Train the Trainer, Please!

Skywalker said:
I have been reading how angry deaf people are at we who hear...and no wonder when you guys are treated like you are not there. I can under stand why there is so much hatred toward the hearing because of their ignorance and just plain meaness but why is there so much anger within the deaf community toward each other? ie CI's, ASL verses Speaking, deaf school vs public school. I can somewhat relate because i was married to a black man(divorced after 20 years). I have 3 beautiful kids who are sometimes ostracized by the black community because they are not black enough and then of course they are not always accepted into the white community because they don't look white. As a young mother I was not prepared for the racism the world had to offer my kids.
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With my friends and co workers, nobody really cares who has a CI, who went to what school or whatever. As long as we respect each other's upbringing or wishes, we get along pretty good. Maybe it is cuz I live in MD and people in the Deaf community are more open minded there. I am sure there are a few that hate others simply because they got a CI or they grew up orally. I faced that discrimination when I first went to Gallaudet cuz of my oral upbringing but I told them off and they realized they were wrong to judge me or others. Most of my friends are deaf/hoh who grew up orally and now use ASL as their primary source of communication.

I met a deaf guy in a store a few months ago who didnt know sign. He saw that I was signing and came up to me asking me questions..I was patient with him answering his questions about CI cuz he wanted to get one due to not being able to understand anyone. I asked him about learning sign language and he was like "Oh I dont need to learn sign cuz the CI will make me hearing." It is that kind of attitude that I get turned off by. I told him good luck and that it was nice to meet him. It was VERY hard not to sign to him cuz he had trouble reading my lips. I also couldnt understand him very well too so without signing, smooth communication became very difficult for both of us.

I dont know about the Deaf communities in the other states if they discriminate against each other but I dont think most people do that..just a few.

Your kids are faced with discrimination? My son is mixed cuz my husband is black and I am white so I am hoping he wont face the same kind of discrimination here in MD.
 
Skywalker said:
jillio said:
Assumptions that all the HOH child needs is to wear their hearing aid and sit in front of the classroom where they can see the teacher, and they will be able to speachread what they cannot hear through their aids. This is very, very wrong. The classroom does not provide an environment that is conducive to speechreading. Very, very seldom will a child be able to gain sufficient information through the use of a hearing aid alone.

Issues such as lighting and visual fields need to be addressed.

Assuming that simplifying the material will achieve the desired goal. It is often not simplification that the deaf or hh child needs, but an interpretation or rephrasing of the material that would put it into a spatial reference rather than the linear reference provided by English.

Wow! I am not overwhelmed. after reading what everyone has been saying I really see these things as pure frustration. I cannot imagine. WHy do you suppose this stuff has never been addressed,by our education system? Is there no one listening? or are we just to lazy to make the hard necessary changes? It's not as if we have working system. Changes need to be made across the board.
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Because most of the directors who run the special ed programs are not really properly trained in the field of deaf education. I got my BA degree in Special Ed and there was pratically nothing about how to work with deaf/hoh children during my studies. I was shocked cuz I expected to learn more about it but I learned more about MR, behavior programs, ADDHD, and LD. Not much about deaf or blind education. I think that's why the deaf ed programs in many public schools are so poorly managed unless they have a director who had intensive training in Deaf Ed.
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Skywalker said:
Why do you suppose this stuff has never been addressed by our education system? Is there no one listening? Or are we just too lazy to make the hard necessary changes? It's not as if we have working system. Changes need to be made across the board.
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shel said it best, but you also have to understand that most of the administrators that are not retired yet have passed their bias' to their proteges' against deaf and hoh students. Deaf and Dumb doesn't fly anymore, except in a courtroom where the defendant who said it is getting their pants sued off them, not to mention their school district. I said that because as soon as I'm done with my undergrad work, it's off to law school. I will be more than happy to represent students who are not being served by their schools.

It's going to take more than changes. I was very disturbed by what she said that other teachers weren't taking her serious and (my words here) treated her like an idiot and that she didn't know what she was talking about.

In my high school, a woman who was in charge of special education over ruled the student support services lady that same year and the next school year, the special ed woman was in charge of everything. I couldn't get around her and preferred the woman who took care of student support, as I always could get help from her.

Pardon this next part if it offends, but it needs to be addressed. Perhaps if teachers and personnel in schools would dress professionally (ties and jackets for the guys, dresses or pantsuits for the women), there would be better functioning in the schools. Let's also kick it up a notch and say that all teachers and paraprofessionals need to know about deaf students instead of looking at the list every year before school starts and choosing the top students for themselves and letting the rookie teachers have the least wanted. I am not implying that deaf/hoh students are not desired, but I am implying that teachers need to be educated. If they don't educate and kids are sitting around playing cards all day, they are not doing their job.
 
In Middle and High Schools, What were your hardest classes? and Why?
Math were my worst subjects. Why? I wasn't prepared to take on Honors Math class in 7th grade. 7th grade was my first year to be fully mainstreamed; the teacher weren't paying attention to me so I got lost in a 30+ students classroom (prior to 7th grade, I was accustomed to 10 to 12 students per classroom).


What would have made them better?
Smaller classes. It doesn't mean for deaf, but for HEARING students too.. I am sure many hearing students got lost too because of the size of classroom where the teacher cannot give individual attention and make sure everybody is on the same page.


What were your favorite classes? Why?
Not sure. Pretty much everything else.
 
Skywalker said:
You didn't go off course. What you say is great but I am sad. Don't get me wrong I hated high school and did not do well (not because I was bored but because I was stoned. I went to HS in the 70's). I just think teachers can put a little more effort into reaching the kids. WHat classes are you taking in college?
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I am in college for about 4 years now. So, I have took many different classes, such as liberal arts course and classes for social work. If you still want a list of classes I took, I don't mind send you one through PM.
 
shel90 said:
Skywalker said:
Because most of the directors who run the special ed programs are not really properly trained in the field of deaf education. I got my BA degree in Special Ed and there was pratically nothing about how to work with deaf/hoh children during my studies. I was shocked cuz I expected to learn more about it but I learned more about MR, behavior programs, ADDHD, and LD. Not much about deaf or blind education. I think that's why the deaf ed programs in many public schools are so poorly managed unless they have a director who had intensive training in Deaf Ed.
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Absolutely!
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Your kids are faced with discrimination? My son is mixed cuz my husband is black and I am white so I am hoping he wont face the same kind of discrimination here in MD.
__________________
Shel90

My kids are discriminated against and it kills me. It's like you can do just about anything to me and I will be sad but I just shrug it off but when you mess with my kids watch out mama bear comes out fighting. I told them when they were little that some people are real butt heads and they have run into a few but like you they have sosme real good friends that love them for who they are not what they look like.
 
pek1 said:
shel said it best, but you also have to understand that most of the administrators that are not retired yet have passed their bias' to their proteges' against deaf and hoh students. Deaf and Dumb doesn't fly anymore, except in a courtroom where the defendant who said it is getting their pants sued off them, not to mention their school district. I said that because as soon as I'm done with my undergrad work, it's off to law school. I will be more than happy to represent students who are not being served by their schools.

It's going to take more than changes. I was very disturbed by what she said that other teachers weren't taking her serious and (my words here) treated her like an idiot and that she didn't know what she was talking about.

In my high school, a woman who was in charge of special education over ruled the student support services lady that same year and the next school year, the special ed woman was in charge of everything. I couldn't get around her and preferred the woman who took care of student support, as I always could get help from her.

Pardon this next part if it offends, but it needs to be addressed. Perhaps if teachers and personnel in schools would dress professionally (ties and jackets for the guys, dresses or pantsuits for the women), there would be better functioning in the schools. Let's also kick it up a notch and say that all teachers and paraprofessionals need to know about deaf students instead of looking at the list every year before school starts and choosing the top students for themselves and letting the rookie teachers have the least wanted. I am not implying that deaf/hoh students are not desired, but I am implying that teachers need to be educated. If they don't educate and kids are sitting around playing cards all day, they are not doing their job.
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I agree with you Pete about teachers need to do their job. period the end. Quit bitching about not makeing enough money and how hard it is to teach the youth today. I am sick of hearing it. I was a problem kid. I always got in trouble and hardly ever came to school cuz I hated the teachers. I think this is why I am so hell bent on doing iit right. I its really not hard if you treat the kids with respect. I have not had a problem yet. About the dressing more professional and how this will make a big difference...I have to disagree with you on that one. Respect comes from the inside to the outside. Dressing up the outside will do nothing about the inside of peoples hearts. Didn't you mom ever warn you "Beware of the wolf in sheep's clothing"
 
shel90 said:
Skywalker said:
Because most of the directors who run the special ed programs are not really properly trained in the field of deaf education. I got my BA degree in Special Ed and there was pratically nothing about how to work with deaf/hoh children during my studies. I was shocked cuz I expected to learn more about it but I learned more about MR, behavior programs, ADDHD, and LD. Not much about deaf or blind education. I think that's why the deaf ed programs in many public schools are so poorly managed unless they have a director who had intensive training in Deaf Ed.
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I would like to see this change. I was reading a book called "all eyes" and the girl really does a good job of explaining why she had such a hard time learning the english language. If more people like her were teaching more people like me we could really make a difference.
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gnarlydorkette said:
In Middle and High Schools, What were your hardest classes? and Why?
Math were my worst subjects. Why? I wasn't prepared to take on Honors Math class in 7th grade. 7th grade was my first year to be fully mainstreamed; the teacher weren't paying attention to me so I got lost in a 30+ students classroom (prior to 7th grade, I was accustomed to 10 to 12 students per classroom).


What would have made them better?
Smaller classes. It doesn't mean for deaf, but for HEARING students too.. I am sure many hearing students got lost too because of the size of classroom where the teacher cannot give individual attention and make sure everybody is on the same page.


What were your favorite classes? Why?
Not sure. Pretty much everything else.
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Thanks for answering. I agree about the smaller classes. I tutor kids sometimes one on one or two on one and man it makes a huge difference in how the student responds to the lessons. I realize we will never get class size that small but over 16 students in one class is too much for one teacher. Maybe if they put two teachers together it could work but there is just not enough teachers to do that. Have you ever thought about teaching?
 
Skywalker said:
Your kids are faced with discrimination? My son is mixed cuz my husband is black and I am white so I am hoping he wont face the same kind of discrimination here in MD.
__________________
Shel90

My kids are discriminated against and it kills me. It's like you can do just about anything to me and I will be sad but I just shrug it off but when you mess with my kids watch out mama bear comes out fighting. I told them when they were little that some people are real butt heads and they have run into a few but like you they have sosme real good friends that love them for who they are not what they look like.
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Not quite on the subject, but I (hearing) am also in training to be an Intervention Specialist and following the discussion. Great advice for us novices. Shel and Skywalker, I have 3 mixed race children B/W also, (2 grown, 1 at home) and can only remember one or two incidents of significant discrimination, and they handled them with class. Mostly, the've been loved, accepted, one was H. S. class president, etc, grounded in respecting others and knowing who they are, and for our family covered by Grace. So, Shel, if I may offer this, don't spend too much time worrying about this...you sound very grounded too and I'm sure this will be transferred to your child.
 
Skywalker said:
About the dressing more professional and how this will make a big difference...I have to disagree with you on that one. Respect comes from the inside to the outside. Dressing up the outside will do nothing about the inside of peoples hearts. Didn't your mom ever warn you "Beware of the wolf in sheep's clothing?"
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Yes, however, would you have respect for your doctor if he/she dressed in clothes not fitting for a doctor? What about an attorney that is in court? Protocol, Skywalker, Protocol.
 
Skywalker said:
shel90 said:
I would like to see this change. I was reading a book called "all eyes" and the girl really does a good job of explaining why she had such a hard time learning the english language. If more people like her were teaching more people like me we could really make a difference.
Click to expand...

Exactly! Why is it that we can read of the experiences of deaf students, and learn so much about what educational practices truly work, and still discount the validity of these experiences? We are so ethnocentric as a soiciety that we give greater credibility to a hearing teacher who has never encountered deafness on an intimate level that we do to the very individuals that have epxerienced it! WTF?!
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shel90 said:
I used to be a teacher's aide for a public school working in the deaf/hoh program. Oh my gosh, most of the terps signing skills were less than adequate and I could see in the class that the more complex information became so confusing for the students. Also, the regular ed teachers assumed that the terps were responsible for disciplining the children if they werent staying on task, paying attention or whatever they werent supposed to be doing and the roles got very confusing for the children so everyone ended up more frustrated. The terps roles are to interpret not act like an aide if the job description doesnt include aide duties.
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Yeppers! And is that the student's fault, or the terp and the educator's fault?
 
jillio said:
Skywalker said:
Exactly! Why is it that we can read of the experiences of deaf students, and learn so much about what educational practices truly work, and still discount the validity of these experiences? We are so ethnocentric as a soiciety that we give greater credibility to a hearing teacher who has never encountered deafness on an intimate level that we do to the very individuals that have epxerienced it! WTF?!
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Exactly! I wish someone could explain why it is like that.
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Shel sorry that it is off the topic.. is that you in that avator... if so youre so beautiful...
 
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