It's so simple!

If we are discussing education, we will come to a concensus much sooner if we debate from what works or does not work for MOST.
 
Cheri said:
You think hearing kids have full language at home? Not always, My sister happen to be a teacher, and she had tell us all about her students, some of their language delays because parents refused to help their children at home, the school cannot do this alone, they need the parents help too; problems will not resolve on their own. The earlier children gets help both home and at school, the greater their progress will be. :)
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It is hard to explain what I mean via Internet. Probably would be easier in person so its ok.

Thanks
 
Tousi said:
If we are discussing education, we will come to a concensus much sooner if we debate from what works or does not work for MOST.
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I agree and that is what I am doing. I give up. Just gonna go back to teaching and try to help those kids who come to our program after falling behind in other programs. I really hate it when that happens but oh well.
 
Tousi said:
If we are discussing education, we will come to a concensus much sooner if we debate from what works or does not work for MOST.
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Well they're trying to tell us bi-bi is the way for the majority of deaf students when some of us here have no experience of knowing how bi-bi runs, just words from the mouth, how is that suppose to help us determine the best environment for the education of children who are deaf? I've gotten to experienced cued speech, oral and total communication so I know how those programs runs, from what I've been reading, bi-bi does not spend time working on audition or speech. You can find that here: Options in Deaf Education-History, Methodologies, and Strategies for Surviving the System

And DD, you stated that some kids did well in mainstreamed and the majority of them did not, Where I've done my research it says a small minority of profoundly deaf children had graduated with a low reading /language during being mainstreamed.
 
Cheri said:
Well they're trying to tell us bi-bi is the way for the majority of deaf students when some of us here have no experience of knowing how bi-bi runs, just words from the mouth, how is that suppose to help us determine the best environment for the education of children who are deaf? I've gotten to experienced cued speech, oral and total communication so I know how those programs runs, from what I've been reading, bi-bi does not spend time working on audition or speech. You can find that here: Options in Deaf Education-History, Methodologies, and Strategies for Surviving the System

And DD, you stated that some kids did well in mainstreamed and the majority of them did not, Where I've done my research it says a small minority of profoundly deaf children had graduated with a low reading /language during being mainstreamed.
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What is said in the books sometimes doesnt reflect what happens in real life all the time.

What about the socio/emotional needs of the deaf children in the mainstreamed programs? Is that factored in the research u have done? What research is that anyway?

You seem to spend so much time researchng on Deaf ed but yet dont work in the field of Deaf ed. Can I ask why? The reason I am asking cuz it seems you are really interested in it and everything so are u willing to make a career of it? Just curious and u dont have to answer if u dont feel comfortable with it. :)
 
shel90 said:
I have never seen a deaf child with normal intelligent capacity struggle with ASL. Usually when a young deaf child is shown to have struggles with acquiring ASL it is due to cognitive processing issues not cuz of ASL itself. Same concept with those hearing kids who struggle with acquiring spoken English.
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Exactly. And in those cases, we need to employ methodologies that have been shown to be successful in working with kids with cognitive deficiencies.
 
shel90 said:
Are hearing kids deprived of full language access? Only if they are deprived of any contact with another human being.

The language delays in these hearing kids are mainly because of cognitive processing issues like LD, neorological disorders, or other conditions not because they were deprived of full access to language.

Deaf kids are constantly put at risk for language delays when they dont have full acess to language both at home and school.

That is what I am referring to.
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And hearing kids that experience language delays are under IEPs and receive the services specific for the problem they have that is causing their language delay. That would fall under "Special Education", not "Deaf Education". The two issues cannot be compared when deciding policy for deaf students, as the majority of deaf students do not have other cognitive problems that would interfere with their ability to learn. The hearing children that the poster compared them to do have additional problems that interfere with their ability to learn.
 
Cheri said:
You think hearing kids have full language at home? Not always, My sister happen to be a teacher, and she had tell us all about her students, some of their language delays because parents refused to help their children at home, the school cannot do this alone, they need the parents help too; problems will not resolve on their own. The earlier children gets help both home and at school, the greater their progress will be. :)
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That has absolutely nothing to do with deaf education. A hearing child who does not have full access to language at home still has the opportunity to gain full access in all situations. A deaf child who is not provided with visual language does not have that opportunity.
 
shel90 said:
What is said in the books sometimes doesnt reflect what happens in real life all the time.

What about the socio/emotional needs of the deaf children in the mainstreamed programs? Is that factored in the research u have done? What research is that anyway?

You seem to spend so much time researchng on Deaf ed but yet dont work in the field of Deaf ed. Can I ask why? The reason I am asking cuz it seems you are really interested in it and everything so are u willing to make a career of it? Just curious and u dont have to answer if u dont feel comfortable with it. :)
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You know, it has always seem ironic to me that those who are doing nothing to change the field of education for deaf children, and improve their opportunities for the future are the first to complain about those that are.
 
Tousi said:
If we are discussing education, we will come to a concensus much sooner if we debate from what works or does not work for MOST.
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Exactly. Set the policy based on the majority. For those that are unable to fit that designation, and that have additional problems, the policy can be amended via the use of an IEP that creates additional services.

One oral success cannot discount the sad fact that the vast majority of deaf children are recieving substandard education based on a faulty educational system.
 
jillio said:
You know, it has always seem ironic to me that those who are doing nothing to change the field of education for deaf children, and improve their opportunities for the future are the first to complain about those that are.
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I know..it is like the saying goes.."Complain about how the country is governed? Vote! "
 
jillio said:
You know, it has always seem ironic to me that those who are doing nothing to change the field of education for deaf children, and improve their opportunities for the future are the first to complain about those that are.
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How do you know we aren't doing nothing about it? You sure make assumptions way too much, it getting annoying already. If you want people to post in your thread, why don't you start with being more polite.
 
shel90 said:
I know..it is like the saying goes.."Complain about how the country is governed? Vote! "
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This is a discussion forum yes or no? Are we allow to have our say or it has to be your way or the highway?
 
Cheri said:
How do you know we aren't doing nothing about it? You sure make assumptions way too much, it getting annoying already. If you want people to post in your thread, why don't you start with being more polite.
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You are assuming I was talking about you, so it would appear that assumptions are made by both sides.

Okay, lets say my assumption was in error. Exactly what are you doing to change the education of deaf children? I wasn't aware that you were actively involved in advocacy in the educational system, or that you were employed within the educationtal system. I haven't heard you talk about any of the conferences concerning such that you have attended. I haven't heard you tell of any activities in which you are involved that could be considered advocacy for change. And given some of the confusion you have shown regarding various methodologies, I think my assumption was a safe one.

So, since you haven't spoken about any of this, please, let us know exactly what it is that you are doing to campaign for change in deaf edcuation. Then no one will make these assumptions.
 
I have one question Jillio-- My question is why all sudden this thread becomes a question about me? This is about deaf education about deaf children is it or not? Then why are you trying to shift this topic to an opposite direction? It seem to me, You don't like my answers, you gonna learn to deal with someone who thinks different than you. :)
 
Cheri said:
I have one question Jillio-- My question is why all sudden this thread becomes a question about me? This is about deaf education about deaf children is it or not? Then why are you trying to shift this topic to an opposite direction? It seem to me, You don't like my answers, you gonna learn to deal with someone who thinks different than you. :)
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You made it about you in post #93. And yes, the thread is about the education of deaf children. So, what are you doing to improve the education of deaf children?
 
jillio said:
You made it about you in post #93.
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Good Lord you need to take up reading classes, I said "How do you know we aren't doing nothing about it?" not just only me. Let's get back on topic shall we please?
 
Cheri said:
Good Lord you need to take up reading classes, I said "How do you know we aren't doing nothing about it?" not just only me. Let's get back on topic shall we please?
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Let's see.....you were responding to a post that said that those who compalin the most are the ones that aren't doing anything to change the situation. Since you responded with "we", it is evident that you are including yourself in that group identified as "we".

Likewise, "you" can be meant as a plural, not the singular you.

So, what is the "we" you speak of doing to improve the education of deaf children? You keep refusing to answer the question. As the topic is the improvement of education for deaf children, this is decidedly on topic.
 
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