Medical model and cochlears

Are cochlear implants discrimination against Deaf/HOH individuals?

  • Yes

  • No

  • It depends

Results are only viewable after voting.
Your instructor is assuming that people with disabilities don't have the ability to be autonomous thinking humans. Your instructor has gone so far that he/she is almost arguing against him/herself.

As both a D/deaf person with a CI (activated 3 years and 4 days ago) and a medical professional, we are taught to emphasize with patients and above all, help the patient retain their dignity and avoid suffering.

Ask your instructor what counts as a disability? Is a person who is dependent on hemodialysis disabled? They certainly can't lead a "normal" life. We (doctors (I'm not one quite yet)) wanted to get rid of people with disabilities, why do we spend so much time working WITH patients to improve their quality of life?

I know there is a great book called "The Mask of Benevolence" but that is the term I'd use to describe your instructor. Sort of skimming the surface and taking the "disability side" without thinking or considering that 1. Medical professionals have disabilities and 2. Physicians and patients (and families) work together.
BatChick98 said:
I am taking a disability studies class for a diversity credit at my university.

In my class we discuss the medical model and my instructor basically said that all medical professionals want to rid the world of individuals with disabilities so that is why they do things like create cochlear implants and are always trying to find cures for things. Medical professionals hate people with disabilities and want them to go away so they try and fix them. I disagree with this 150%.

Did any of you HOH/Deaf people consider the invention of the cochlear implant discrimination against Deaf/HOH people and Deaf culture? Please let me hear your views on this! I'd also be interested in hearing about other forms of discrimination you have encountered from the medical, professional, or everyday world.
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Awwww, you're like that guy who "totally isn't a racist" because he has that black friend.
I hope that you can develop the ability to see that, yes, there is a pathological process but that does not mean it is unhealthy. People are not defined by one aspect of the universe that makes up an individual.
Try to develop the ability to truly empathize with others, they are not broken or bad. They are individuals who have lives and families and degrees and jobs and quite possibly a million times the perspective on life that you have.

"I am not deaf so I cannot say I really understand Deaf culture but of course I respect it. I think it is great. I am going into a medical profession so I personally view all disabilities pathologically, because they are not things that are supposed to happen, nor are they healthy development. Now, this is not to say they are bad. Some of my favorite people have disabilities and their disabilities only make them better.
Do you consider it discrimination against disability when people view disability pathologically?"
 
I think it can be very discriminatory but it can also be quite the opposite. I think the discrimination that I have seen has largely come from CI recipients who are late deafened and parents of child CI recipients. So I guess the short answer is no, I don't think doctors are discriminating for recommending them. It's their job to offer technology that is supposed to assist or improve. However, I do think it is wrong and discriminatory for doctor's to insist that a child with a CI should not be apart of the Deaf community or use sign language. Especially when there is no evidence to support the stance that a child can't learn spoken English and sign or that it somehow hinders them.

I have been on a CI journey for about 3 yrs now. I've started the process and stopped it a couple times due to relocation. In my journey, I joined a few support groups to get varying perspectives and a lot of what I've seen is atrocious. It's the reason I dropped out of many of those groups because for someone like me they weren't supportive at all. Parents and recipients alike implying (and even blatantly stating) that without this magic hearing implant they would be nothing. They wouldn't be able to be successful in life (or at least their warped version of success) or speak or what have you. This sort of discrimination infuriated me in those groups. And in some aspects I get it. If you've never seen a positive Deaf role model then you don't know any better. But at the same time their ignorance was self-made. Especially with the internet being a valuable resource of finding Deaf role models who are successful without any type of implant, hearing aid, etc as well as with those devices. I went to school with people who know are employed by the White House, are doctors, lawyers, etc. Deaf & proud.

I guess in some aspects, a few years ago, I probably would've agreed. I wasn't born deaf but I've been deaf for decades now but grew up oral, no Deaf examples or culture. I know better now because I made the decision to learn ASL and get to know other deaf people. These people I see in these groups don't even make the attempt. They are almost blissful in their ignorance thinking that Deaf/deaf means less than, stupid, stuck. And when you try to educate them it just starts a keyboard argument. So I guess what I'm trying to say is that the discrimination against Deaf/deaf sometimes comes from within the community itself.
 
jstegeman said:
I think (s)he's (sorry, don't know the person) saying that Audiologists recommend CI's, not doctors, and that if doctors hated disabled people, they'd all be out of work. Jammed two thoughts into one paragraph :)
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exactly what I said.
 
sonocativo said:
exactly what I said.
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What is funny is that my audiologist is a CODA and all the audiologists in his clinic (3 or 4 of them) told me I was NOT a CI candidate despite having NO MEASURABLE HEARING above 1kHz.
Doctors, unless they are ENTs, know nothing about CIs. The audiologists wanted me to have stronger hearing aids until I maxed out the strongest on the market. A bodybworn hearing aid wouldn't have let me hear anything but noise.
 
ecp said:
What is funny is that my audiologist is a CODA and all the audiologists in his clinic (3 or 4 of them) told me I was NOT a CI candidate despite having NO MEASURABLE HEARING above 1kHz.
Doctors, unless they are ENTs, know nothing about CIs. The audiologists wanted me to have stronger hearing aids until I maxed out the strongest on the market. A bodybworn hearing aid wouldn't have let me hear anything but noise.
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Some just want to keep making every penny they can out of you before letting you go, I bet if you find another audi it would be a different tune.
 
This is an intresting thread and me as a hearing person, for me CI's can be discrimatory...

Why? Because its still being forced upon kids and parents even though they have decided against it already...

Its a tool and not a cure
+ its part of your identity and by practically pushing people to get them you say, But Hey you are not living up to the norm, so you should try to fix yourself...

An audiologist or an ENT should provide you with all the tools you can have and let the choice up to the person themselves
 
Mieke said:
This is an intresting thread and me as a hearing person, for me CI's can be discrimatory...

Why? Because its still being forced upon kids and parents even though they have decided against it already...

Its a tool and not a cure
+ its part of your identity and by practically pushing people to get them you say, But Hey you are not living up to the norm, so you should try to fix yourself...

An audiologist or an ENT should provide you with all the tools you can have and let the choice up to the person themselves
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I dont agree with "forcing" it upon them.
I wasnt forced. I was told that HA's wouldnt help me anymore and that CI's were my next option by my Audiologist. it was years later I decided to look into them, met with a CI specialist and listened to what they had to say. At no time what so ever was I ever forced, or Hounded to get them, they left it at that to decide if I wanted to move forwards or not. This is the same with everyone I know who has CI's including some parents of children with CI's. The doctors dont get commissions for "selling" you on the CI's however they do build a reputation of how successful they are, but if you are "Forced" by a doctor.... Thats not very professional in my opinion.
As far as "Feeling" forced or "Hurried" with children, could be due to the learning curve window when they are young.
Forced is against your will or consent. Persuaded may be a better word than forced here.
 
Mieke said:
This is an intresting thread and me as a hearing person, for me CI's can be discrimatory...
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Oh yeah. A couple years ago my family was "urging" me to get CI's, citing several factors in their decision. (Sounds nuts, doesn't it?)
I decided to accept who I am, but that was not the end of it.
Nope, both my brothers are still cool to me to this day and they went so far as to cut me out of my fair share of my parents' will.
As I said, I accept it.
They don't.
Their problem.
 
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I'm a parent of a CI eligible baby. It was the audiologist who first suggested CIs as an option, then the ENT who went into more detail about it. Those first two meetings were last September, daughter will be 1 y.o. at end of May, and I still haven't made up my mind. But never once, has either audi or ENT forced, coerced, questioned my hesitation to jump on the CI bandwagon for my daughter. I've been doing the research, asking questions of other moms of CI kids, CI recipients, etc. I've put questions on this forum, as well as others, posed to D/deaf individuals. But I agree with Sono, if anyone is feeling forced or coerced into getting CIs, or being made to feel "less-than" for not getting them, its time to find a new whatever, audi/ENT/etc.

I get more of those feelings from friends and family members...thats a different story for a different thread :D
 
sonocativo said:
I dont agree with "forcing" it upon them.
I wasnt forced. I was told that HA's wouldnt help me anymore and that CI's were my next option by my Audiologist. it was years later I decided to look into them, met with a CI specialist and listened to what they had to say. At no time what so ever was I ever forced, or Hounded to get them, they left it at that to decide if I wanted to move forwards or not. This is the same with everyone I know who has CI's including some parents of children with CI's. The doctors dont get commissions for "selling" you on the CI's however they do build a reputation of how successful they are, but if you are "Forced" by a doctor.... Thats not very professional in my opinion.
As far as "Feeling" forced or "Hurried" with children, could be due to the learning curve window when they are young.
Forced is against your will or consent. Persuaded may be a better word than forced here.
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Thats Why I said it CAN be, and i used the word forced upon because today there still are parents who they try to persuade and convince even when they have already decided against this.
Im not just inventing, this is from a mom who has decided against CI for her child and keeps getting asked to get a CI, and has spent months to convince them to stop trying to convince her.

@Tristen Im glad you have good specialists who provide you with all the options :)

@Beowulf so sorry you have to go through that

@sonocativo im glad you had good experiences with them :)
 
Mieke said:
Thats Why I said it CAN be, and i used the word forced upon because today there still are parents who they try to persuade and convince even when they have already decided against this.
Im not just inventing, this is from a mom who has decided against CI for her child and keeps getting asked to get a CI, and has spent months to convince them to stop trying to convince her.

@Tristen Im glad you have good specialists who provide you with all the options :)

@Beowulf so sorry you have to go through that

@sonocativo im glad you had good experiences with them :)
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Nothing wrong with what you said, I am just dumbfounded as to why people stay with the doctors who wont let a dying horse lie? Or those who stay with a doctor who try to "force" CI's down their throats then turn around and whine about it ? Its not the doctors fault, its theirs for staying with the so called doctor. I have been with my current doctor for nearly 27 years, he is great, listens to your concerns and makes suggestions and leaves it to you to decide and make the ultimate decision. Never once has he made me feel like I needed to or take an ultimatum decision. I have in the past experienced doctors like that and thats why they are one patient less today.
Another issue with the whole scenario is insurance.... Some dont have or they have low coverage or whatever and doctors take advantages of that to add extra crap on a visit to make more ( like adding bloodwork, or shots...ect...) just to increase the billing. Hell just to go in and ask a question is billed $60 as you noticed they wont answer a question over the phone, you have to set an appointment with them. can I charge for my travel expenses,waiting time and time wasted I could be doing something else for that 3 hours of my time for 15 minutes of theirs?
 
Having both cerebral palsy and Deafblindness I find parents are way to quick to implant and most times the kid is going to need visual language anyway so why not sifn
 
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