Profound hearing loss + hearing aid questions

@deafdude1: Thank you very much! Not exactly - there is an audiogram for my left ear, but it reads that I have nearly no hearing. The audiometer was capable of up to 110 dB. We didn't get any response out of my left ear until my audiologist got down to 100 dB. That's where the "tactile" response occurred, or the sensation of sound. There is no auditory response, nor an ability to discriminate between any frequencies. It felt like a dump truck was hitting me on the left side of my head and I nearly jumped 50 feet out of my chair - I haven't heard out of my left ear since I was 3-4 years old. My audiogram for my left ear starts *at* 100 dB and moves down from there (105 dB, etc.). As best as the doctors could tell at the time, an infection was responsible for destroying nearly all of my hearing. I have sensorineural loss, which means that the hair cells of the inner ear are gone.

I don't know what the CI is going to do for me yet. Everyone's different, and it's my plan to go through this with low expectations, so that it doesn't turn into a huge disappointment in case I'm determined not to be a candidate anyways. Like the Jim Alsup video from Advanced Bionics, if I'm a candidate, I don't want to go into activation day expecting to have normal hearing the first day. I'm sure I'll require a lot of rehabilitation to get my left ear up to where my right ear is today.
 
Phi4Sius said:
@deafdude1: Thank you very much! Not exactly - there is an audiogram for my left ear, but it reads that I have nearly no hearing. The audiometer was capable of up to 110 dB. We didn't get any response out of my left ear until my audiologist got down to 100 dB. That's where the "tactile" response occurred, or the sensation of sound. There is no auditory response, nor an ability to discriminate between any frequencies. It felt like a dump truck was hitting me on the left side of my head and I nearly jumped 50 feet out of my chair - I haven't heard out of my left ear since I was 3-4 years old. My audiogram for my left ear starts *at* 100 dB and moves down from there (105 dB, etc.). As best as the doctors could tell at the time, an infection was responsible for destroying nearly all of my hearing. I have sensorineural loss, which means that the hair cells of the inner ear are gone.

I don't know what the CI is going to do for me yet. Everyone's different, and it's my plan to go through this with low expectations, so that it doesn't turn into a huge disappointment in case I'm determined not to be a candidate anyways. Like the Jim Alsup video from Advanced Bionics, if I'm a candidate, I don't want to go into activation day expecting to have normal hearing the first day. I'm sure I'll require a lot of rehabilitation to get my left ear up to where my right ear is today.
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:gpost:
 
Hi again Phi4Sius, did it feel like vibrations rather than true sound? Up to what frequency were you able to feel? Do you plan to get retested with an audiometer capable to 120db? As for CI, do you plan to wait for CI technology to get to the point that you hear as well as you do with a hearing aid on the good ear? One more thing, have you read into BAHA?
 
Hello again deafdude1,

Yeah, it felt like a MAJOR vibration rather than true sound. It starts at 100 dB. Here's a fuller picture of my left ear hearing loss:

250 Hz 100 dB
500 Hz 107-ish dB
1000 Hz 115 dB
1500 Hz 120 dB
...and then nothing.

I guess I was wrong...it looks like they WERE able to get down to 120 dB for my left ear.

Here's what it looks like for my right ear unaided:

250 Hz 50dB
500 Hz 60 dB
1000 Hz 65 dB
2000 Hz 70 dB
3000 Hz 85 dB
4000 Hz 100 dB
...and then nothing above 4000 Hz

As for the CI, it sounds as if some people with my level of hearing loss have attained hearing far better than what the strongest HAs on the market have been able to do. I've read into the BAHA, and it sounds like an option, but I'm not going to know that much more until we go through all the tests for my CI evaluation next Friday.

I know everyone's different - and I don't want to get my hopes up if the surgeon determines that I'm not a candidate.
 
Phi,

Is your hearing loss conductive or sensorineural? If it's conductive, a BAHA would be the best option. If it's sensorineural, a CI would be the better choice.
 
Hear Again - That's pretty much why I chose the CI in the first place. I'll stick with my decision for the CI. ;)
 
Phi4Sius said:
Hello again deafdude1,

Yeah, it felt like a MAJOR vibration rather than true sound. It starts at 100 dB. Here's a fuller picture of my left ear hearing loss:

250 Hz 100 dB
500 Hz 107-ish dB
1000 Hz 115 dB
1500 Hz 120 dB
...and then nothing.

I guess I was wrong...it looks like they WERE able to get down to 120 dB for my left ear.

Here's what it looks like for my right ear unaided:

250 Hz 50dB
500 Hz 60 dB
1000 Hz 65 dB
2000 Hz 70 dB
3000 Hz 85 dB
4000 Hz 100 dB
...and then nothing above 4000 Hz

As for the CI, it sounds as if some people with my level of hearing loss have attained hearing far better than what the strongest HAs on the market have been able to do. I've read into the BAHA, and it sounds like an option, but I'm not going to know that much more until we go through all the tests for my CI evaluation next Friday.

I know everyone's different - and I don't want to get my hopes up if the surgeon determines that I'm not a candidate.
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Interesting. Were you able to feel the vibration at 1000Hz? 15000Hz? I never could at frequencies much above 500Hz so im guessing your left ear does hear true sound, albet very faint due to the near total loss. You should try a Phonak Nadia V UP, especially in the left ear. Youd probably be aided to 40db with max gain. Deafdoc who posts here has hearing as bad, if not worse than your left ear, yet he still benefits from hearing aids. He said hes looking into a CI in the near future.

Did they try 6000Hz for the right ear and how many db was that audiometer capable of at 6000Hz? Look at your audiogram, was it marked on the 110db, 120db line with an arrow pointing downwards(meaning your hearing is out of range) on my audiogram, the 6000Hz is on the 110db line and the 8000Hz on the 100db line. Audiometers aren't capable of 120db at every frequency, mine did 120db up to 4000Hz(and probably down to 500Hz too)

What sounds does your right ear hear unaided? How well does it hear aided at every frequency and have they tried increasing the gains and did this help? Could they get your aided score down to 0-10db in the lower frequencies with enough gain?

Your left ear probably will be a candidate for a CI according to your surgeon. But getting any funding from insurance is a different matter, especially since your right ear has so much residual hearing. You may have to save the $50,000 out of pocket for a CI. To be honest a CI in your left ear probably won't even match your aided hearing in the right ear. But youd still benefit from bilateral hearing and better be able to sense direction of sound. If you can wait for a cure, your left ear will be great when they start doing clinical trials. Itll be lower risk since you hardly have any hearing to lose if the cure doesn't work. I myself am waiting for a cure or at least CI technology much better than what's out today.
 
deafdude,

If I remember correctly (and doc please correct me if I'm wrong), doc cannot understand speech with hearing aids. He/she (sorry, I don't know your gender) is able to hear environmental sounds, but uses interpreters for communication.
 
Here's what it looks like for my right ear unaided:

250 Hz 50dB
500 Hz 60 dB
1000 Hz 65 dB
2000 Hz 70 dB
3000 Hz 85 dB
4000 Hz 100 dB
...and then nothing above 4000 Hz

Given the fact that the unaided hearing in your right ear borders on severe (by 10-20 dB except at 2K, 3K, 4K Hz and above), there's a possibility that insurance would pay for a CI -- especially considering the hearing loss in your left ear. If I remember correctly, the "best" hearing someone can have to qualify for a CI (provided they meet other requirements) is a moderately-severe to profound loss.
 
Hear Again said:
deafdude,

If I remember correctly (and doc please correct me if I'm wrong), doc cannot understand speech with hearing aids. He/she (sorry, I don't know your gender) is able to hear environmental sounds, but uses interpreters for communication.
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Ive read a few posts by doc, that person's hearing was much better and s/he said it suddenly got worse over a period of 5 months and is now 110db loss at 500Hz, 120db at 1000Hz and total loss above 1000Hz. I would agree/accept that person's choice to get CI and if s/he doesn't want CI, that's also fine. Besides not understanding speech, environmental sounds would be faint, he may not even hear someone talking(much less understand) if that person talks quietly.

Hear Again said:
Here's what it looks like for my right ear unaided:

250 Hz 50dB
500 Hz 60 dB
1000 Hz 65 dB
2000 Hz 70 dB
3000 Hz 85 dB
4000 Hz 100 dB
...and then nothing above 4000 Hz

Given the fact that the unaided hearing in your right ear borders on severe (by 10-20 dB except at 2K, 3K, 4K Hz and above), there's a possibility that insurance would pay for a CI -- especially considering the hearing loss in your left ear. If I remember correctly, the "best" hearing someone can have to qualify for a CI (provided they meet other requirements) is a moderately-severe to profound loss.
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Severe starts at 70db so his loss isn't severe till 2KHz and he would still hear up to 4KHz. I did see someone with a 50db loss at 250Hz(same as him) get a CI because that person had a ski-slope loss and by 1500Hz the loss exceeded 120db(recorded as a NR on the audiogram) but I was still surprised anyway since at 50db HL, that person probably could faintly hear normal volume environmental sounds *unaided* and s/he probably gave that up in that ear after getting a CI. I would never want to give up so much residual unaided hearing and hear nothing when not wearing CI, but that's me.

If the above person decides to go ahead with CI, he definately should get it in the left ear where theres almost no residual hearing left to lose. If insurance won't fund him, there are other ways he can pay, such as savings, donations, financing/loans.
 
Interesting. Were you able to feel the vibration at 1000Hz? 15000Hz? I never could at frequencies much above 500Hz so im guessing your left ear does hear true sound, albet very faint due to the near total loss. You should try a Phonak Nadia V UP, especially in the left ear. Youd probably be aided to 40db with max gain. Deafdoc who posts here has hearing as bad, if not worse than your left ear, yet he still benefits from hearing aids. He said hes looking into a CI in the near future.
Click to expand...

I think I was able to feel the vibration up to 1500 Hz because the audiogram is marked with an X there, and then with arrows at the other normal frequency test points. The way my audi explained it to me regarding Hearing Aids in my left ear is that by the time they would get my left ear aided to the point to where it would hear voices, it would be 3 dB below the pain threshold. Voices have a varied volume level anywhere between 16 dB higher or lower than normal, and just getting my left ear up to that point would prove painful and wouldn't help my hearing anyways.

Did they try 6000Hz for the right ear and how many db was that audiometer capable of at 6000Hz? Look at your audiogram, was it marked on the 110db, 120db line with an arrow pointing downwards(meaning your hearing is out of range) on my audiogram, the 6000Hz is on the 110db line and the 8000Hz on the 100db line. Audiometers aren't capable of 120db at every frequency, mine did 120db up to 4000Hz(and probably down to 500Hz too)
Click to expand...

My right ear's hearing range is outside of the 4000 Hz range. There are arrows pointing downwards from 4000 Hz onward.

What sounds does your right ear hear unaided? How well does it hear aided at every frequency and have they tried increasing the gains and did this help? Could they get your aided score down to 0-10db in the lower frequencies with enough gain?
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Unaided? Very little. I can hear speech and many other sounds if they're very VERY close to my right ear and the person yells loud enough, but other than that not much else.

Here's what my right ear hears aided:

500 Hz - 30 dB
1000 Hz - 20 dB
2000 Hz - 20 dB
2500 Hz - 35 dB
4000 Hz - 70 dB

Your left ear probably will be a candidate for a CI according to your surgeon. But getting any funding from insurance is a different matter, especially since your right ear has so much residual hearing. You may have to save the $50,000 out of pocket for a CI. To be honest a CI in your left ear probably won't even match your aided hearing in the right ear. But youd still benefit from bilateral hearing and better be able to sense direction of sound. If you can wait for a cure, your left ear will be great when they start doing clinical trials. Itll be lower risk since you hardly have any hearing to lose if the cure doesn't work. I myself am waiting for a cure or at least CI technology much better than what's out today.
Click to expand...

With my left ear the way it is, I could probably wait for a cure. From what I have been hearing about CI's, though, the quality of sound with CIs seems to be very VERY similar to normal hearing. I know it 's not exact (what device is?), but I've seen claims about CIs being 1000 times better than hearing aids for those with very similar levels of hearing in my left ear.
 
deafdude1 said:
Severe starts at 70db so his loss isn't severe till 2KHz and he would still hear up to 4KHz.
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I'm aware of that. :)

This is what I said:

"Given the fact that the unaided hearing in your right ear borders on severe (by 10-20 dB except at 2K, 3K, 4K Hz and above)..."
 
Phi4Sius said:
I think I was able to feel the vibration up to 1500 Hz because the audiogram is marked with an X there, and then with arrows at the other normal frequency test points. The way my audi explained it to me regarding Hearing Aids in my left ear is that by the time they would get my left ear aided to the point to where it would hear voices, it would be 3 dB below the pain threshold. Voices have a varied volume level anywhere between 16 dB higher or lower than normal, and just getting my left ear up to that point would prove painful and wouldn't help my hearing anyways.
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Youd still be able to benefit by hearing environmental sounds and achieve some semblance of binaural hearing. Also you want to stimulate that auditory nerve in preparation of CI someday.


My right ear's hearing range is outside of the 4000 Hz range. There are arrows pointing downwards from 4000 Hz onward.
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At what position on the audiogram was the 6000Hz and 8000Hz on your audiogram? For example, if you see an arrow at 100db, that means the audiometer was capable of up to 100db at 8000Hz. I am curious of the position of the arrow on the 6000Hz line.


Unaided? Very little. I can hear speech and many other sounds if they're very VERY close to my right ear and the person yells loud enough, but other than that not much else.
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That's sure way better than what I hear unaided. :D

Here's what my right ear hears aided:

500 Hz - 30 dB(30 gain)
1000 Hz - 20 dB(45 gain)
2000 Hz - 20 dB(50 gain)
2500 Hz(3000?) - 35 dB(50 gain)
4000 Hz - 70 dB(30 gain)
Did you mean 3000Hz? Anyway have you considered upgrading to the latest digital hearing aid for the right ear? Youd hear so much better, especially at low frequencies. I upgraded to the Naida V UP and I hear 5-10db better across the board. I was hearing aided 30db with a 90db loss 10 years ago, a gain of double what your HA produces at 500Hz.



With my left ear the way it is, I could probably wait for a cure. From what I have been hearing about CI's, though, the quality of sound with CIs seems to be very VERY similar to normal hearing. I know it's not exact (what device is?), but I've seen claims about CIs being 1000 times better than hearing aids for those with very similar levels of hearing in my left ear.
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Thats what my audie also says about CI being 1000x better. Of course that makes sense if you have a near total hearing loss. If I heard in both of my ears as bad as your left ear hears, id seriously consider a CI myself. Theres so much I need to learn about CI and theres many things I like and don't like about CI(see my CI thread)

Hear Again said:
I'm aware of that. :)

This is what I said:

"Given the fact that the unaided hearing in your right ear borders on severe (by 10-20 dB except at 2K, 3K, 4K Hz and above)..."
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I could say that a 50db loss is 10db from mild but 20db from severe so he would be closer to mild than severe. :D
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deafdude1 said:
I could say that a 50db loss is 10db from mild but 20db from severe so he would be closer to mild than severe. :D
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And I could say that you hear significantly better (i.e. 20 and 30 dB) with hearing aids than I could (60 dB at 250 Hz and no measureable hearing aided or unaided at 1000 Hz and above). :cool2:
 
deafdude1 said:
I could say that a 50db loss is 10db from mild but 20db from severe so he would be closer to mild than severe. :D
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That still wouldn't explain the extent of his residual hearing since no two people with identical hearing loss hear the same.

Furthermore, some people with milder degrees of hearing loss have greater difficulty understanding speech than people with more severe losses.
 
deafdude1 - Yes, I have. I've been discussing new HAs with my audie. I use a GNResound Canta 7 - the 770D in my right ear. I'm not too thrilled with the digital signal as of late. It's become very quiet, but I still hear okay but only on the third program mode. The other two programs are far too quiet (even though I've had them adjusted repeatedly). I trialed the 780D while my hearing aid was in the shop and had sigNIFICANTLY better hearing with it which I missed. I wish I had gotten that one instead of this one. But, no matter.

My audie is a big fan of Resound, Phonaks, and Unitron (he recommended a Unitron model for me). I've been seriously taking a look at the Unitron 360+. I've heard of the Phonak Naida's transpositional processing which (if I remember correctly) take the high frequencies and "pull" them down into the low frequency range. I'm not 100% comfortable with that and not sure how it would affect how I hear music (I wouldn't want my new HA to adversely affect that).
 
Phi,

During my first CI evaluation, I asked my CI audi if I could try transpositional aids, but she said I would most likely have alot of difficulty adjusting to them (and indicated that this is the case for most people). As a result, she recommended I opt for a CI instead since I would receive more benefit.
 
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