looking for recent hybrid CI news

[nozzleman6]

Hi, My name is Mike. I am new to this site. I am looking into getting the hybrid cochlear implant. I am just trying to read up as much as I can on the subject and looking for someone who has recently gotten this done. Hoping to chat with someone in similar situation as myself and find out how their experience with this went.

A little about myself.

I am 49 years old and live in Oregon. I had a sudden loss of my high frequency hearing when I was about 32 years old. Probably due to noise exposure. I have been wearing hearing aids consistently for about 10 years. I have top of the line phonak digital ones. They seem to work ok. I have the classic ski slope audiogram and my speech recognition is around 20.

I have a demanding job as a firefighter/paramedic. I am a 21 year veteran and I have to admit my job is far more tougher being hard of hearing. I don't even think they are any professional firefighters out there that have CI so this could be a first.

I was told I am a perfect candidate for the hybrid CI. So if you can relate or share some insight I would love to hear from you.
thanks for listening! Mike

 

[HOH-ME]

What I've heard is that a lot of people have had major issues trying to get these covered by their insurance companies...so look into that first before you do anything else.

Next, the technology behind these just isn't all that great. The idea is good, however, in the event your hearing declines to the point where the HA part no longer works, you are stuck with a CI that is not that great.

I'm also wondering if a CI would even be something you could use on the job. The magnet on you head is a pretty light connection and your hat/equipment would likely knock it off your head frequently. It's hard to say but also a consideration.

 

[Condor1970]

I also am on the fence about real need of the hybrid. Good quality hearing aids are so effective now, that they provide adequate hearing all the way to the point where you might as well just get a full CI, and not the hybrid.

My daughter is a perfect example. She lost virtually all of her hearing, and was totally deaf in the right ear, and recently went 80% deaf in the left. She has a hearing aid in the left ear now, and can still function but not quite well enough, so they did a full CI in the right ear.

However, if she still had 20% hearing in the right to match the left, we probably would not have gotten the CI for the right, because 2 ears at 20% with high quality digital HA's would have been just adequate enough to be able to function very well in school and future careers.

Because your job is so active, I would almost suggest trying to get a good quality set of HA's for both ears, because heaven forbid you lose your CI processor. Those are unbelievably expensive.

I am a personal proponent of using Costco for getting affordable HA's. For less than $2,000, you can get 2 Kirkland Signature hearing aids (which are Resound Verso) from Costco, when a private Audi will charge double for the same thing. Also, losing a $900 hearing aid is tough, but not a world ending problem for someone who is middle class with an active career.

I honestly would suggest going to Costco and getting their Audi's opinion, and trying a set of the Kirkland HA's, just for fun to see how well they help. They have a full return policy for 90 days if you don't like them, and really need a CI. It never hurts, in the end could cost you nothing if you return them.

Have you gotten any second opinions about all this?

 

[Jane B.]

Off topic but I really want to let Condor1970 and everyone else reading this know how much I appreciate the space between paragraphs in his post (Quoted below).

I also am on the fence about real need of the hybrid. Good quality hearing aids are so effective now, that they provide adequate hearing all the way to the point where you might as well just get a full CI, and not the hybrid.

My daughter is a perfect example. She lost virtually all of her hearing, and was totally deaf in the right ear, and recently went 80% deaf in the left. She has a hearing aid in the left ear now, and can still function but not quite well enough, so they did a full CI in the right ear.

However, if she still had 20% hearing in the right to match the left, we probably would not have gotten the CI for the right, because 2 ears at 20% with high quality digital HA's would have been just adequate enough to be able to function very well in school and future careers.

Because your job is so active, I would almost suggest trying to get a good quality set of HA's for both ears, because heaven forbid you lose your CI processor. Those are unbelievably expensive.

I am a personal proponent of using Costco for getting affordable HA's. For less than $2,000, you can get 2 Kirkland Signature hearing aids (which are Resound Verso) from Costco, when a private Audi will charge double for the same thing. Also, losing a $900 hearing aid is tough, but not a world ending problem for someone who is middle class with an active career.

I honestly would suggest going to Costco and getting their Audi's opinion, and trying a set of the Kirkland HA's, just for fun to see how well they help. They have a full return policy for 90 days if you don't like them, and really need a CI. It never hurts, in the end could cost you nothing if you return them.

Have you gotten any second opinions about all this?

 

[HOH-ME]

I also am on the fence about real need of the hybrid. Good quality hearing aids are so effective now, that they provide adequate hearing all the way to the point where you might as well just get a full CI, and not the hybrid.

My daughter is a perfect example. She lost virtually all of her hearing, and was totally deaf in the right ear, and recently went 80% deaf in the left. She has a hearing aid in the left ear now, and can still function but not quite well enough, so they did a full CI in the right ear.

However, if she still had 20% hearing in the right to match the left, we probably would not have gotten the CI for the right, because 2 ears at 20% with high quality digital HA's would have been just adequate enough to be able to function very well in school and future careers.

Because your job is so active, I would almost suggest trying to get a good quality set of HA's for both ears, because heaven forbid you lose your CI processor. Those are unbelievably expensive.

I am a personal proponent of using Costco for getting affordable HA's. For less than $2,000, you can get 2 Kirkland Signature hearing aids (which are Resound Verso) from Costco, when a private Audi will charge double for the same thing. Also, losing a $900 hearing aid is tough, but not a world ending problem for someone who is middle class with an active career.

I honestly would suggest going to Costco and getting their Audi's opinion, and trying a set of the Kirkland HA's, just for fun to see how well they help. They have a full return policy for 90 days if you don't like them, and really need a CI. It never hurts, in the end could cost you nothing if you return them.

Have you gotten any second opinions about all this?

I'm going to STRONGLY disagree with you on that assumption. I had 2 ears at just about 30% and I could NOT function in the work environment, go out to eat and have a conversation with anyone, get more then 2 people in a rooms and forget participating in the conversation.

Costco also sells an Phonak HA, which is the Naida hearing aid rebranded for Costco.

I do agree that if you are to the point where you need a CI, get a CI.

 

[nozzleman6]

My hearing aids are 5 grand for the pair. They are top of the line. I still struggle with hearing in certain environments.

As for the whole CI. My low frequency hearing is pretty good. The high frequencies is what I am missing. From what I understand of the hybrid, it replaces the highs and a hearing aid amplifies the lows.

As far as continuing my job, I do quite well in house fires. I wear my hearing aids in high heat situations with no problems so far. They are under a nomex hood and my helmet which gives protection from being knocked off.

I am curious about the comfort level of the CI too, How does it feel to have it? Is there anything in normal life that it interferes with?

I have seen quite a few testimonials with the CI activation and that looks incredible. I haven't found any for the hybrid though. That has me curious as well.. Is it just way superior to hearing aids? I guess that is why I was hoping to find someone in similar hearing problems and cure.
thanks again

 

[Condor1970]

I'm going to STRONGLY disagree with you on that assumption. I had 2 ears at just about 30% and I could NOT function in the work environment, go out to eat and have a conversation with anyone, get more then 2 people in a rooms and forget participating in the conversation.

Costco also sells an Phonak HA, which is the Naida hearing aid rebranded for Costco.

I do agree that if you are to the point where you need a CI, get a CI.

I suppose I should clarify. I guess what I really meant to say, is regardless of what percentage you are at, if the best HA on the market is no longer good enough, then you should probably just a full CI. I only say this, because hearing loss in almost every case, continues to get worse with time. Eventually, even a hybrid may need to be replaced with a full CI. So, you might as well hang onto the HA as long as possible, then just get a regular CI.

 

[Condor1970]

My hearing aids are 5 grand for the pair. They are top of the line. I still struggle with hearing in certain environments.

As for the whole CI. My low frequency hearing is pretty good. The high frequencies is what I am missing. From what I understand of the hybrid, it replaces the highs and a hearing aid amplifies the lows.

As far as continuing my job, I do quite well in house fires. I wear my hearing aids in high heat situations with no problems so far. They are under a nomex hood and my helmet which gives protection from being knocked off.

I am curious about the comfort level of the CI too, How does it feel to have it? Is there anything in normal life that it interferes with?

I have seen quite a few testimonials with the CI activation and that looks incredible. I haven't found any for the hybrid though. That has me curious as well.. Is it just way superior to hearing aids? I guess that is why I was hoping to find someone in similar hearing problems and cure.
thanks again

Well, in my daughters case, the CI is located above the ear line slightly, which means it is difficult for her to wear a regular hat, because it collides with the magnet/driver, and pushes it off. You can get head bands and other things to hold them in place so they don't fall off. You then have to adjust the hat band much bigger to fit over the CI if needed. Everyone is different in this case, because the surgeons tend to mount the CI in a spot wear the bone is most accomodating for the implant. This of course changes for everyone.

Which brand or model of Hearing Aids do you currently have?

I assume they are programmable? If so, then I wonder if your Audi can't tune them with a seperate custom program that will help better in noisy envirnoments that are similar to when you are fire-fighting. Not only loud noise from a fire, but the water from the hose, and also men yelling loudly to communicate. I can see how this would be a real tough issue to work around.

 

[Jane B.]

Well, in my daughters case, the CI is located above the ear line slightly, which means it is difficult for her to wear a regular hat, because it collides with the magnet/driver, and pushes it off. You can get head bands and other things to hold them in place so they don't fall off. You then have to adjust the hat band much bigger to fit over the CI if needed. Everyone is different in this case, because the surgeons tend to mount the CI in a spot wear the bone is most accomodating for the implant. This of course changes for everyone.

Which brand or model of Hearing Aids do you currently have?

I assume they are programmable? If so, then I wonder if your Audi can't tune them with a separate custom program that will help better in noisy environments that are similar to when you are fire-fighting. Not only loud noise from a fire, but the water from the hose, and also men yelling loudly to communicate. I can see how this would be a real tough issue to work around.

The last paragraph of what Condor1970 wrote has given me an idea. Is there a way to get a recording at a fire to play back to your audi as a programing guide?

 

[Condor1970]

The last paragraph of what Condor1970 wrote has given me an idea. Is there a way to get a recording at a fire to play back to your audi as a programing guide?

Rent the movie "Backdraft"

LOL. Just kidding. I doubt that soundtrack would be ideal for what one hears in a real fire.

The only way I would think of, is if he actually recorded some sounds of the hoses and fires during training exercises.

From what I know, the programs already in existence for noisy environments like restaurants, etc, should help since they drown out other frequencies, and center on the human voice range much more so.

I wonder if getting a set of "over the ear" headphones and microphone for communication to isolate surrounding noise would help him?

Maybe something like this, with lots of passive sound suppression.

http://www.firecom.com/products/wireless-headsets/uhw-57/

 

[nozzleman6]

My problems with my hearing are not affected as much on duty versus off duty. I actually do quite well with my hearing aids in a fire situation. I have the compilot that uses a Bluetooth signal which relays right into my hearing aids. I actually hear better in fire than people with normal hearing. The difference is they are relying on hearing a portable radio and I am listening to radio traffic just like if I was wearing a set of headphones. Compilot is amazing!

In the fire engine I have a noise cancelling headset made by firecom. Much like the one in the above photo. In fact I had that exact one probably 10 years ago.

My hearing aids are Phonak, not sure which series. They are digital and Bluetooth. Honestly as good as these hearing aids are, they are terrible in most situations. In large rooms with poor acoustics and places with a lot of conversation they are practically useless.

On a side note, I find it so flustrating trying to dial in this hearing aids in a audiologist room that is dead quiet. They move a few things around and ask how it sounds now? It sounds the same lol (we are in a noiseless place.)

 

[Jane B.]

My problems with my hearing are not affected as much on duty versus off duty. I actually do quite well with my hearing aids in a fire situation. I have the compilot that uses a Bluetooth signal which relays right into my hearing aids. I actually hear better in fire than people with normal hearing. The difference is they are relying on hearing a portable radio and I am listening to radio traffic just like if I was wearing a set of headphones. Compilot is amazing!

In the fire engine I have a noise cancelling headset made by firecom. Much like the one in the above photo. In fact I had that exact one probably 10 years ago.

My hearing aids are Phonak, not sure which series. They are digital and Bluetooth. Honestly as good as these hearing aids are, they are terrible in most situations. In large rooms with poor acoustics and places with a lot of conversation they are practically useless.

On a side note, I find it so flustrating trying to dial in this hearing aids in a audiologist room that is dead quiet. They move a few things around and ask how it sounds now? It sounds the same lol (we are in a noiseless place.)

I have not gone back to see if this was mentioned close to the start of this thread but the paragraph I added the bold to makes me wonder if it would help to turn a radio on during these appointments.

It sounds to me like your aids are part of the Nadia series.

 

[nozzleman6]

Yes I have the Nadia series.

Well tomorrow is my appointment to meet with the implant people.. I am pretty excited as I have been waiting over a month for this appointment.

I am surprised I haven't got more response from this thread. This is my first attempt to communicate on a forum like this and was hoping for a little more feedback. Thank you to all who have responded. M

 

[HOH-ME]

Yes I have the Nadia series.

Well tomorrow is my appointment to meet with the implant people.. I am pretty excited as I have been waiting over a month for this appointment.

I am surprised I haven't got more response from this thread. This is my first attempt to communicate on a forum like this and was hoping for a little more feedback. Thank you to all who have responded. M

They hybrids are pretty new and not many people have them. Like we've said, the issue is the technology behind them and being stuck with the bottom of the market CI if the HA portion isn't beneficial. If you need a CI, get a CI, especially if you are using the Naida hearing aids. You won't get that technology with the Cochlear hybrid.

 

[nozzleman6]

Just curious, why would you think I need a full CI. I have minimal low frequency loss and all my high frequencies score 100. I basically have no highs at all.

From what I understand, (granted I will learn a lot more tomorrow) I only need the CI for the highs. Doing a full CI would cause a patient to lose all there hearing in that ear. Whereas, a hybrid allows you to keep what you have and add the highs that you are missing.

I will come back on here after tomorrows appointment and maybe clear things up for anyone that is interested. Maybe someone else will be in my shoes and this could be beneficial to them.

Question for HoH-me... Are you able to wear a hat with your CI? Also, would you mind sharing what situation you are in and your history. Thanks Mike

 

[BleedingPurist]

Just curious, why would you think I need a full CI. I have minimal low frequency loss and all my high frequencies score 100. I basically have no highs at all.

From what I understand, (granted I will learn a lot more tomorrow) I only need the CI for the highs. Doing a full CI would cause a patient to lose all there hearing in that ear. Whereas, a hybrid allows you to keep what you have and add the highs that you are missing.

I will come back on here after tomorrows appointment and maybe clear things up for anyone that is interested. Maybe someone else will be in my shoes and this could be beneficial to them.

Question for HoH-me... Are you able to wear a hat with your CI? Also, would you mind sharing what situation you are in and your history. Thanks Mike

They will be able to let you know whether you qualify for the Hybrid, but in the meantime you should also be opening your mind to getting a standard CI. Honestly, it is truly freeing to not deal with Hearing Aid nonsense ever again: feedback, tubes, earmolds, itchy ear from moisture trapped inside.

The L24, which is the hybrid implant, is one of the most basic implants. On the other hand, if you qualify for the L24, you wouldn't currently qualify for any other implant. If the reverse is true, this is actually a good thing. Med El and AB are both superior with their internal technology and programmable parameters that can make a big difference in the sound quality of what you hear and make music an enjoyable experience. Cochlear has the most minimal programming parameters. It's a catch 22 because they may be your only choice.. at this time. Both Med El and AB are working for similar FDA approval of their own devices. AB's current electrode is already set for use with a Hybrid processor and HA. Med El already offers a Hybrid overseas.

 

[HOH-ME]

Just curious, why would you think I need a full CI. I have minimal low frequency loss and all my high frequencies score 100. I basically have no highs at all.

From what I understand, (granted I will learn a lot more tomorrow) I only need the CI for the highs. Doing a full CI would cause a patient to lose all there hearing in that ear. Whereas, a hybrid allows you to keep what you have and add the highs that you are missing.

I will come back on here after tomorrows appointment and maybe clear things up for anyone that is interested. Maybe someone else will be in my shoes and this could be beneficial to them.

Question for HoH-me... Are you able to wear a hat with your CI? Also, would you mind sharing what situation you are in and your history. Thanks Mike

I had sudden loss when I was 30, about 50% loss in both ears. My hearing has gradually declined since to the point I really struggled understanding. My aided scores pre-implant were in the 30% range. I had near perfect low frequency hearing before implant and then a sharp ski slope loss after that, so pretty similar to what you have from what it sounds like. I would have been a perfect candidate for a hybrid too but I just couldn't get past the fact that the implant technology was substandard. I am bilaterally implanted with Advanced Bionics and use Naida processors. My most recent scores, a year into this, are 100% AZ Bio sentences and single words with 85% AZ bio sentences in noise without using my noise program and 100% with the noise program in my Naida.

I have some low tone hearing left, not really usable but if something drops on the floor I can hear it kind of thing. I can hear some beeps on the beep tests at a few frequencies but its mostly going away now, but who cares, I can participate in conversations, hear just fine over the phone, I can have conversations in the car with people in the back seat and I don't struggle at all to understand. I can go to movies and hear and understand just fine. I go out to restaurants and hear better than "normal" hearing people....I simply have a life again.

Hats, I hate hats so I'm not the best person to ask, but if I wear a hat, you have to be a bit careful how you put them on. The magnets holding your headpiece on should be "just" strong enough to hold but not so strong that it doesn't come off easily. Plenty of people wear hats and do fine though. It just takes some adjusting to learn how to get the hat on.

Point being, if you go for the hybrid, you will sacrifice overall hearing to save what little lowtone you have for now...then when that goes, you are stuck with the technology in your head...and that technology isn't very good. Getting a better implant to start, will garner far better results for your lifetime, not just looking at the next couple years. If Advanced Bionics was going into your head with a hybrid, my answer would have been totally different, and I probably would have gotten a hybrid myself. The long range benefits of getting a full CI FAR, FAR, FAR outweigh what little hearing you have now. Trust me, I had a few panic moments over losing that hearing as well, but my speech scores speak for themselves.

 

[HOH-ME]

They will be able to let you know whether you qualify for the Hybrid, but in the meantime you should also be opening your mind to getting a standard CI. Honestly, it is truly freeing to not deal with Hearing Aid nonsense ever again: feedback, tubes, earmolds, itchy ear from moisture trapped inside.

The L24, which is the hybrid implant, is one of the most basic implants. On the other hand, if you qualify for the L24, you wouldn't currently qualify for any other implant. If the reverse is true, this is actually a good thing. Med El and AB are both superior with their internal technology and programmable parameters that can make a big difference in the sound quality of what you hear and make music an enjoyable experience. Cochlear has the most minimal programming parameters. It's a catch 22 because they may be your only choice.. at this time. Both Med El and AB are working for similar FDA approval of their own devices. AB's current electrode is already set for use with a Hybrid processor and HA. Med El already offers a Hybrid overseas.

That is not necessarily true. I qualified for the hybrid and the traditional CI.

 

[BleedingPurist]

That is not necessarily true. I qualified for the hybrid and the traditional CI.

Where are you? The FDA has laid out very specific requirements for qualifying for the L24. Most clinics will not implant someone with the type of loss acceptable for the L24 with a standard array, they are told they need to lose more hearing.

 

[everlastingstorm]

It's also a possibility to lose a good chunk of, if not most or all, of the "preserved" low-frequency hearing with hybrid implants, over time. I know of a family friend who qualified for the hybrid and got that, obviously it was a Cochlear brand because that is the brand that offers the hybrid at this time in the USA. She says the acoustic hearing aid portion is useless for her now. Now, she's left with only some mid frequencies and high frequencies, and a max IDR of 45. She has no way to use any low frequency hearing because there isn't enough amplification for it, or it has reached the level where there's nothing to amplify. And there are no electrodes to stimulate lower frequencies with that type of implant.

I had a discussion with my audiologist about this. He told me that about 30% of those who are implanted with hybrids eventually lose their low frequency hearing in addition to what hearing loss they already had in mid and high frequencies. Essentially, it's surgery that it comes down to and no matter how good the surgeon or the electrode, something going into that tiny cochlea is going to be a trauma to that area, resulting in some kind of alteration down the line.

The full, traditional CI does not go as far as the apex of the cochlea where the lowest frequencies are assigned. However, the first two electrodes in my implant are responsible for stimulating SOME low frequency information, and I respond to 250hz at 20db on my audiogram. I am able to hear men as one would expect them to sound, I hear bass in music, I can hear drills and cars and that sort of thing with my traditional CI (I have Advanced Bionics). The brain makes up for the rest.

My hearing loss configuration was different than the OP's, and my speech scores were within the traditional CI criteria so I never qualified for a hybrid. If I did though, I would be very wary of getting the hybrid due to the possibility of losing low frequency hearing without any means of being able to stimulate it otherwise, besides the limiting technology that Cochlear currently offers.

If your speech scores fall within the criteria for a traditional CI, then I would go for a traditional CI over a hybrid.