Interpreting Musical Theater

[Reba]

but I've never experienced having to interpret dialogue. I intended on doing songs like "Confrontation" with Valjean and Javert sequentially....

I'm back home now, so I can catch up on these posts.

I spent all day yesterday (Saturday) out of state at a workshop for interpreters. The topic was the dos and don'ts of interpreting and performing songs in ASL. The instructor had quite a bit of theatrical interpreting experience. She was a graduate of the theatrical interpreting program at Juilliard.

I had a private chat with her after the workshop was over. I asked what advice she would give for your situation. Her reply was, "I'm sorry but there is no way that play should be interpreted with any fewer than three experienced, certified interpreters. Otherwise, if there are any Deaf audience there, they will feel cheated. Also, the student 'interpreter's' reputation and name will be discredited in the Deaf community forever. She is in way over her head. If she doesn't even know how to role shift, then she is no way ready to interpret."

I was hoping against hope to get more positive suggestions for you but this is the honest reply.

Sorry.

 

[HoHGuyOhio]

Also, the student 'interpreter's' reputation and name will be discredited in the Deaf community forever.

I'm sorry...this rubs me the wrong way. I understand the desire of interpreter trainers to put the fear of god in students who might start unscrupulously "interpreting" waaay before they're ready. But when someone speaks in absolutes, they turn me off.

In order to teach ethical decision making, one has to start while still a student. Someone needs to guide this student through an ethical decision-making process--what is the conflict, what are the options and how will each option affect all stakeholders, and what is my decision and why? The decision should be anchored to something tangible (Code of Professional Conduct, ethical business practices, Demand-Control Schema, etc.).

Just my $.02 worth.

 

[Reba]

I'm sorry...this rubs me the wrong way.

I'm sorry, I was just quoting what the senior instructor told me.

I understand the desire of interpreter trainers to put the fear of god in students who might start unscrupulously "interpreting" waaay before they're ready.

I don't think Cassidia is an ITP student. I think she is a high school student who is taking some ASL classes.

In order to teach ethical decision making, one has to start while still a student. Someone needs to guide this student through an ethical decision-making process--what is the conflict, what are the options and how will each option affect all stakeholders, and what is my decision and why? The decision should be anchored to something tangible (Code of Professional Conduct, ethical business practices, Demand-Control Schema, etc.).

Cassidia said that she is working with a certified mentor. Apparently, this mentor hasn't brought up any of this information with her (very odd). Why else is she asking for such basic information on this forum?

Going thru this process via forum posts is not the best way learn about interpreter ethics, that's for sure. We respond in a vacuum, without all the background information. One of my faults is I sometimes answer quickly and compactly due to time constraints on my on-line access. Not good.

I discussed with the instructor my reluctance to be so blunt with the student. I really don't want to discourage future terps from the field, and I don't want to squelch anyone's enthusiasm. But sometimes people need a reality check in order to prevent even worse blows later.

I hope Cassidia is sharing this information with her mentor, and that it will open up further dialog between the two of them.

I would feel better about the Les Miz situation if the certified terp was doing the play with Cassidia. Based on her posts, it doesn't seem that the mentor is involved. I hope I'm wrong about that.

Just my $.02 worth.

That's all I'm offering, too.

 

[HoHGuyOhio]

I understand you were just relaying the information you received from the workshop presenter, and I agree that the original poster really shouldn't (can't) do this alone. I agree with that. I just think the workshop presenter is using a scare tactic instead of offering any real advice.

 

[Cassidia]

I am not a ITP student, but I do consider myself above just a teenager who has taken a few classes. I have been studying sign language intensley for 12 years, I just have never been in a theatrical signing environment before. My mentor and I have not had much contact as of recently because of the demands of her job. We are getting together multiple times in the next week and thats when we plan to get the bulk of the work done. I came to this board for any valuable tips that the multitalented people who view this would be able to give me. I really do appreciate all of your help. Thanks for everything!

 

[Etoile]

Studying sign language is not the same thing as studying interpreting. You have to know how to interpret, not just how to sign. And Les Miz is a very big project to take on without having any prior formal/theatrical interpreting eduction. Best of luck!

 

[Ariakkas]

you terps on this forum really know how to run people off.


instead of criticizing her and making assumptions about her skill level, how about just answering her questions? she doesn't need you guys to tell her she cant do it, she needs you to help her in the areas she is not strong in.

its not your job to save the deaf community from every interpreter that might stumble along the way. the deaf community is capable of voicing their opinions, and they can vote with their feet if they arent satisified with her performance and abilities. its a service just like any other. sometimes it sucks.

 

[Cassidia]

you terps on this forum really know how to run people off.


instead of criticizing her and making assumptions about her skill level, how about just answering her questions? she doesn't need you guys to tell her she cant do it, she needs you to help her in the areas she is not strong in.

its not your job to save the deaf community from every interpreter that might stumble along the way. the deaf community is capable of voicing their opinions, and they can vote with their feet if they arent satisified with her performance and abilities. its a service just like any other. sometimes it sucks.

thank you...i think haha. but really, thank you, it hasnt been particularly good for my self esteem to have a lot of people say its nearly impossible. i'm gonna try my hardest for sure!!

 

[Ariakkas]

heh sorry, didnt mean it to come off that way.

 

[Interpretrator]

its a service just like any other. sometimes it sucks.

And heaven forbid we should hope for it to suck a little less.

The show is extremely demanding. I'm a professional interpreter with theatrical experience, plus I know the show by heart, and I'd still never interpret it on my own. (Ha ha, on my...uh...no pun intended, actually.) That has nothing to do with Cassidia's skills, it's the nature of the show. If that's "running someone off" then, frankly, oh well. Cassidia seems to me to be a little more resilient than you give her credit for.

it hasnt been particularly good for my self esteem to have a lot of people say its nearly impossible.

I think you're taking all this the wrong way. What I think we're all saying is not that you personally are not qualified to do this show (since how could we, never having seen you sign?) but that the nature of the show makes it very, very difficult for one person to interpret. That should have no bearing on your self-esteem.

But I'm still confused by one thing. I've never in my life heard of someone who's studied sign language for 12 years and doesn't know the concept of role shifting. Again, I'm not commenting on your skills, but role shift is such an integral part of signing (never mind interpreting), I don't understand how that could have been left out of your education. Unless you simply have a different term for it.

 

[Ariakkas]

my high school did grease one year...i was only a few scenes and not the whole show....so maybe this is the same thing?


my point being, she came here for help. with or without your help she is going to be doing it for her senior project. you claim you want to make it suck less, then help her out instead of trying to make her feel inadequate. the more confident she is the better she will do.


this isn't a broadway show with customers paying 100 bucks a ticket, its a high school musical, the show itself will probrably suck anyway.

 

[Interpretrator]

my high school did grease one year...i was only a few scenes and not the whole show....so maybe this is the same thing?

She says:

yes we're using a turntable, yes we're using the barricade. I have been practicing pretty much the entire show with the exception of a few scenes

its a high school musical, the show itself will probrably suck anyway.

I definitely see where your comments are, by comparison, positive and nurturing.

I'm not the type to blow smoke up someone's butt just to boost his or her confidence. I wasn't babied as a new terp myself and I was taught that one of the most ethically important things for an interpreter is to know one's limits, and not to take something on if it is too far over your head. My impression from the interpreters' reactions in this thread is that we feel this may be over a new interpreter's head, especially one who is not familiar with some basic elements of ASL, not to mention interpreting.

I agree that the pronouncement of Reba's instructor may have been a little harsh (i.e. I seriously doubt Cassidia's name is going to be forever tarnished in the community, sheesh), but I don't disagree with the basic sentiments. If there were definitely not going to be any deaf people in the audience, this might be okay as a practice run. But if there are going to be deaf people expecting at the very least to be able to follow the show, one signer who has never done theatrical interpreting working on a large sung-through show just isn't going to cut it. Hell, one experienced professional working on a large sung-through show probably wouldn't cut it.

That's the advice we have. I won't speak for everyone else but personally I'll apologize if it's not what you or Cassidia wanted to hear. I think the kinds of questions she asks are much better put to the professional she's working with, since unfortunately it's impossible to teach role shift on a web forum. And hopefully she will get to team with her mentor, which would most likely work out better for all involved.

The reason I didn't give any advice is because mine doesn't seem possible at this point, which would have been to see an interpreted performance of a similar show, like Phantom of the Opera. I don't think there's any better way to learn how musical theatre interpreting works than to see it in action. But since this is taking place in a month, it's probably not feasible.

 

[Ariakkas]

this is a high school kid we are talking about, not an adult.


to come on here and ask for help and hear these kinds of replies is very discouraging. i came on here and said a few things, and your guys replies made me stay away from this particular forum for quite a while.

you guys can be more supportive while getting your point across at the same time. i feel like people on this particular board only try and tear down anyone who isn't already certified and dares to try and get expierence. you yourself weren't shat out of the womb with full terp qualifications.

role shifting is not some supernatural secret passed down from teacher to terp, ohioguys explaination i felt was spot on. i knew what role shifting is, but i didn't know it was called role shifting. i learned all my sign outside of a classroom. maybe she wasn't clear what you all meant?

perhaps she only has conversations and doesn't tell stories?


i get your point about 1 terp not doing the show, really i do. i get that its a tough job for even a qualified terp to do alone, but it looks like she doesn't have much of a choice and will be doing it anyway, so why not help her out the best you can? or at least not say anything. thats better than all the negativity.

i wonder, if she takes your advice and doesn't terp the show, then deaf really do show up to enjoy the play expecting some sort of a terp there.....how much do you think they will enjoy the show? even if they arent expecting a terp and they show up, what then?

your point about knowing your limits goes without saying, but its not like she works for some agency and can get someone to replace her, and she certainly isn't getting paid for this, as far as i know anway.

 

[Interpretrator]

or at least not say anything. thats better than all the negativity.

the show itself will probrably suck anyway.

Check that glass house you're projecting in.

 

[Ariakkas]

how does that comment compare with yours? even you using that comment out of context like you did, its still not attacking this girl personally. shes not acting in the show.

my glass house seems pretty safe.

 

[Tousi]

I believe Reba and Interpretator gave realistic, sound, discourse about this whole thing. They didn't insult, belittle and all the other stuff your'e trying to see into....your veiled attempt at goading them has failed miserably, Ariakkas. And to what end?

To the originator of this topic...I hope it goes well for you and that you take to heart the suggestion of adding a couple more interpreters. Or, and this is just me talking now, don't do it at all.

 

[Reba]

Cassidia, here are some resources you can use:

Sign the Speech: An Introduction To Theatrical Interpreting by Julie Gebron, 1996 Butte Publications, Inc. (ISBN 1-884362-04-4 for online search). I got my copy from Sign Enhancers, Inc.

So You Want To Be An Interpreter? by Janice H. Humphrey and Bob J. Alcorn, H&H Publishers, distributed by Sign Enhancers. (ISBN 0-9640367-1-1) There is a section on theatrical interpreting in the book.

 

[Reba]

Here are some notes I took at the workshop:

INTERPRETING MUSIC

The Do's

find different ways to express repetitive phrases

prepare; know the meaning and point

say "no" if you can't do it

appropriate costuming (solid, dark, nothing shiny) and makeup

know the material

be a fluent signer

use clear, big signs

be confident

use Deaf rhythm * - * - ***

include the beat of the music

you can sign instrumentals if you know the words (but it's not required)



The Don'ts

close your eyes

do "air" guitars or other instruments except to introduce them

move while throwing focus (includes scratching nose, fixing hair)

exaggerate signs (large is OK but not too wild; the signing shouldn't draw attention from the actors)

use "random" name signs

 

[Reba]

Other important skills required for theatrical interpreting:

rehearse, rehearse, rehearse

smooth team interpreting

platform presence and posture

 

[SJCSue]

The show is extremely demanding. I'm a professional interpreter with theatrical experience, plus I know the show by heart, and I'd still never interpret it on my own. (Ha ha, on my...uh...no pun intended, actually.)