Otologics carina implant, anyone?

Is it suppose to be better than a CI?
 
carina

It is different than a CI. You don´t destroy your usual hearing. My usual hearing goes from 20-30 down to 50-60 and up again to 20-30. This means that if they find a way to cure hearing loss with stemmcells - it is still possible. Professor Stefan Heller is telling about it on youtube.
 
How is the Carina working for you? What level of functional gain are you getting (500Hz and 1000Hz, and 2000Hz).

Can you describe how it sounds?

-C1
 
From reading the above=Carina hearing aid-is not a Cochlear Implant. Thus can't be compared at all.
Oddly enough the first time I ever heard of Carina is right here-now.
How it compares to other Hearing Aids- cost wise?
 
drphil said:
How it compares to other Hearing Aids- cost wise?
Click to expand...

Right now since they are done in extremely small numbers they are very expensive, think I was told £20,000GBP each side. They will always be more expensive than hearing aids because there is a surgery involved and surgery has costs - anaesthetics, surgeons, aneasthesiologist, theater, etc. Plus you may need to travel to have it all done. The cost of the device would only come down if it becomes popular, but it is hard for something to become popular when it's very expensive.

Harder, can I ask why you decided to get this done? I mean was it because you don't like the look of hearing aids, you like to do sport in water, you wanted a better result? Thanks.
 
I think i would stick with Cochlear. and Besides, if somebody who is deaf and suddenly decides to get Carina, how will one believe that they are deaf? i mean it doesn't really make sense to me, because being deaf is an important part of me so, no, i wouldn't do it.
 
ClearSky said:
Just an observation.

It's amazing how deaf people get mixed reactions from considering cochlear implants, but when it comes to implantable hearing devices or devices for people with moderate-to-severe hearing loss, people are helpful without saying a negative thing.
Click to expand...


I think the fact they're not used for pediatric purpose may have something to do with it.

But please correct me if I'm wrong.
 
coolgirlspyer90 said:
I think i would stick with Cochlear. and Besides, if somebody who is deaf and suddenly decides to get Carina, how will one believe that they are deaf? i mean it doesn't really make sense to me, because being deaf is an important part of me so, no, i wouldn't do it.
Click to expand...

RIGHT ON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Yeah, it's good for age related losses.....but for crying out loud I LIKE having a BTE. It's a clue that I am HOH...and I love showing off my earmolds and colored aids...matter of fact I wish my aids were bigger and more noticable!
 
Oh and there was some weird tubeless implant thing awhile back that hit the news....seems to have shrunk without a trace. Most of the hype about the new technology is news release driven.
 
I found a rare article.


Don't ask me how I found it. (I had to make phone calls in order to find this stuff)


Sweet sound published by the House Research Institute


"One of the principal advantages of implantable hearing aids is that they directly transfer the amplified signal into vibrational energy, which drives the ear," says Jonathan Spindel, a biomedical engineer at James Madison University in Harrisonburg, Va. "You've taken out the step that degrades the signal." Avoiding Feedback


That's in theory. Actually getting there has been a challenge. Since the microphone is under the skin, the device must be specially adjusted to cancel out all the sounds of the body itself. Otologics, for example, found that the sound of skin rubbing over the microphone can cause feedback every time a patient moves his or her head, and the patient's voice reverberating through the skull cavity is also picked up.


Tweaking the adjustments on the device appears to minimize these problems. In a first clinical trial of patients published last year in the journal Otolaryngology, patients who received the Otologics Carina implant in only one ear performed slightly worse on hearing tests than with the conventional hearing aids they had used before the surgery.


But in the company's second, still unpublished clinical trial before which tweaks were made patients heard more clearly than people in the first trial as well as those with conventional hearing aids. Of the 10 people tested, two had to have the device removed because of a technical glitch that has since been corrected, says ear surgeon Drew Horlbeck, who headed the trial at Wilford Hall Medical Center in San Antonio. Of the other eight, most say the implant is "as good as a hearing aid, and a few of them feel it's better," says Dr. Horlbeck, who is currently working in Jacksonville, Fla."




According to the published article, the Carina's Implantable microphone is 100 percent effective (better than conventional hearing aids) in the second trial. This is very important because the Cochlear Ltd. is borrowing Otologic's exact Implantable microphone for the Totally Implantable C.I.

So, believe it or not, the Totally Implantable Cochlear Implant's microphone is already 100 percent perfect (just like the Carina's mic in the second clinical trial).


This should answer a lot of questions in this forum.


Also, there is one thing that has been driving me crazy!! The Carina and Envoy were about on the same pace in clinical trials. The Envoy got FDA-approved in 2010. The Carina was anticipated to get approved in 2010, too. But, for some reason, all the way up to 2012 it's still not approved in the USA. What is going on with that? The Carina has been commercially available (CE mark) in Europe since 2006. Come on! Get approved in the US already. Then they can get the Totally Implantable Cochlear Implant rolling.
 
Cochlear said this...

Cochlear, he says, is moving towards trials, with key hurdles, such as a battery that is recharged through the skin and a problematic implanted microphone, already overcome.


Cochlear is the owner of Otologics. The french cochlear implant company Neurelec and Otologics got in lawsuit problems. Cochlear is the winner!


.
 
Hello Forum.
I am VERY glad I found you.

I am considering having a Carina device implanted. I am trying to collect as much information as I can before making such a big step. Are there any more recent news about it?

I have been using external hearing aid device for decades. Now I am simply tired, would like to make my life just simpler. I suffer from moderate hearing loss, both ears (going to worsen in old age).

It seems IMPOSSIBLE to speak to someone who actually had this kind of surgery and is actually using the device.

So I should be soooo grateful if someone could give me a precious feedback about their experience. (Including Harder65! Please!)

Thanks so much. Congrats on the Forum.
 
Given the cost factor- surgery etc. how does one know that there will no further increase in their hearing loss? What then? Another operation?

As I commented #25, Jan 11/12 not much consideration for more trials.
 
maari vekki said:
Hello Forum.
I am VERY glad I found you.

I am considering having a Carina device implanted. I am trying to collect as much information as I can before making such a big step. Are there any more recent news about it?

I have been using external hearing aid device for decades. Now I am simply tired, would like to make my life just simpler. I suffer from moderate hearing loss, both ears (going to worsen in old age).

It seems IMPOSSIBLE to speak to someone who actually had this kind of surgery and is actually using the device.

So I should be soooo grateful if someone could give me a precious feedback about their experience. (Including Harder65! Please!)

Thanks so much. Congrats on the Forum.
Click to expand...
If it's progressive, I doubt that you'd be eligable, since you'd just be getting a CI soon anyway.
 
mlb 10th inning said:
I found a rare article.


Don't ask me how I found it. (I had to make phone calls in order to find this stuff)


Sweet sound published by the House Research Institute


"One of the principal advantages of implantable hearing aids is that they directly transfer the amplified signal into vibrational energy, which drives the ear," says Jonathan Spindel, a biomedical engineer at James Madison University in Harrisonburg, Va. "You've taken out the step that degrades the signal." Avoiding Feedback


That's in theory. Actually getting there has been a challenge. Since the microphone is under the skin, the device must be specially adjusted to cancel out all the sounds of the body itself. Otologics, for example, found that the sound of skin rubbing over the microphone can cause feedback every time a patient moves his or her head, and the patient's voice reverberating through the skull cavity is also picked up.


Tweaking the adjustments on the device appears to minimize these problems. In a first clinical trial of patients published last year in the journal Otolaryngology, patients who received the Otologics Carina implant in only one ear performed slightly worse on hearing tests than with the conventional hearing aids they had used before the surgery.


But in the company's second, still unpublished clinical trial before which tweaks were made patients heard more clearly than people in the first trial as well as those with conventional hearing aids. Of the 10 people tested, two had to have the device removed because of a technical glitch that has since been corrected, says ear surgeon Drew Horlbeck, who headed the trial at Wilford Hall Medical Center in San Antonio. Of the other eight, most say the implant is "as good as a hearing aid, and a few of them feel it's better," says Dr. Horlbeck, who is currently working in Jacksonville, Fla."




According to the published article, the Carina's Implantable microphone is 100 percent effective (better than conventional hearing aids) in the second trial. This is very important because the Cochlear Ltd. is borrowing Otologic's exact Implantable microphone for the Totally Implantable C.I.

So, believe it or not, the Totally Implantable Cochlear Implant's microphone is already 100 percent perfect (just like the Carina's mic in the second clinical trial).


This should answer a lot of questions in this forum.


Also, there is one thing that has been driving me crazy!! The Carina and Envoy were about on the same pace in clinical trials. The Envoy got FDA-approved in 2010. The Carina was anticipated to get approved in 2010, too. But, for some reason, all the way up to 2012 it's still not approved in the USA. What is going on with that? The Carina has been commercially available (CE mark) in Europe since 2006. Come on! Get approved in the US already. Then they can get the Totally Implantable Cochlear Implant rolling.
Click to expand...

Been three years since this article.......hmmm where is it? I think you do have to be very skeptical of claims such as these.....I mean big companies can and do use the power of the net to self promote, and get things hyped up for their product. Also the mention of the Completely Implantable CI reminded me of that dude from years ago who was completely and totally fixtated on it.
 
drphil said:
Given the cost factor- surgery etc. how does one know that there will no further increase in their hearing loss? What then? Another operation?

As I commented #25, Jan 11/12 not much consideration for more trials.
Click to expand...

Thank you for your comments.

Dr. Phil - if I may address you personally - future further hearing loss is supposed to take place at least very slowly. How long is supposed to last a device? 10 years? 15, if you're very lucky?
So why not enjoy a few years respite compared to always wearing - or not *always* wearing - an external hearing aid?

Is there anyone with an actual experience with the Carina device that would like to share it in this forum? That would help so much.

(FYI, other kinds of CIs are not suitable for me, so either I go for a Carina or I stick to outfitted hearing devices.)
 
maari vekki: Some thoughts based on past experience. I have had hearing aids from the middle 60s to December 2006. I became bilateral DEAF. on the 20th.

I never considered wearing one then two as much of a problem.

The speed of increasing hearing loss is highly specific to each person.

It is my clear understanding that Cochlear Implants are not comparable to Hearing aids which only increase sound. Thus one can hear-somewhat.

I have no comment on your understanding that Cochear Implants are "unsuitable" for you

Does the lack of much comment on Carina here in Alldeaf.com seems " to suggest" not a widely practiced?
 
maari vekki said:
Thank you for your comments.

Dr. Phil - if I may address you personally - future further hearing loss is supposed to take place at least very slowly. How long is supposed to last a device? 10 years? 15, if you're very lucky?
So why not enjoy a few years respite compared to always wearing - or not *always* wearing - an external hearing aid?

Is there anyone with an actual experience with the Carina device that would like to share it in this forum? That would help so much.

(FYI, other kinds of CIs are not suitable for me, so either I go for a Carina or I stick to outfitted hearing devices.)
Click to expand...

What's wrong with wearing an external aid?
 
drphil said:
maari vekki:

It is my clear understanding that Cochlear Implants are not comparable to Hearing aids which only increase sound. Thus one can hear-somewhat.

I have no comment on your understanding that Cochear Implants are "unsuitable" for you

Does the lack of much comment on Carina here in Alldeaf.com seems " to suggest" not a widely practiced?
Click to expand...

Having worn HA's and now CI they are very different. So different I just got my 2nd CI. :)



If the Carina is basically the same as Envoy I'd say approach with caution. From what I see of the Envoy, you will probably lose the middle ear conduction system (bones, the device is somehow placed in there) Plus Envoy is a cash only internal HA (most insurance does not cover it last I heard). It's also an, if it works you'll love it, but if it doesn't...........you're probably out a lot of $$

It's an exciting technology and hopefully someday people won't have to bother with pesky external devices. :) While this is not a technology that is of benefit to any in my family at this time because of it's limitations, it is in my follow and see how it does category.

Just need more people to do it to see how well it really works, unfortunately unless insurance begins paying for it not enough feed back will be heard.
 
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