Should ASL be reserve to culturally Deaf people only?

again, there is a reason.

I can talk, and have continually refused to. I also refuse to discuss how I learned to do so. Learning ASL was much easier and less harmful.
 
again, there is a reason.

I can talk, and have continually refused to. I also refuse to discuss how I learned to do so. Learning ASL was much easier and less harmful.

What is the reason? Please share. I'm geniunely curious. All I have are my assumptions.
 
I'm wondering if I shouldn't post my experience growing up anymore. No one really cared then and they don't care now. I've learned they only care what they want for deaf children.
 
I'm wondering if I shouldn't post my experience growing up anymore. No one really cared then and they don't care now. I've learned they only care what they want for deaf children.

That's the impression I feel here too.
 
I think one of the biggest issues that I see here on AD is that deaf people are so tired and worn out from hearing stuff like "I want my child to speak." "I don't want my child to learn sign", etc. This causes sort of an "automated" attack on anyone who even utters the word "speech". However, it seems like people here generally are not opposed to having oral skills, just not at the expense of ASL.

There is one problem. People here can tell you EXACTLY how to gain ASL fluency. Go to a deaf school, parents learn sign, be part of the deaf community, and so on. People can even suggest exact classes! However, when oral skills come up, people keep their mouths shut on how exactly they could develop. I suspect people are afraid of being attacked or they are afraid that if they make a suggestion, parents will take it too seriously and "hyperfocus" on their speech.

Scaredy cats.

I spent an entire thread discussing how I learned/developed my oral skills. I got fought against by the hearing parents in that "oh well, that's just not how we do it today." Fine. Things change. I totally get that. But then why do we even want to discuss how we developed our oral skills when that's the response we get? The hearing parents on here are from an entirely different generation than the majority of posters on this board. This is the problem I have with those hearing parents thumbing their noses at us. They don't identify with how we did things back then, and we have a hard time identifying with how they develop oral skills (excuse me, spoken language) today.
 
I'm wondering if I shouldn't post my experience growing up anymore. No one really cared then and they don't care now. I've learned they only care what they want for deaf children.

You said that you hated how you grew up and that you suffered and are unhappy because of it, so yeah, we want to AVIOD doing the things your family did.
 
I spent an entire thread discussing how I learned/developed my oral skills. I got fought against by the hearing parents in that "oh well, that's just not how we do it today." Fine. Things change. I totally get that. But then why do we even want to discuss how we developed our oral skills when that's the response we get? The hearing parents on here are from an entirely different generation than the majority of posters on this board. This is the problem I have with those hearing parents thumbing their noses at us. They don't identify with how we did things back then, and we have a hard time identifying with how they develop oral skills (excuse me, spoken language) today.

Again, I think there is a misunderstanding. We have been told again and again that the methods that were used in previous generations are cruel and didn't work. Why on earth would we want those methods employed with our children if they would then suffer and hate it and then, likely, it wouldn't even be successful?!
 
Again, I think there is a misunderstanding. We have been told again and again that the methods that were used in previous generations are cruel and didn't work. Why on earth would we want those methods employed with our children if they would then suffer and hate it and then, likely, it wouldn't even be successful?!

I was just thinking exactly the same thing.

AlleyCat, if I'm thinking of the same thread you reference, the whole issue that started the disagreement in defining oral skills vs English was that children today can attain the language without using those same methods of developing oral skills that previous generations have rejected.
 
Again, I think there is a misunderstanding. We have been told again and again that the methods that were used in previous generations are cruel and didn't work. Why on earth would we want those methods employed with our children if they would then suffer and hate it and then, likely, it wouldn't even be successful?!

Actually, if you listen careful, none of us really hated it... it's their (both deaf and teachers/therapists/etc.) reasons behind it you need to look into.
 
Wirelessly posted

deafgal001 said:
Again, I think there is a misunderstanding. We have been told again and again that the methods that were used in previous generations are cruel and didn't work. Why on earth would we want those methods employed with our children if they would then suffer and hate it and then, likely, it wouldn't even be successful?!

Actually, if you listen careful, none of us really hated it... it's their (both deaf and teachers/therapists/etc.) reasons behind it you need to look into.

you may not have, but plenty of people have told me they did. There are complaints about everything from bad breath to abuse. One of my asl teachers kicked his pregnant slp in the stomach at age 6 and ran out, never to return to any speech therapy.
 
I agree!
I find it real strange that they throw crutches at you. They tried to take ASL away because they perceived it as "crutches" and then they slapped hearing aids on us. Now it is CI. They don't even batted their eyes when it was pointed out that hearing aids and CIs are "crutches". Real silly of them!

Much like with the deaf, the Medical establishment likes to try and mitigate what they see as a bad situation. To them, it's better for the child to learn to walk if they have any capability at all to do so. As it is, I'm only partially paralyzed. I have feeling above the knees, but virtually none below the knees. I have NO ability to stand indepenantly, however.

The advice they gave my Mother was to put me in PT so I could build up muscles with the goal of learning to walk with the braces and crutches. We did that. I became ambulatory at around age 4. What they failed to mention or even understand, though, was that walking would be a very short lived thing with me. In total, it lasted about 5 yrs before I simply couldn't do it anymore. In my case, puberty hit and I gained weight. My body weight + other musculo-skeletal issues made it very difficult for me to walk after about the age of 9. By age 11, it was impossible, so I literally gave it up and became fully wheelchair bound. My health may have suffered slightly as a result of our decision, but overall, I was much happier. That was some 30 yrs ago or more.

The prevailing attitude today is much the same. If the child shows any theorectical ability to walk, they put the kid in PT and brace them with the goal of ambulation. What anecdotal evidence has shown, however, is that kids who walk when young end up becoming wheelchair bound by the time the teen years roll around. I theorize it is much for the same reasons I gave up walking. It simply becomes too burdensome on the child. It also isn't very healthy for the child as a whole. My socialization suffered terribly because I was always in PT when everyone else was at recess. I don't blame my parents for this, though. I truly believe they were misguided and were doing the best they could for me. I'm just thankful my Mom listen to me, and, told the Dr's to "stick it" when I couldn't do it anymore.

As for your experience, it is comparable. I don't knock CI's or HAs; just like I don't knock braces and crutches. They're tools that can help the individual when wanted. My gripe is with parents who don't listen to their kid or they have this attitude that the child is happy and will always be happy with the decision to implant. Has it ever occured to anyone that children WANT to please their parents, so they won't complain about the devices they are wearing? It only becomes apparent when the kid gets older and feel they are old enough to speak for themselves that their feelings become known. Then, the parents are like "Oh, my!", if they even give credence to the person then!

I made a comment to someone recently that I would like to see what happens to the children with CIs in 20 yrs and see what they say. Some will undoubtedly like their CI's and be happy, but I wonder if ALL of them will? Somehow, I doubt it. I bet we WILL see a lot of kids angry and upset at their parents because they didn't give them the tools they needed to make their lives easier. Sure, the kids performed well or so it seemed, but are they HAPPY? Ask them in 20 yrs....
 
I'm wondering if I shouldn't post my experience growing up anymore. No one really cared then and they don't care now. I've learned they only care what they want for deaf children.

I care. Your experience helps me to serve the deaf children of today better. I hate that the deaf adults have had to go through what they have gone through, and I seek to prevent it happening to others.
 
You said that you hated how you grew up and that you suffered and are unhappy because of it, so yeah, we want to AVIOD doing the things your family did.

You cannot solve a problem with the same mind that created it. Einstein
 
Wirelessly posted



you may not have, but plenty of people have told me they did. There are complaints about everything from bad breath to abuse. One of my asl teachers kicked his pregnant slp in the stomach at age 6 and ran out, never to return to any speech therapy.


Shouldn't that tell you something?
 
Once again you are not reading me. 1. I never said there wasn't a bias in Deaf advocacy. 2. I never said your decisions for your children are wrong. 3. I have 7 children, varying in ages from young adults, teenagers, preteen and elementary-age - I think I qualify to have the mindset of a parent.

Moreso than most!:P
 
Or let the toolbox be offered without bias, and the decision around which tool or tools to use be based on the individual child's needs, abilities, and available resources.

Needs and abilities as determined by what criteria? No available resources is a poor excuse for not providing for a child's needs.
 
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