This is not good at all....

[Cookie Monster]

Yep but which is more easier to kill more than one person with gun or knife when s/he gets out of control in the public?

Guns do kill people much easier/faster than knives or bare hands however it is the person's own sheer idiocy that always kills themselves when they are out of control in public.

To quote you.. "Indeedy".

 

[Cookie Monster]

Fear is major reason, play with their minds, probably never have an ability to feel secured.

 

[Reba]

And Reba's links are not?

Just trying to provide balance.

sequoias, they will change this stupid law or retract it in the future...

Michigan might be the next state to pass the law.

I can understand that they need guns to protect theirselves but in THEIR houses or private properties. NOT in public places.

Rapists, murderers, and car jackers don't attack in public places?

Yep but which is more easier to kill more than one person with gun or knife when s/he gets out of control in the public?

That's why we need to protect ourselves.

 

[Vance]

Guns do kill people much easier/faster than knives or bare hands however it is the person's own sheer idiocy that always kills themselves when they are out of control in public.

That would be 'before' kill more than just a innocent bystander in the public. And 'always'? Hmm, not according to the history.

'Indeedy' awards back to me :P

 

[Vance]

Just trying to provide balance.

I know but I want to point out one thing that tousi apparently missed.

Michigan might be the next state to pass the law.

As I said above, "in the future". It certainly does not mean 'right now'. Right?

Rapists, murderers, and car jackers don't attack in public places?

That's why we need to protect ourselves.

I don't buy your excuse at all. Actually... no offense but it is lame. Policemen had a number of training sessions to keep themselves in the control when situation(s) fires up on them while 'normal' civilians don't have that opportunity. So, in the words, most of civilians are incapable of get in control of themselves when situation happens. It is a matter of common sense which I think many people don't have that luxury (what else there are many warning labels on medicines, toys and such )

Look, I think we all know that this 'argument' is endless... but what I do know that this law will be retract or change in time. It is just a matter of time. It didn't solve the problem, it is just creating a new problem but bigger.

 

[Steel X]

I'm abit surprised Jack Thomspon didn't say anything about this one when he always bitched about violence in videogames...

 

[Steel X]

Just remember that guns do not kill people. People kill people.

so much for some kid saying "guns kill....guns kill...." in the animated film, "The Iron Giant". :roll:

 

[Tousi]

Magatsu said, "I know but I want to point out one thing that tousi apparently missed."

I don't think I missed anything; I did say "to wait for other views" and now we have a balance. You got a problem with offering other views for AD'ers to consume?

 

[sequoias]

Finally someone who agrees with my views...Magatsu and some others have a good point. Most people don't understand it UNTIL something actually happens when a innocent bystander or a mob raid happens, then things will change. Here in the US, they believe things change when something actually happens....like the example: A kid gets struck by a car because he/she darted out across the street behind a school bus in front and got hit by a car, when the bus didn't have a "STOP" sign on the bus. It went into a law when it HAPPENED, not what people saw and ignored the safety of the people, they do it when it happens.

 

[Vance]

I don't think I missed anything; I did say "to wait for other views" and now we have a balance. You got a problem with offering other views for AD'ers to consume?

You got a problem with reading other people's comments without misunderstanding anything?

*sigh* I guess I have to work a bit more by copying/pasting comments. Here's a part of your comment that I responded to (in other words, I don't care or concern about other part of your comments):

Your post shows only one-side; it appears to be an extreme view and alarmist and I am sure it is just politics as usual.

Then here's mine (respond to yours):

And Reba's links are not?

Now... where did I say that I have any problems with other views from AD'ers? Hmm? Reba's links certainly show only one-side, hers appear to be an extreme view and alarmist (what if rapists attack others in the public, we need to protect our asses with a .50 caliber rifle! blah blah, that's alarmism style). And... politics that created this law in Florida and yet you were implying that it is just politics as usual... Flash News: Everything is politics nowaday. Ask any politicans. That's where someone missed the point.

I don't see how you twisted my comments into that childish comment, "You got a problem with offering other views for AD'ers to consume?". Oh grief.

 

[Vance]

Finally someone who agrees with my views...Magatsu and some others have a good point. Most people don't understand it UNTIL something actually happens when a innocent bystander or a mob raid happens, then things will change. Here in the US, they believe things change when something actually happens....like the example: A kid gets struck by a car because he/she darted out across the street behind a school bus in front and got hit by a car, when the bus didn't have a "STOP" sign on the bus. It went into a law when it HAPPENED, not what people saw and ignored the safety of the people, they do it when it happens.

Exactly. This ridiculous law will create nothing but bigger problem. If they didn't heed some concerns, all we can do is wait and let them see for themselves. In some sense, it is just like classic 'fire' lesson... Will our kids heed our words when we tell them to not touch the fire? They will not. They won't until they touch it and yell "ouch"! That's where the knowledge comes in, that fire is 'bad' to touch and they will not touch it any longer. Seem to me that's only way for anyone to realize their mistakes by touching the 'fire' to learn... That is truly sad.

 

[Tousi]

Ok, Mag, so I missed the wrong part of the point and it's not the end of the world for me. At least we now have some balance for the edification of others. Thanks for your smarmy imput.

Btw, check your PM.

 

[Vance]

smarmy? Heh. Tousi, well I'm glad that we agreed on that area at this point. However, I have to admit that I was a bit harsh on you. My apology.

Edited: I replied to your pm.

 

[Tousi]

*Hatchet's buried so we can live and play another day* LOL!

 

[Reba]

...I don't buy your excuse at all. Actually... no offense but it is lame.

I'm not making excuses. There is no need.

Policemen had a number of training sessions to keep themselves in the control when situation(s) fires up on them while 'normal' civilians don't have that opportunity. So, in the words, most of civilians are incapable of get in control of themselves when situation happens. It is a matter of common sense which I think many people don't have that luxury (what else there are many warning labels on medicines, toys and such )

You certainly have a low opinion of "civilians" and their self-control.

In order to get a conceal carry permit, I did have to go thru classroom and firing range training. I also practice at the firing range to keep up my skills. It is not the same as police training but I feel every citizen has the right to self defense.

 

[Reba]

... Reba's links certainly show only one-side...

Well, yeah, in a debate one person takes side A, and the other person takes side B. It's not much of a debate if only one side is presented.

... hers appear to be an extreme view and alarmist (what if rapists attack others in the public, we need to protect our asses with a .50 caliber rifle! blah blah, that's alarmism style).

Not alarmist, just realistic. Are you saying that crimes of violence don't happen in public places? Or are you saying that violence happens but you wouldn't want to protect yourself with the best means possible?

 

[redwine]

The right to self defense

I am responding to Reba's debates regarding about guns. I took a little fact about a person I know that have concealed Handgun License and wanted to mentioned this.

It is estimated that less than 1% of the US eligible population have
concealed carry permits. Those of us that do have concealed carry
permits have taken on a tremendous responsible. Even when we do
everything right in using lethal force, bad things could happen to us and
our lives will be changed. As in the August Wal-Mart shooting when one
of our concealed carry permit holders saw a man vault a counter and
start stabbing a Wal-Mart employee, he felt compelled to save the
woman’s life as everyone else that was present just stood and watched.
After repeated demands for the perpetrator to stop stabbing the woman,
the only way to say the woman’s life was to shoot the perpetrator. The
Albuquerque Journal ran a story the next day with the title “Shooting
First Under Permits”. In that story they quoted APD spokeswoman Trish
Hoffman as saying “it looks like the shooting was justified”. Neither
the Albuquerque Journal nor the TV news gave any credit or mention that
the actions of a concealed carry licensee saved a woman’s life or that
our concealed carry license law is working as designed and saving
lives. After the first two days, when the news media could find that
nothing was done wrong and everything was done right in using lethal
force to save a woman’s life, the story was dropped like a hot potato.

 

[cabaca]

 

[jazzy]

The problem is, laws only stop law-abiding honest citizens from having guns. Laws don't stop the criminals from having and using guns.

Yes, there are many "screwed up" people in this world. That doesn't mean I have to give up my rights for them. Besides, "screwed up" people can do a lot of damage in other ways, without guns.

When one of those "screwed up" people bangs on my door, I want to be ready to defend myself.

We feel same, my husband have guns in the house with permits here too. It happened to him once when someone point gun to his head and freaked him out. That is why he has it now to protect himself because cops do nothing for him then. Now my kids have to experience this same thing again.

Dogs work for me better than guns when it comes to defend my home and myself.

U don't mind shoot this person and watch this person dying?

 

[Reba]

...U don't mind shoot this person and watch this person dying?

Of course I would mind. It would be horrible. I never said that I would enjoy shooting someone. I pray to God that I will never have to do that. But I would rather watch a potential rapist or murderer die than let myself or another innocent person become a victim to that criminal.