*ck!" is on TV all the time however it cannot be shown from 6 am to 9 pm.

There's softcore & gay porn that is shown on TV and it's part of the public broadcasting channels. It's known as "Kink" but the K is backwards.

In one instance the Canadian government did have to step in and do total censorship of the CRTC, newspapers and broadcasting. It was during the Homolka- Bernardo case as there were gruesome details about the case the lawyers did not want the public to know until they selected all the potential jurors.

Canadians simply went across the border to get all the information. Anyone who brought any related materials from USA to Canada would be arrested.

This is why censorship is pretty foreign to me.


Yes, it's same here in Germany as well.
 
I'm not bashing the topic of censorship, I realize and recognize that it is controversial, but I have to get the point across that the author is very biased, if you read the quotes I pasted. If anything, from what he said about his "about me" is enough for me to put the 'book down' and stop reading, or press that X.

To me, I don't see anything that the author is biased. It's nothing wrong that the author express their view from what he see...

I see the same thing as the author as well...

Example of 3 years old thread - The people including myself from different countries know more about US issues than Americans...

http://www.alldeaf.com/war-politica...-woman-i-am-boycotting-sundays-elections.html

I do not intend to offend you with my post but let you know that I know what I am saying from saw/read about US polities...


 


some ADers deny US censorship...

US government steps up press censorship

US government steps up press censorship

Bush’s war at home: government censorship, secrecy, and lies

Bush’s war at home: government censorship, secrecy, and lies
The source for those two links is "World Socialist Web Site"; I'm sure their opinion is unbiased. Not.

The censorship referred to was about publicly showing war zones, and FBI surveillance. It wasn't about restricting any Americans from stating their opinions about the war.

Also, they were written in 2001. The war with Iraq didn't begin until 2003. I thought your complaints were about the war with Iraq?


That is about war zone reporting. If you notice, "After the fighting ended, many journalists continued to criticize the Pentagon's press rules." That proves that the US doesn't censor people's opinions or ability to publish them. In our country, even during war time, journalists are allowed to publicly criticize the Pentagon. :)


ACLU? Another biased source.

He's denied access into our country but no one is denied access to his books and writings.

Here's the other side of the story:

Why Revoke Tariq Ramadan's U.S. Visa? :: Daniel Pipes

Terror Finance Expert Exposes New Information about Tariq Ramadan’s Links to Terrorism


Those are Iraqi journalists in the war zone under military control. Under those conditions, the military have to be careful about Iraqi journalists who still associate with Iraqis who still plan and fight against Americans. It's a matter of safety over there. And yet, the journalists still get their critical stories out, don't they? If they didn't, you wouldn't even find that link.


A list of disjointed rantings by:

"Indymedia

The Independent Media Center is a network of collectively run media outlets for the creation of radical, accurate, and passionate tellings of the truth. We work out of a love and inspiration for people who continue to work for a better world, despite corporate media's distortions and unwillingness to cover the efforts to free humanity...

The Independent Media Center (www.indymedia.org), was established by various independent and alternative media organizations and activists in 1999 for the purpose of providing grassroots coverage of the World Trade Organization (WTO) protests in Seattle...."

Totally biased website.
 
... The people including myself from different countries know more about US issues than Americans....
No. People from other countries don't know "more about US issues than Americans." They just prefer to believe their own viewpoints and seek out websites that seem to support them. Also, they enjoy bragging about how much more they think they know than Americans, and how much more superior their viewpoints are.
 
... But almost every bit of information that the government has released about 9/11 has been shown to be blatantly false.
Not so.

Both the fact that they are able to do that, and the fact that the majority of our country doesn't seem to have any idea scare me.
Oh, "the majority of our country" is fully aware of conspiracy websites and viewpoints. We just don't believe them.
 
Oh, "the majority of our country" is fully aware of conspiracy websites and viewpoints. We just don't believe them.

That's why my life is simpler and less stressful. I don't waste my time by filling my head with rumors and conspiracy theories. If the truth was revealed later that it was our government-backed attack on WTC... oh well that's f**ked up.
 
That's why my life is simpler and less stressful. I don't waste my time by filling my head with rumors and conspiracy theories. If the truth revealed later that it was our government-backed attack on WTC... oh well that's f**ked up.

same here.
 
Not so.


Oh, "the majority of our country" is fully aware of conspiracy websites and viewpoints. We just don't believe them.

I don't see how you can automatically say that these things aren't false without even asking what I'm talking about. I didn't say everything, I said almost, and the sad thing is, that's pretty accurate. I can think of very few things that the government has reported about 9/11 that actually match the events and results. But I can think of a lot that don't.

If that doesn't bother you, that's your choice. I never said the government was responsible for 9/11, or that they planned anything. I'm just saying that if you take a step back, and actually look at some of the facts, they don't match up. The information that the government has officially presented just can't be factually correct, and yet nothing is being done about it. Personally, that bothers me. Doesn't have to bother other people, but since the thread is about government censorship, that's one of the ones that scares me, big time.
 
That's why my life is simpler and less stressful. I don't waste my time by filling my head with rumors and conspiracy theories. If the truth was revealed later that it was our government-backed attack on WTC... oh well that's f**ked up.

See, I don't consider it a waste of my time, and I try to stay away from rumors and conspiracy theories also. What I do like is knowledge. As a scientist, there are just certain things that I know are facts. Like: I know for a fact that jet fuel cannot melt steel. So when things that I'm being told don't match the things I know, I want to know more about that situation. I don't take the things I read or hear about 9/11 just at face value, no matter the source. But there's definitely a lot of conflicting events and stories surrounding it, and that interests (and kind of scares) me.
 
See, I don't consider it a waste of my time, and I try to stay away from rumors and conspiracy theories also. What I do like is knowledge. As a scientist, there are just certain things that I know are facts. Like: I know for a fact that jet fuel cannot melt steel. So when things that I'm being told don't match the things I know, I want to know more about that situation. I don't take the things I read or hear about 9/11 just at face value, no matter the source. But there's definitely a lot of conflicting events and stories surrounding it, and that interests (and kind of scares) me.

yes jet fuel alone cannot melt steel but it happened inside the building.... an incubator-like environment. incubator + jet fuel + other combustive material = a recipe to worst nightmare disaster. the plane was wedged in middle of the floor.

I find it really puzzling that WTC collapsed in a "controlled-like" manner like a demolition. oh well...... :dunno:
 
yes jet fuel alone cannot melt steel but it happened inside the building.... an incubator-like environment. incubator + jet fuel + other combustive material = a recipe to worst nightmare disaster. the plane was wedged in middle of the floor.

I find it really puzzling that WTC collapsed in a "controlled-like" manner like a demolition. oh well...... :dunno:

See, this is why I think that it's important to be informed. The way that you're thinking of an "incubator" isn't actually how this would work. If you take a fire, and "incubate" it, that would actually mean that you cut off its oxygen supply, which would make it burn less hot. Also, I can't imagine what would be inside the buildings that you think would burn so hot. I mean, think about it, if you wanted to cook something, would you put it over a burning piece of paper? Or propane? Because that's essentially what you're talking about, and you'd have to say that propane would burn hotter. But this is not a close difference that we're talking about. Steel melts at around 2800ºF, jet fuel burns at around 1500 max, not to mention lower when it can't get enough oxygen.

As far as the way that they fell, that's possibly the biggest thing that bothers me that nobody seems to talk about. I mean, when a crew of trained engineers can bring down much smaller buildings with weeks/months of planning, it's considered "news-worthy" when everything goes right. But, two buildings get hit by planes, both collapse completely in on themselves within minutes of each other, a third building that wasn't hit by anything (WTC 7), is the only other building to collapse, despite the fact that it wasn't the closest building to either of the towers, and nothing seems weird about that?

If you're interested in reading more, this site seems to be much more complete, and not as conspiracy-theory-ish as the last one.
9-11 Research: An Independent Investigation of the 9-11-2001 Attack
 
See, this is why I think that it's important to be informed. The way that you're thinking of an "incubator" isn't actually how this would work. If you take a fire, and "incubate" it, that would actually mean that you cut off its oxygen supply, which would make it burn less hot. Also, I can't imagine what would be inside the buildings that you think would burn so hot. I mean, think about it, if you wanted to cook something, would you put it over a burning piece of paper? Or propane? Because that's essentially what you're talking about, and you'd have to say that propane would burn hotter. But this is not a close difference that we're talking about. Steel melts at around 2800ºF, jet fuel burns at around 1500 max, not to mention lower when it can't get enough oxygen.
Just look at burning building. that's why firemen break windows and try to make a hole in ceiling if possible because it burns hotter in closed environment (a paradox) than open air. By going with you just said - well then what about brick-oven stove for stove? or cremation? or pottery?

As far as the way that they fell, that's possibly the biggest thing that bothers me that nobody seems to talk about. I mean, when a crew of trained engineers can bring down much smaller buildings with weeks/months of planning, it's considered "news-worthy" when everything goes right. But, two buildings get hit by planes, both collapse completely in on themselves within minutes of each other, a third building that wasn't hit by anything (WTC 7), is the only other building to collapse, despite the fact that it wasn't the closest building to either of the towers, and nothing seems weird about that?

If you're interested in reading more, this site seems to be much more complete, and not as conspiracy-theory-ish as the last one.
9-11 Research: An Independent Investigation of the 9-11-2001 Attack
nobody talks because it causes fear and confusion. It's better to let government & investigators to get the bottom line of this. It'll takes years. Look at Nazi history. few decades later... the secret is still unraveling. it's simply better this way for political reason and for public's sake.
 
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