Turkey shoots down Russian fighter plane

[caz]

All international pilots are supposed to know the common flight terms in English.

No one can expect the other pilots and controllers to know every language. Maybe the Turkish controllers don't know Russian.

Pilots who don't know English are restricted to flying in airspace in their own language areas.

Think that to airlinepiolet obviously not gone far into turkey..I read that part of turkey is sympathy with IS.Biggest mistake if turkey come into union

 

[seb]

Really ?? Turkey gave Russian pilots warnings in English ?? Then that could a good as getting no warnings.

Every country in the world uses English to communicate to pilots, it is an industry and worldwide standard. The use of English to communicate with other pilots was standardized in 2008 if they don't use English they can't fly in international airspace.

http://www.aviation-esl.com/ICAO_English.htm

 

[seb]

One only has to look at the number of planes that has been shot down by the USSR and now Russia for entering their airspace notable flights were: Korean flights 902 and 007 and Malaysia flight 17 and these are just the passenger jets they have shot down. So Russia knows what it's like to shoot down other country's planes.

 

[Jiro]

Yeah but this was Russian pilots and the warning should had been given in Russian too if they didn't response to the warnings in English . That should had been a clue they didn't understand English . But we'll
really never know what really happen. But this is not good.

they did not know it was a Russian plane. all they know was that a plane was intruding into their airspace.

 

[Jiro]

my Bulgarian friend -

They are pissing off all the wrong people. Putin will scramble his jets, and dig out all the cold war vintage weapons to dispose of them over the heads of those quacks, and that's only cause he's bored. Heard today that the Chechen president is gathering his special forces to go there and bitch slap the "All mighty" fighters with their 50 cent bullets, and Chechens are not known for political correctness, and caring much about human rights

 

[hoichi]

my Bulgarian friend -

The last 15 years russia has been modeenizing is forces.

They handed the chechnyans their asses in chechnya war 2. No one denies the chehcnyans where overpowered and defeated in that one.

Chechnya is not independent. Thus clearly as it stands now rusaia has been victor in that one. Grozny was all but completely destroyed.

Then we have russia out thinking and out manuvering the west in the ukrain.
No one denies they did that.

They are formidible all jokes aside.

Putin as a leader and tactician has utterly outclassed the leader of the free world...ie obama..who has been a travesty in international affairs and american interests.

Russia is more clever then they get credet for.

A stan for them is 30 years ago, judging how they have been manuvering in syria, how they are consoliditating their position, not bieng over committed it shows they have learned from their hard lessons.

Amarica has the most powerfull and fearsom military, but when it comes to leadership,,
Frankly these last years have been rather embarassing..
I really hope for all our sakes the above changes...

Im not sure in the near future it will though.

 

[caz]

we should be helping ppk.
HOICHI do you really think America got best military, bit of a home goal that hospital very sad sending piolets to tired to think out on manovers..

 

[Jiro]

The last 15 years russia has been modeenizing is forces.

They handed the chechnyans their asses in chechnya war 2. No one denies the chehcnyans where overpowered and defeated in that one.

Chechnya is not independent. Thus clearly as it stands now rusaia has been victor in that one. Grozny was all but completely destroyed.

Then we have russia out thinking and out manuvering the west in the ukrain.
No one denies they did that.

They are formidible all jokes aside.

Putin as a leader and tactician has utterly outclassed the leader of the free world...ie obama..who has been a travesty in international affairs and american interests.

Russia is more clever then they get credet for.

A stan for them is 30 years ago, judging how they have been manuvering in syria, how they are consoliditating their position, not bieng over committed it shows they have learned from their hard lessons.

Amarica has the most powerfull and fearsom military, but when it comes to leadership,,
Frankly these last years have been rather embarassing..
I really hope for all our sakes the above changes...

Im not sure in the near future it will though.

modernizing its force? don't be deceived.

they've probably modernized 1% of its entire force and using it on very specific conflict for publicity and show of force. they simply do not have money to do it so they've pretty much spent the last 15 years acting like they have modernized its toys.

 

[CrazyPaul]

Syrian rebels hate Russia because Russia went after them instead of ISIS.

We should focus on ISIS because they are danger to our national security.

Russia bombs both of the groups. Anyway, Putin thinks of Syria rebels who fight against the government (the regime) as terrorists. He's 100% wrong on that issue since he supports the Syria dictator who murdered innocent civilians like Saddam did. I look at Putin as a sh*thead. He's too dumb. LOL Time for a new Russian President.

 

[CrazyPaul]

modernizing its force? don't be deceived.

they've probably modernized 1% of its entire force and using it on very specific conflict for publicity and show of force. they simply do not have money to do it so they've pretty much spent the last 15 years acting like they have modernized its toys.

No, you are wrong. Russia is ready for Star Wars. (sarcasm)

 

[hoichi]

modernizing its force? don't be deceived.

they've probably modernized 1% of its entire force and using it on very specific conflict for publicity and show of force. they simply do not have money to do it so they've pretty much spent the last 15 years acting like they have modernized its toys.

Indeed. They have been.
To the extant their loot allows them.

America has all the best toys. No one denies that.

The question that should be asked is why hasnt america used all the their toys money can buy to better its advantage?


Russias toys still work.
Call up the footage of what hapoened.to.grozny if you have any doubt about that.

They dont have all the super turbo charged flash the ameeicans have,
So they have been using what they do have to better leverege their power.

Not many in ukrain were laughing where they?

Right or wrong.

Its the conplete travesty of american leadership that has allowed russia to be doing what it does.

I dont blame putin for leading his nation as best he can as a leader.

Compared to the americans...

Hes been rather cunning. Clever, and shows he knows a long game when he sees one.

Russia has huge plms to deal with,

Americas plms are vastly different.

It will be interesting to see how well all those flash and crash toys. America has in its arsenal actually hold up againat a nation that can actually defend itself....

So.far since nam....which was an american defeat..we can argue as to why a defeat was suffered. But their is no denying. America lost that one.

So since nam.
Amaerica has been wise to test itself against these big players..

Granada....a huge american victory....(roll eyes)..it certainly was an american victory in every sense....

Panama...another grand slam for america.
Both these nations actually stood a.chance....(snickers)..of course these did..."-)

Iraq 1. Saddam had a huge army.....sure...with decades old equipment deoending on the unit, all draftee forced to fight troops...hell....they were slaughtered....but im not sure if iraq is the nation to pecock about prowess in defeating...

And while america handed them their ass, if youve ever played chess you would know its who you play that matters most when.it comes to.victory...

Afghanistan....well.. another huge american victory against a nation with no airforce, let alone much of a modern standard of living. Yet real victory was denied them.

All those toys....all the toys money could and does buy....yet after a few years america just im not sure, lost interest or couldnt stomoch the idea of doing what she really had. To to end it.

Again.

Total war is juat good for whites or japs......


Fair enough..



Iraq war 2.
Again against a nation that didnt much stand a chance...what was this about again...i forget the lies...oh i remember now...weapons of mass destruction...of course.....and im happy they all.were found safe and non.existant...but a pretext is after just a pretext.......and the repucusions of this fiasco, of course we are dealing with now.....interesting how that works huh?



Im curious...though. as a freiend

What is their much to be proud of in regarding prowess on the feild of battle if who ever your engaging, can hardly read, cant shoot straight, and has no defence?

Ill grant you the above victories...


Because indeed the above are amerrcan victories.

The russians are not much better, for what they have to work with...certainly far far far fewer toys...and allot less loot. But uncle vlad hasnt done all to.bad, all things consedered....

Afghanistan...russia defeat..like americas vietnam....sucked to be them...

Chechnya 1 russia defeat....we should.have some sympathy here...damn...with a leader like yellsten granted he could dance and out drink anyone.....in this one it must of really sucked to have been a general under old.....ah well what day is it again yelsten....

Chechnya 2...
In this russia woke up from its yelston stupper...with a new upstart former kgb agent at the helm...eh what could go.wrong for the unlucky chechnyans used to yelston as a foe...
Well....damn...
Old.vlad is many things, a yelston he is not...grozny obliterated....chehcnya 2 is a russian victory.

Now it could be argued the chechnyans stood a better chancd then the granadans or the panamanians did against the yanks...

But since we are comparing americas toys for bored boys (amaerica sure does have all the equipment it needs)...to an interesting inner phenomenon called.will.

And while equipment indeed is not lacking with the americans....
These days....what is is..
Will

The russians as it stands at this moment have both will and a leader that can think more then one move ahead.

I dont gamble.

But given who both these have faced....

I dont see much of a reason why america has much at all to boast about...besides..
Granada...lol.

 

[whatdidyousay!]

they did not know it was a Russian plane. all they know was that a plane was intruding into their airspace.

Yeah I heard this on the a few days , I wonder if they did know if that would had made difference in using Russian and English .

 

[LoveBlue]

Yeah I heard this on the a few days , I wonder if they did know if that would had made difference in using Russian and English .

Probably not as it's been said multiple times that ENGLISH is the language used by pilots and anyone talking to pilots in international airways.

 

[caz]

I have to wonder why surpposely country on our side Turcky allows IS go in and out getting wepons with border guards who very easy bribed.Not country to depend on

 

[Jiro]

Yeah I heard this on the a few days , I wonder if they did know if that would had made difference in using Russian and English .

none. it could be anybody so it makes no difference.

do you seriously think this is the issue of miscommunication? trust me... it's not. you need to understand that being a fighter pilot is very rigorous and usually the intelligent type.... so most foreign pilots do know basic english. it's really impossible to not know "WARNING"..... and fighter pilot would be able to see warning indicator in their console about being locked on by radar and missile.

I believe Putin was probably flaunting his egoism and probably told the pilot to disregard Turkey's warning to perhaps troll them into shooting it down so that Russia can have a reason to take a more aggressive action.

no offense to my Russian friends... but Russia treats their soldiers as expendable pawns for their sick political game as they had historically done so in wars. it's really puzzling that Putin is hostile toward to everybody (except American's enemies like Syria) involving in ISIS war.

 

[Reba]

none. it could be anybody so it makes no difference.

do you seriously think this is the issue of miscommunication? trust me... it's not. you need to understand that being a fighter pilot is very rigorous and usually the intelligent type.... so most foreign pilots do know basic english. it's really impossible to not know "WARNING"..... and fighter pilot would be able to see warning indicator in their console about being locked on by radar and missile.

I believe Putin was probably flaunting his egoism and probably told the pilot to disregard Turkey's warning to perhaps troll them into shooting it down so that Russia can have a reason to take a more aggressive action.

no offense to my Russian friends... but Russia treats their soldiers as expendable pawns for their sick political game as they had historically done so in wars. it's really puzzling that Putin is hostile toward to everybody (except American's enemies like Syria) involving in ISIS war.

Pilots are probably valued more but I know that enlisted conscripts are treated like dirt. They also skimp on training for non-elite troops and sailors. They lack career enlisted and mid-level service personnel. It's mostly senior career officers and disgruntled junior enlisted.

I don't know if it was direct orders from Putin or the pilot's own arrogance ("They wouldn't dare shoot me down") that caused him to ignore the warnings.

 

[CrazyPaul]

I have to wonder why surpposely country on our side Turcky allows IS go in and out getting wepons with border guards who very easy bribed.Not country to depend on

If that's a fact, that means we are already watching this country. If the government there doesn't do anything about it, we will take action. Nothing new.

 

[caz]

If that's a fact, that means we are already watching this country. If the government there doesn't do anything about it, we will take action. Nothing new.

I hope so but they not done much yet.

 

[hoichi]

I have to wonder why surpposely country on our side Turcky allows IS go in and out getting wepons with border guards who very easy bribed.Not country to depend on

Hi caz.
Turky buys isis oil, and turks make up a portion of isis recruits.

Turkey isnt on our side.

Its a muslem nation, who ha slipt furthur to an ismaliat position, its rather clear who side the turks are on..

Anyones but the kurds for a start.

 

[hoichi]

If that's a fact, that means we are already watching this country. If the government there doesn't do anything about it, we will take action. Nothing new.

The ameeicans wont take any action against turkey. An ally. And a nato member.

Thats a fact.

The reaaon why iis exits is directly due to it having covert support from nations, turkey. Bieng one who see it in their interests to allow it to continue.

Both turkey and america have this year blocked attempts of othernations wishing to arm kurds to better fight isis.