France 30 Killed 100 Injured

Ooo not the finger wag..anything but the finger wag...please!

That I can agree with... but I would like to find a confirmed connection... while I realize it is early yet... media, government... heck society at large are so quick to throw the "t" word around for anything from writing a journal to the mass slaughter of thousands of people... many are terroristic acts... but not all... as a society we need to learn to identify and only name a cigar a cigar... for a blunt is not cigar even if it has the same wrappings...
 
well i think if that's a need were screwed.
we need to recognize the enemy (those who commit mass murder for a political gain)who ever it is, can decide when they decide to inform us (those they would seek to murder) or not....


its not like the old days..
its no longer polite.

its no longer..here is the warning, and the time to get away.."
or the
"we did it"

different kinds of monsters now.
how i see it anyway
 
Alright... but by calling everything terrorism does it not strengthen actual terrorist... crazy man bombs a school because the color offended him... point for the terroist... and people happily give up rubbing alcohol... gas leak is mistaken for a bomb and blows up a school ... point on for terrorist and police and dogs are walking the halls of schools daily.... al jaheeb decides he wants more virgins to break in and blows up a school... regardless of the reason the school is leveled... but if all are labeled terrorist attacks society will go on a witch hunt stripping freedoms and killing people left right and center... we are already doing this... and the only way to stop it is to truly identify and name the actions as they are... mass murder, horrible incident, terrorist attack...
I am not always comfortable with the "we did it claim" without some evidence... bomber saying it, ties found, ect... too easy after the fact for a group to claim am action just to booSt their organization's moral and strength
 
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The first thing out of my mouth when I heard the news!! It's not so crazy...I'm just waiting to hear how Obama puts a spin on this....maybe someone said the word "Christian" and it set the poor frustrated guy off.....

Laura
are you trying to get the thread locked ??
 
Alright... but by calling everything terrorism does it not strengthen actual terrorist... crazy man bombs a school because the color offended him... point for the terroist... and people happily give up rubbing alcohol... gas leak is mistaken for a bomb and blows up a school ... point on for terrorist and police and dogs are walking the halls of schools daily.... al jaheeb decides he wants more virgins to break in and blows up a school... regardless of the reason the school is leveled... but if all are labeled terrorist attacks society will go on a witch hunt stripping freedoms and killing people left right and center... we are already doing this... and the only way to stop it is to truly identify and name the actions as they are... mass murder, horrible incident, terrorist attack...
I am not always comfortable with the "we did it claim" without some evidence... bomber saying it, ties found, ect... too easy after the fact for a group to claim am action just to booSt their organization's moral and strength

who is calling everything terrorism?
the classical definition of terrorism was fairly simple.
-a tactic used to spread terror with the aim to influence, or pressure a government.

im not sure how that translates to everything is terrorism.
it seems rather specific

if that crazy man bombed a school bus because he was offended by its color, and wanted to influence the gov to ban that color being used on school buses. id argue indeed that is a terrorist act.
what else could it be?
a friendly hello?

a gas leak obviously doesn't meet the definition of terrorist, if it was accidental, but if humans purposely caused it to make a statement by causing death and destruction then it sure would be classed terrorist.

as for france first question one should ask is
has any terror been spread from the attack\?
if the answer is no then move along.
if the answer is yes then the next question is was the motive for the attack for political gain?

society or governments actions in response is a different issue then the actual terrorist attack.
not every society goes one witch hunt, France most certainly has not went on a witch hunt given the stacks of bodies the last year left there, besides hololands scary finger wagging besides...
ive seen no witch hunt, have you?

france has truly identified who caused the mass murder in paris, they even have caught some of them. did truly identifying those responsible stop future attacks?
clearly no. their is far more to it then simply identifying those who cause the attacks. identifying is one part.

im not sure what the issue is with a group after the fact is claiming responsibility for actions.
how does that in any way at all negate the action to the responsibility.
the tactic of terrorism means your not going to play in the rules. why expect old rules of chivalry and "meet and greet the enemy, state names, show off your nice threads so they know who did it to them" ..will always hold when the tactic itself demonstrates an ability to act outside conventions of what is considered proper and what is not?

movements especially these days can easily gain converts, by a click of a mouse...
does that translate into those converts who do kill for their cause not being terrorist because they.
1)never had any training though left loads of dead
2)never passe dpr muster to be a spokesman for a terrorist group though left loads of dead

where has the idea ever came from that a person who kills for a cause has to be somehow truly initiated into a group of that cause to be used to inflict casualties on the enemy?

half the shit we pulled as anarchist we never claimed responsibility for, does that mean we didnt do it?
no
it means we didnt want to do the cops jobs for them...
simple as that..

were we terror of course not.

we didn't use that tactic. it is a tactic. thats why a war ie the war on terrorism can never win.
u cant win wars against tactics. tactics are tactics.

its as old as war. its nothing new. the word is coined in the 20th century the idea has been used since we have been killing each other since we left the caves...

whether its kill and spread terror to he cave man boss or killing stacks of innocents on a promenade in nice...

if the tactic used is to influence a gov or its polices by the spread of terror, then it is classed terrorist.

was tar and feathering and murdering innocents during the american revolution an act of terror?
if you asked americans they will mostly state no
if you ask Canadians or bits they would answer mostly yes

was nuking cities full of innocents terrorism?

if the Americans would of lost it sure of been classed such
winners arent terrorist..(neat trick uh)

tactics will change in their application. its no longer the 70s.
different monsters now.
the traditional groups who used the western idea of warning time given, the taking of prisoners..negations..so on..
thats long gone..

the application of the tactic has changed.
doe that mean the tactic is no longer terrorism?

interesting question
 
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how the hell does a dude drive 2 miles smoking people and not get blown away far far before those 2 miles are up?

its not like france has never suffered an attack before,
they never had armed cops or solders along the busiest strip int hat town for miles? french troops opack the Famas..not a pea shooter..

nuts

its good to know nothing at all will change and the actions are the same as after the last attack..
(wags index finger like hollande very very serious)

well..
after the next time... which will be soon..
we can cut and paste these words...
same old same old
 
who is calling everything terrorism?
the classical definition of terrorism was fairly simple.
-a tactic used to spread terror with the aim to influence, or pressure a government.

im not sure how that translates to everything is terrorism.
it seems rather specific

if that crazy man bombed a school bus because he was offended by its color, and wanted to influence the gov to ban that color being used on school buses. id argue indeed that is a terrorist act.
what else could it be?
a friendly hello?

a gas leak obviously doesn't meet the definition of terrorist, if it was accidental, but if humans purposely caused it to make a statement by causing death and destruction then it sure would be classed terrorist.

as for france first question one should ask is
has any terror been spread from the attack\?
if the answer is no then move along.
if the answer is yes then the next question is was the motive for the attack for political gain?

society or governments actions in response is a different issue then the actual terrorist attack.
not every society goes one witch hunt, France most certainly has not went on a witch hunt given the stacks of bodies the last year left there, besides hololands scary finger wagging besides...
ive seen no witch hunt, have you?

france has truly identified who caused the mass murder in paris, they even have caught some of them. did truly identifying those responsible stop future attacks?
clearly no. their is far more to it then simply identifying those who cause the attacks. identifying is one part.

im not sure what the issue is with a group after the fact is claiming responsibility for actions.
how does that in any way at all negate the action to the responsibility.
the tactic of terrorism means your not going to play in the rules. why expect old rules of chivalry and "meet and greet the enemy, state names, show off your nice threads so they know who did it to them" ..will always hold when the tactic itself demonstrates an ability to act outside conventions of what is considered proper and what is not?

movements especially these days can easily gain converts, by a click of a mouse...
does that translate into those converts who do kill for their cause not being terrorist because they.
1)never had any training though left loads of dead
2)never passe dpr muster to be a spokesman for a terrorist group though left loads of dead

where has the idea ever came from that a person who kills for a cause has to be somehow truly initiated into a group of that cause to be used to inflict casualties on the enemy?

half the shit we pulled as anarchist we never claimed responsibility for, does that mean we didnt do it?
no
it means we didnt want to do the cops jobs for them...
simple as that..

were we terror of course not.

we didn't use that tactic. it is a tactic. thats why a war ie the war on terrorism can never win.
u cant win wars against tactics. tactics are tactics.

its as old as war. its nothing new. the word is coined in the 20th century the idea has been used since we have been killing each other since we left the caves...

whether its kill and spread terror to he cave man boss or killing stacks of innocents on a promenade in nice...

if the tactic used is to influence a gov or its polices by the spread of terror, then it is classed terrorist.

was tar and feathering and murdering innocents during the american revolution an act of terror?
if you asked americans they will mostly state no
if you ask Canadians or bits they would answer mostly yes

was nuking cities full of innocents terrorism?

if the Americans would of lost it sure of been classed such
winners arent terrorist..(neat trick uh)

tactics will change in their application. its no longer the 70s.
different monsters now.
the traditional groups who used the western idea of warning time given, the taking of prisoners..negations..so on..
thats long gone..

the application of the tactic has changed.
doe that mean the tactic is no longer terrorism?

interesting question
The definition is very specific, and I agree with it. As for my statement of everyone... hmm one should not use absolutes so I do apologize about that, better statement is to say many or maybe most... media is really quick to say something is terrorism. This trickles to society... I was also refer to US government so again everyone does not count here... review or think of some news stories and many times the media will use terrorism or terrorist in the article forgetting any aspect of what the word means. With Nice, the man was know for making threats, but it does not say what kind of threats.. however, I will not be surprised when a connection is found that shows this is terrorism.
As for the guy and color example, was not in my thinking about forcing a change so will pass that to my fictional man. Just because the government does not use the color again, it was not his objective to make them stop. He saw it, was offended, and happened to know how to level the school. Terrorism and murder have intent behind them. The intent to cause change in group by using terror... not some guy offended ... once people start applying intent where none is, it becomes a slippery slope. However, someone that kills for a cause does not have to be part of a group...yet if a person kills and happens to reflect a cause does not mean he killed for one... look at my example with the guy who was offended ... let say he is white and the school is majority black, has the first openly gay principal, or has some other hot button issue... will the fact he states he did it because he was offered by the color painted on the school change or will other groups take his actions as an attack on them? Was nuking Japan terrorism, mass slaughter of innocents in order to force Japan to surrender ... some ways one can say that is a change in government especially after the US got done with them... but then again it was war and the Nuking was intended to stop it the treaties were intended to change their government...
Have I seen witch hunt for terrorism? Yes, just last night I was sitting in a restaurant and was seen writing in a journal. The lady who saw me wigged out and the restaurant followed suit, 5 cops and multiple people there all got in my face about being a terrorist... why? Because they could not read my writing (was not in english) but yeah sure lone girl sitting can be a scary thing right?
Media is quick with the "t" word, societies are following suit, and governments are striping rights of the innocents... but hey it is for a good cause right?
 
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Ooo not the finger wag..anything but the finger wag...please!

That I can agree with... but I would like to find a confirmed connection... while I realize it is early yet... media, government... heck society at large are so quick to throw the "t" word around for anything from writing a journal to the mass slaughter of thousands of people... many are terroristic acts... but not all... as a society we need to learn to identify and only name a cigar a cigar... for a blunt is not cigar even if it has the same wrappings...

but what would you take s a confirmed connection?
 
but what would you take s a confirmed connection?

Something... almost anything besides media just drawing connecting lines from his actions to terroristic causes... stating he made threats...alright what kind of threats, to do what, and why?
Was he part of a fourm, mailing list, church, had he read anything that ties to terrorism, any of the groups, were his threats in favor for terrorism...
Yes, his actions speak volumes and can easily be terrorism but it could also be a mass killing...
 
The definition is very specific, and I agree with it. As for my statement of everyone... hmm one should not use absolutes so I do apologize about that, better statement is to say many or maybe most... media is really quick to say something is terrorism. This trickles to society... I was also refer to US government so again everyone does not count here... review or think of some news stories and many times the media will use terrorism or terrorist in the article forgetting any aspect of what the word means. With Nice, the man was know for making threats, but it does not say what kind of threats.. however, I will not be surprised when a connection is found that shows this is terrorism.


what occurred in france is the failure of the state to protect its own people..
im very surprised given the amount of dead kids that their has been NO response at all from france or even the french right..
telling...

sad..
but
telling

the thing about terrorism terrorist usually dont get until after it starts is terrorism is a tactic that anyone can use.
the last time i was in paris their were just thousands upon thousands of innocent muslems...sitting ducks
to a terrorist that is..

mmm....
im not advocating it. but it wont take much for a frenchie to decide to slaughter a ton of muslems in paris to make a point..
if they do that of course we would see the french government actually do something. ...besides wag an index finger..

over 80 people just got smoked, along with 10 kids...
just a finger wag..
in paris hundreds were smooked. tortured and disembowel..
just a finger wag..
fascinating if it wasnt so sad.

As for the guy and color example, was not in my thinking about forcing a change so will pass that to my fictional man. Just because the government does not use the color again, it was not his objective to make them stop. He saw it, was offended, and happened to know how to level the school. Terrorism and murder have intent behind them. The intent to cause change in group by using terror... not some guy offended ... once people start applying intent where none is,

besides true accidents their is always intent when it comes to murdering people.
if you murder someone for a 5 piece of rock that maybe common, sure but its not terorism, if you take out a school with the intent to sway a government. then thats terrorism

its a simple concept for me.

it becomes a slippery slope. However, someone that kills for a cause does not have to be part of a group...yet if a person kills and happens to reflect a cause does not mean he killed for one...

what now we are just being clever layers, the difference between reflecting a cause or an ideology you kill in the name of..and actuality killing for that ideology or cause is what?

look at my example with the guy who was offended ... let say he is white and the school is majority black, has the first openly gay principal, or has some other hot button issue... will the fact he states he did it because he was offered by the color painted on the school change or will other groups take his actions as an attack on them?

is your example of the real world though?
we can pull any example to demonstrate any point out of any hat but is it based in reality?

Was nuking Japan terrorism, mass slaughter of innocents in order to force Japan to surrender ... some ways one can say that is a change in government especially after the US got done with them... but then again it was war and the Nuking was intended to stop it the treaties were intended to change their government...

so much for rules of war and all that fuss..
then again i"t was war"" is the same excuse the victors always use. both nazi germany" and japan if they could of would of used that very excuse if they nuked american cities.

then again it was war" is the same excuse used to slaughter and genocide of natives..

how one wins...
actually matters.

eventually when an american city is going to get nuked and that is when. not if..that when...if any one things that will never forever happen your full of it...thats like arguing criminals will never ever get guns..

that lesson will come home...

its easy nuking those that don't have nukes...lol
its different when those nukes head your way
same things with cops.
they can smoke people till their blue in the face and get away with it.
when five get smooked its the world must stop, because its very different when people actually shoot back. and that is the same lesson with nukes that will one day be sadly learned

how one wins matters.

Have I seen witch hunt for terrorism? Yes, just last night I was sitting in a restaurant and was seen writing in a journal. The lady who saw me wigged out and the restaurant followed suit, 5 cops and multiple people there all got in my face about being a terrorist... why? Because they could not read my writing (was not in english) but yeah sure lone girl sitting can be a scary thing right?
Media is quick with the "t" word, societies are following suit, and governments are striping rights of the innocents... but hey it is for a good cause right?

thats a personal example i was more asking regarding france. where witch hunts occurring..
none at all.
none

hundreds of people have been murdered and even chopped up and tortured.
no witch hunt.
just finger waggign and some laws that dont do anything..


media is media they actually are not that quick..
cnn wasn't calling the attack yesterday terrorist, french news was, canadian news was, cnn were claiming. "criminal".long after other news sources were telling the truth of it

look at orlando...
it certainly wasn't quick to call that terrorist..it was anything but terrorist the president couldnt even use the right words to define it...

media is controlled by vested interest of certain ideologies..
they will spin what they spin regardless of the facts. to suit their pet narrative

is smoking over 80 people and ten children an act of terrorism?

until someone shows me how it was a gods awful misunderstood accident
im going with terrorism
i have no issues at all calling something what it is, regardless if it offends anyone.
im also open to be proven that it wasnt and indeed was a terrible accident.

even though we know the driver first was shooting, even though we know he had other weapons and explosives in the vehicle
maybe that doesn't fit the terrorist tag i dunno. its a post modern world isnt it.

but im old school so
for what its worth
 
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Something... almost anything besides media just drawing connecting lines from his actions to terroristic causes... stating he made threats...alright what kind of threats, to do what, and why?
Was he part of a fourm, mailing list, church, had he read anything that ties to terrorism, any of the groups, were his threats in favor for terrorism...
Yes, his actions speak volumes and can easily be terrorism but it could also be a mass killing...


the difference between mass killing and terrorism is what?

how do you or i know what is confirmed or not
u and i dont work in the gov
all we know is what they tell us via themselves or media
so what would you take as valid confirmation?

should we wait months and months to make sure the gov actually discover she was a member of a mosque, goat sex club, or church or whatever?
how does that confirmation ehlp at all in the actually situation and struggle

you brought up confirmation so im asking what you would take as confirmation besides the

"my name is so and so this is my solder id number of this terrorist cell in this terrorist brigade in this terrorist organization. i did it for this and that..this is my terrorist mentor blah blah blah"

yeah they used to play like that in the 70s..
not so much now

why does having enemies confirm the tatcics they use on you actually help us counter measure their tactic as they use them?

if tmw we get confirmation this guy was sucking abu dabbi mumus dick..and he did it because of sausage love...
how does this actually even help us or anyone counter measure the tactic that terrorism is?
 
The first thing out of my mouth when I heard the news!! It's not so crazy...I'm just waiting to hear how Obama puts a spin on this....maybe someone said the word "Christian" and it set the poor frustrated guy off.....

Laura

You are getting entire of thread to be locked up, that's not cool.
 
Weak link in security:

". . . Bouhlel reportedly rented the truck earlier this week. While the promenade is typically closed to traffic, Bouhlel reportedly told police he was delivering ice cream to the festive crowd, then gunned the motor once past a checkpoint, zig-zagging through the terrified crowd as he weaved a path of carnage. Witnesses said he shoulted 'Alahu Akhbar' when he jumped out and sprayed bullets at fleeing victims.... "

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2016/0...oner-not-overtly-religious-say-neighbors.html

Why didn't security officers open the truck and inspect it first? I didn't think it even was a refrigerated truck, and it had no markings. Did the driver/attacker show a manifest for delivery? Why on earth did they let him past the checkpoint?
 
Was the attacker "inspired?"

The second issue of the jihadist magazine "Inspire," published in 2010, gave instructions on how to use vehicles to kill.

CNN reported on the article when it was first published.

Carrying the title "The Ultimate Mowing Machine," it called for jihadists to use a pickup truck a "mowing machine, not to mow grass but mow down the enemies of Allah."

A large truck was used for what is believed that very purpose late Thursday night when at least 80 people were killed and scores injured when the driver plowed into a crowd in Nice, France who were watching Bastille Day fireworks.

The article suggested implementing the attack in places that support the "Israeli occupation of Palestine, the American invasion of Afghanistan and Iraq or countries that had a prominent role in the defamation of Muhammad."

The article suggest using a four-wheel-drive pickup truck, adding, "the stronger the better."

"To achieve maximum carnage, you need to pick up as much speed as you can while still retaining good control of your vehicle in order to maximize your inertia and be able to strike as many people as possible in your first run," the article reads.

It also suggest bringing weapons to finish up the job in case the attack is thwarted. French authorities say the truck used in the attack was loaded with weapons, but police shot the driver to death before they could be used.

Breaking News at Newsmax.com http://www.newsmax.com/Headline/jihadist-magazine-called-truck/2016/07/14/id/738766/#ixzz4EVVczcR4
 
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