The Sign-less Protest

[VamPyroX]

I found this article in our recent edition of the Reporter magazine here at RIT.

Equal communication access (signing in all public areas), has been an issue in LBJ since NTID’s establishment over 30 years ago, but it shouldn’t be. This is the mindset of Lizzie Sorkin, recent Student Government president-elect and organizer of the Silent Protest that occurred April 24 through April 28. The issue—seeing faculty using oral communication in the Lyndon B. Johnson Building—is very old, and one that is fi nally being addressed with increased action by the student body. The protest aims to eliminate all non-sign communication by faculty in the building, rendering LBJ a sign-exclusive building.

The faculty is split on the issue. Many view forced signing in public as the wrong approach. Rocco Saccente, alumni of RIT and current NTID staff commented, “If you look, many of the faculty and staff members are terrible at sign. They are required to take classes, but they learn very little and useless signs.” Saccente went on describing how some faculty sign incorrectly and he suggests more frequent and practical classes to keep skills fresh and accurate.

Saccente has been around the campus for over 10 years. When asked if he had ever seen any movement like this protest, Saccente replied, “No, there was always a loose guideline [on public communication] that the faculty and staff should follow, but oral speaking still occurred.” So what caused students to fi nally do something about faulty and staff orally communicating in LBJ?

Sorkin, who has been at RIT for six years, put it best when she said, “I got tired of being nice and smiling when people talk without signing in NTID. They think it’s okay, but it’s not.” Michelle Gerson, a third year Profession and Technical Communication major, summarized her feelings regarding being left out of an oral conversation by relating it to her home life, coming from a hearing family. “Many of us came from families that had conversations at the dinner table while we sat there not understanding a lick of what was going on. When we walk into LBJ and feel right back at the dinner table…well, we’re pissed.” Gerson summarizes the feelings of many of her deaf counterparts at NTID and reaffi rms that, in order to promote equality, all deaf people should be permitted to be part of public conversation in their building.

Green signs proclaiming “I’m tired” monitored the entrances to LBJ for any staff/faulty member who passed by communicating without sign. “A mark for every time we feel left out,” said Sorkin. The project’s completion will consist of a graph showing every communicative encounter the silent protesters have been isolated from. Sorkin and her allies hope to alert the NTID community and persuade the administration to take decisive action.

Dr. Alan Hurwitz, Dean of NTID, discussed his reaction. Back in 2004, a team was formed to evaluate how the “communication environment in LBJ measures up,” said Hurwitz. The Communication Research Team organized a series of open forums regarding the issue, involving students, faculty, and staff that hope to build awareness and help resolve the equal access to communication issue. Through these forums, Hurwitz said, “The plan is for my administrative team to review the feedback comments. Then I will make a decision to be implemented in fall quarter.” Until then, the halls of LBJ may not be silent, but Sorkin and her fellow protesters are.

What do you think?

 

[Mookie]

I found this article in our recent edition of the Reporter magazine here at RIT.What do you think?

It would be very wise to enroll into RIT instead of NTID. Why? there are plenty of ASL interpreters who are far best than any stinking professors teaching in the classrooms of NTID...

Vampyrox, I am surprised that you are still at NTID...

 

[VamPyroX]

It would be very wise to enroll into RIT instead of NTID. Why? there are plenty of ASL interpreters who are far best than any stinking professors teaching in the classrooms of NTID...

Vampyrox, I am surprised that you are still at NTID...

I'm not in NTID. I'm in RIT. I'm currently getting my MS.

 

[Mookie]

I'm not in NTID. I'm in RIT. I'm currently getting my MS.

Very clever....

 

[VamPyroX]

Very clever....

Why?

 

[Teresh]

It would be very wise to enroll into RIT instead of NTID. Why? there are plenty of ASL interpreters who are far best than any stinking professors teaching in the classrooms of NTID...

Agreed. I don't think I'll ever understand why some people actually register at NTID only instead of cross-registering (or just being RIT, if they're not eligible for cross-registration, like me). An NTID degree is essentially worthless and the NTID educational experience isn't too great.

There are a few saving graces, though. The NTID performing arts department is really the only modern performing arts program at RIT, so if you're into theatre, there's something there that you can't get anywhere else.

Still, I would not be able to justify not cross-registering if you can... It's just silly to not do so.

 

[Mookie]

Agreed. I don't think I'll ever understand why some people actually register at NTID only instead of cross-registering (or just being RIT, if they're not eligible for cross-registration, like me). An NTID degree is essentially worthless and the NTID educational experience isn't too great.

There are a few saving graces, though. The NTID performing arts department is really the only modern performing arts program at RIT, so if you're into theatre, there's something there that you can't get anywhere else.

Still, I would not be able to justify not cross-registering if you can... It's just silly to not do so.

Teresh, you are so smart cookie....

I kept wondering why all deaf students must enroll to NTID instead of RIT. NTID should have phrased out just like Northwest Campus (NWC) of Gallaudet University closed ten years ago....

 

[VamPyroX]

Agreed. I don't think I'll ever understand why some people actually register at NTID only instead of cross-registering (or just being RIT, if they're not eligible for cross-registration, like me). An NTID degree is essentially worthless and the NTID educational experience isn't too great.

There are a few saving graces, though. The NTID performing arts department is really the only modern performing arts program at RIT, so if you're into theatre, there's something there that you can't get anywhere else.

Still, I would not be able to justify not cross-registering if you can... It's just silly to not do so.

There are two reasons why students go to NTID. One, because they WANT to. Two, because they HAVE to.

Those who WANT to...

• Are interpreter majors since that's where the interpreting program is.
• Are only focused on getting an AAS or AOS.
• Are in the MSSE program.

Those who HAVE to...

• Failed or scored low on the LAPT.

Those who score low on the LAPT have to take lower-level English. Sadly, there are oral students who act like they are better than everyone else. Yet, they fail the LAPT and end up in NTID. There's one oral guy who actually goes around asking other deaf students about what English level they're taking.

*Dumb Ass walks up to Nice Gal*

Dumb Ass: "What English level are you taking?"
Nice Gal: "I'm taking Writing II."
Dumb Ass: "Hahaha! I'm taking Writing IV!"

*Dumb Ass walks up to Nice Guy*

Dumb Ass: "What English level are you taking?"
Nice Guy: "I'm taking Reading III."
Dumb Ass: "Hahaha! I'm taking Reading IV!"

*I walk up to Dumb Ass*

Me: "Writing IV? Reading IV? Hahaha! I've never taken any English here at RIT. They waived me! Hahaha!"

*Dumb Ass blushes and walks away in shame*

Me: "Hey Nice Gal and Nice Guy, you're doing great. Don't listen to that prick."

 

[Sugar Addict]

what about all sorts of deaf people from different backgrounds and to start this "sign only" alienates oral or deaf students who actually dont know how to sign-

 

[Serendipity]

There are two reasons why students go to NTID. One, because they WANT to. Two, because they HAVE to.

Those who WANT to...

• Are interpreter majors since that's where the interpreting program is.
• Are only focused on getting an AAS or AOS.
• Are in the MSSE program.

Those who HAVE to...

• Failed or scored low on the LAPT.

Those who score low on the LAPT have to take lower-level English. Sadly, there are oral students who act like they are better than everyone else. Yet, they fail the LAPT and end up in NTID. There's one oral guy who actually goes around asking other deaf students about what English level they're taking.

*Dumb Ass walks up to Nice Gal*

Dumb Ass: "What English level are you taking?"
Nice Gal: "I'm taking Writing II."
Dumb Ass: "Hahaha! I'm taking Writing IV!"

*Dumb Ass walks up to Nice Guy*

Dumb Ass: "What English level are you taking?"
Nice Guy: "I'm taking Reading III."
Dumb Ass: "Hahaha! I'm taking Reading IV!"

*I walk up to Dumb Ass*

Me: "Writing IV? Reading IV? Hahaha! I've never taken any English here at RIT. They waived me! Hahaha!"

*Dumb Ass blushes and walks away in shame*

Me: "Hey Nice Gal and Nice Guy, you're doing great. Don't listen to that prick."

Hahaha. :Owned:

I am happen to be a former NTID student, and I was waived from NTID English classes (too easy for my level, according to my LAPT results) and went directly to RIT.

 

[VamPyroX]

Hahaha. :Owned:

I am happen to be a former NTID student, and I was waived from NTID English classes (too easy for my level, according to my LAPT results) and went directly to RIT.

I already took English at community college. When I took the LAPT, they had me take 3 parts. I ended up being the last person to leave. The 3rd part was the written part, which was reviewed by the chairperson of RIT's English department. She approved the waive for me. Therefore, I didn't have to take ANY English at RIT/NTID.

 

[Serendipity]

I already took English at community college. When I took the LAPT, they had me take 3 parts. I ended up being the last person to leave. The 3rd part was the written part, which was reviewed by the chairperson of RIT's English department. She approved the waive for me. Therefore, I didn't have to take ANY English at RIT/NTID.

I would rather do anything than taking those crappy English classes NTID provided.

 

[Kai Onca]

I already took English at community college. When I took the LAPT, they had me take 3 parts. I ended up being the last person to leave. The 3rd part was the written part, which was reviewed by the chairperson of RIT's English department. She approved the waive for me. Therefore, I didn't have to take ANY English at RIT/NTID.

They never made me take the LAPT when I transferred to RIT

 

[VamPyroX]

They never made me take the LAPT when I transferred to RIT

Maybe, you had more credits than I did? I don't know.

When I came here, they made me take it for reasons unknown. I guess NTID wanted to see if I was really as good as I said I was.

 

[Y]

I could have attended RIT myself, but
I made a decision to stay within NTID
only because it's easier for me.

Perhaps I got too weary of going thru
difficult times during hearing public school for
a few years so thats why I wanted
an easy way to study, etc.

Regardlessly I felt it was a good reason for me
to stick within NTID rather than at RIT.

 

[RedFox]

I took AP English for 4 years in high school and got a 3 out of 5 on the AP exam and got a high verbal score on the SAT so I didn't have to take the entry exam and only needed to take Writing and Lit. I and was wavied from Writing and Lit. II.

On the student information system, people taking the NTID English classes are given a level of 1. People who are taking or have finished the RIT ones have level 2. I am at level 2. I've seen people talk about how people who finished NTID classes and are taking RIT ones have a level of 1.5. I don't know if they stopped doing that.

People told me of professors at NTID who didn't sign well. I don't know any of them because I never went to NTID classes.

 

[Datamz37]

I found this article in our recent edition of the Reporter magazine here at RIT.What do you think?

I attended RIT for 6 years, 3 at NTID. I've seen plenty of teachers in LBJ or Building 14 walk by talking without signing. But I never felt any need to know what they were talking about. I had enough to worry myself about with classes and education instead of caring that two teachers were having an intense oral conversation on the way to their classrooms.
The image I keep getting is: back in the dark ages, teachers would rap students' hands with a ruler when they were caught using sign language, the "forbidden" method. Now, students want to rap teachers' mouths with a ruler for using another "forbidden" language? Have we not learned by now that banning something does not work?
What would the deaf students do if one of the other academic buildings on campus required the use of spoken English only, because speech is their preferred mode of communication?
Now, if there are NTID teachers who refuse to sign in class, that's different and certainly needs to be addressed.

 

[Teresh]

The image I keep getting is: back in the dark ages, teachers would rap students' hands with a ruler when they were caught using sign language, the "forbidden" method. Now, students want to rap teachers' mouths with a ruler for using another "forbidden" language? Have we not learned by now that banning something does not work?
What would the deaf students do if one of the other academic buildings on campus required the use of spoken English only, because speech is their preferred mode of communication?
Now, if there are NTID teachers who refuse to sign in class, that's different and certainly needs to be addressed.

The issue isn't whether or not the teachers can speak or not (if they can, that's great, kudos to them), it's whether or not they're really making the effort to be able to communicate with their students.

If you're working at a deaf school, you should probably either already be able to sign or be willing to learn. The issue with the NTID teachers is that they're not making the effort.

A lot of RIT students come in knowing no ASL at all, but leave with the ability to sign at least enough to be conversational, but teachers of deaf students, who actually NEED to be able to communicate with deaf people as a result of their job, aren't making that effort? That doesn't make any sense.

 

[Datamz37]

The issue isn't whether or not the teachers can speak or not (if they can, that's great, kudos to them), it's whether or not they're really making the effort to be able to communicate with their students.

If you're working at a deaf school, you should probably either already be able to sign or be willing to learn. The issue with the NTID teachers is that they're not making the effort.

A lot of RIT students come in knowing no ASL at all, but leave with the ability to sign at least enough to be conversational, but teachers of deaf students, who actually NEED to be able to communicate with deaf people as a result of their job, aren't making that effort? That doesn't make any sense.

My understanding was that the issue was about teachers who are walking in the hallway of LBJ, talking to each other without signing, not that they are not signing at all or not trying to learn sign language. Does NTID have a sign language expection of newly-hired teachers? NTID certainly should be able to make changes if teachers are not meeting hiring expectations.
If teachers at NTID are entering a classroom and refusing to sign, that shouldn't be happening.
If teachers are standing in a hallway in LBJ talking about last night's Sopranos episode or the ball game, and not signing, then what is the big deal? What is being missed that would enhance a student's education?

 

[deafdyke]

Sadly, there are oral students who act like they are better than everyone else. Yet, they fail the LAPT and end up in NTID. There's one oral guy who actually goes around asking other deaf students about what English level they're taking.

It's oral doofuses like those that mess things up for the rest of us with oral skills!!!! I really do think that if it weren't for high and mighty orals, then dhh kids with oral skills would be a lot more accepted in the deafworld!