Is it really so bad to know SEE (Sign Exact English?)

Other than English, what other languages depend on an invented code to learn?
 
Reba said:
Other than English, what other languages depend on an invented code to learn?
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Not only that, it seems like deaf people are the only ones who get subjected to invented languages. The oralism movement in the 1800s sure has ruined things, heh?

If parents want to use SEE with their children, I won't be stopping them as it is not my decision but I wouldn't recommend it. Just my :2c:
 
Frisky Feline said:
curious, what is difference between see 1 and see 2?
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Basic break down of the two:

SEEING ESSENTIAL ENGLISH (SEE 1) and SIGNED EXACT ENGLISH (SEE II) -- The ideas behind these systems is that Deaf children will learn English better if they are exposed, visually through signs, to the grammatical features of English. The base signs are borrowed from ASL, but the various inflections are not used. A lot of initialization is used. Additionally, a lot of “grammatical markers” for numbers, person, tense, etc., are added, and strict English word order is used. Every prefix, suffix, article, conjunction, auxiliary verb, etc., is signed. Also, English homophones are represented by identical signs (i.e. the same sign is used for the noun fish and the verb fish, which have different ASL signs). The difference between the two is minor--the principle one being that in SEE II, ASL signs for compound words (like butterfly) are used, where the two signs representing the separate English words are used in SEE I (To sign “butterfly,” you would sign BUTTER and FLY, which gives a bizarre visual to the deaf child!).
Signed Systems
 
Reba said:
Basic break down of the two:

SEEING ESSENTIAL ENGLISH (SEE 1) and SIGNED EXACT ENGLISH (SEE II) -- The ideas behind these systems is that Deaf children will learn English better if they are exposed, visually through signs, to the grammatical features of English. The base signs are borrowed from ASL, but the various inflections are not used. A lot of initialization is used. Additionally, a lot of “grammatical markers” for numbers, person, tense, etc., are added, and strict English word order is used. Every prefix, suffix, article, conjunction, auxiliary verb, etc., is signed. Also, English homophones are represented by identical signs (i.e. the same sign is used for the noun fish and the verb fish, which have different ASL signs). The difference between the two is minor--the principle one being that in SEE II, ASL signs for compound words (like butterfly) are used, where the two signs representing the separate English words are used in SEE I (To sign “butterfly,” you would sign BUTTER and FLY, which gives a bizarre visual to the deaf child!).
Signed Systems
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I was a kid, signed SEE. I didnt know which one I used SEE 1 or SEE2. But i didn't use "butter.. fly" I signed in a full sentence like, " I am go ING TO THE store. I finishED my breakfast this morning. ING, ED, TO, THE, SHE, HE, THEY,. SEE 1 and SEE 2 look same to me though.
 
Reba said:
Other than English, what other languages depend on an invented code to learn?
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umm...most its called an alphabet. You take these symbols and put them in an established and agreed upon sequence to represent a spoken word. Then you put the words together to form sentences, sentences together to form paragraphs.....
 
CSign said:
I wasn't asking if it was necessary. My question is are you opposed to the use of a tool (in this case SEE) that can make the acquisition of language (English) easier?

This question isn't about the merits of ASL.

There are many roads to an end.
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CSign interesting that the ones most vehemently opposed to it are those who earn their living off the deaf and need to keep them from being able to acquire spoken language.
Rick
 
rick48 said:
CSign interesting that the ones most vehemently opposed to it are those who earn their living off the deaf and need to keep them from being able to acquire spoken language.
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Just like the CI companies, yes?
 
Frisky Feline said:
I was a kid, signed SEE. I didnt know which one I used SEE 1 or SEE2. But i didn't use "butter.. fly" I signed in a full sentence like, " I am go ING TO THE store. I finishED my breakfast this morning. ING, ED, TO, THE, SHE, HE, THEY,. SEE 1 and SEE 2 look same to me though.
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To be honest, sometimes the instructors themselves either don't know or mix the two together.

I wonder which "fly" the SEEers use for "butter-fly?" I don't think any of them would be as pretty as the ASL BUTTERFLY.

1. "butter-fly (like a plane)"

2. "butter-fly (bug)"

3. "butter-fly (pants zipper)"
 
rick48 said:
umm...most its called an alphabet. You take these symbols and put them in an established and agreed upon sequence to represent a spoken word. Then you put the words together to form sentences, sentences together to form paragraphs.....
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I meant to learn the language.

As an English speaker, if I wanted to learn Greek, would I use a made-up code that was neither English nor Greek in order to learn Greek?
 
rick48 said:
CSign interesting that the ones most vehemently opposed to it are those who earn their living off the deaf and need to keep them from being able to acquire spoken language.
Rick
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Interesting how some people like to make accusations that are major baloney.

If you're referring to interpreters, of which I am one, it might interest you that I haven't been earning a living off anyone much less "the deaf" in almost a year. Even when I did interpret for pay it was never money out of the pocket of a deaf person. Also, I don't "need" to keep anyone from anything. I had a professional career for 24 years prior to interpreting, and I expect to have another career after. I interpret because I want to, not because I need to for money.

For your information, SEE has nothing to do with deaf people acquiring a spoken language. News flash--There are deaf people who use ASL and can speak, read, and write English. There are also SEE users who are functionally illiterate in English.
 
shel90 said:
And speech therapists...the list is endless.
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Really? You are aware that speech therapy is employed by the hearing as well? Two examples would be stroke survivors and hearing children with speech difficulties, so I really think the above statement implies that STs are preying upon the deaf, and, that simply isn't true.
 
Reba said:
Other than English, what other languages depend on an invented code to learn?
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I have always been impressed with Cued Speech...
Easy to learn for people that have no knowledge of sign and a way to cue any sound.
Wish it had been available in Norway or Holland.

Here's a great [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=plPw4H-ZsMg"]video[/ame] about Cued Speech..
 
Reba said:
To be honest, sometimes the instructors themselves either don't know or mix the two together.

I wonder which "fly" the SEEers use for "butter-fly?" I don't think any of them would be as pretty as the ASL BUTTERFLY.

1. "butter-fly (like a plane)"

2. "butter-fly (bug)"

3. "butter-fly (pants zipper)"
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:laugh2:
 
Cloggy said:
I have always been impressed with Cued Speech...
Easy to learn for people that have no knowledge of sign and a way to cue any sound.
Wish it had been available in Norway or Holland.

Here's a great video about Cued Speech..
Click to expand...

:iough:
 
Oceanbreeze said:
Really? You are aware that speech therapy is employed by the hearing as well? Two examples would be stroke survivors and hearing children with speech difficulties, so I really think the above statement implies that STs are preying upon the deaf, and, that simply isn't true.
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Do not address to me, you traitor. I learned of the truth what you did behind my back. Iam going to block you. U make me sick.
 
Cloggy said:
I have always been impressed with Cued Speech...
Easy to learn for people that have no knowledge of sign and a way to cue any sound.
Wish it had been available in Norway or Holland.

Here's a great video about Cued Speech..
Click to expand...
So, no languages other than English use invented codes in order to learn their languages.

An English speaker does not use an invented code in order learn Greek.
 
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