Feelings on how a Deaf child should be taught

Ozzie said:
*Hand up* ... "I do, I do!"

sarcasm
definitely
directed

:P
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Yaahhh! I am so proud that a deaf person is the first to show the correct spellings. ;)
 
*Quote from faire_jour: Our focus is the ability to communicate. She was able to request a cookie when she was 18 months (BEFORE we found her hearing loss) only because of ASL. We never lost the ability to teach her rules or for her to tell us that she didn't like the taste of potatoe soup BECAUSE of ASL. Maybe your child didn't have the gaps in communication but SO many orally educated children do. They go years without the ability to communicate at all and that is NOT ok. And that is the reason I advocate ASL for ALL children with a hearing loss.*

Amen about the focus being on communication, whichever method works the best for each individual child. It seems that, with you and your daughter, ASL is what helped the two of you communicate. That is wonderful and it seems that you two have a very close mother-daughter bond. With my daughter, speech is what helped US to communicate--we did some signs at first, much like hearing babies and "baby sign", but she began talking rather rapidly once she was listening to speech through her hearing aids. Just know that there are some, maybe many, deaf and hard of hearing kids who DO have excellent communication with their hearing parents through speech--it is much more common than you may think. I have seen many kids with CIs who would fit into that category, but my daughter and many like her are doing this through hearing aids--depending on the level of hearing loss, a lot of kids ARE hearing well with them and are developing speech just fine once they can hear. Anyway, I have to say that my daughter and I have always had WONDERFUL communication--in the very beginning, it was like hearing infants and toddlers before they can speak--we had a VERY VERY close bond and we were able to communicate wonderfully. Before we knew of her hearing loss, there wasn't a lack of communication other than the fact that she didn't really have those "first words" by her first birthday--soon after, she was diagnosed and fitted with hearing aids, and the listening and speaking began pretty much right away. In her toddler years, we communicated with words, signs, gestures, etc.--as she reached her 3rd birthday, her spoken vocabulary far exceeded her sign vocabulary--she began dropping signs in favor of words. As time went on, her spoken vocabulary (as well as receptive) grew and grew--all the while, we continued our excellent mother-daughter communication. She had no problem telling me what she liked and disliked, and she had no problem explaining her feelings about things. Now, as a teen, she and I have very detailed conversations about all of the mother-daughter topics. We are still very very closely bonded and have wonderful communication. What worked for you and your daughter is wonderful, what worked for me and my daughter is wonderful. You are right--communication is the key! :)
 
Communication is the key!

BTW--it is NOT ok for hearing parents to NOT communicate with their child if the child's main language is ASL, and it is NOT ok for Deaf parents to NOT communicate with their child if the child's main language is spoken English. That IS where the problem occurs--if the child is unable to communicate orally with hearing parents, then the parents HAVE to learn a way to communicate with their child. The most important thing is for the child to be able to express him or herself and to understand his or her parents, and the parents need to be able to pick up on the child's language in order to meet the child's needs. If oral language doesn't work quickly, then it is time to try something else--at least until there is sufficient oral language--and in many cases, there IS and nothing else is needed in order for the kids and parents to fully communicate. But, if not, something else IS needed.

I also worry about hearing kids of Deaf parents--those kids need opportunities to learn speech as all hearing kids do--if they are exposed to plenty of spoken language and develop appropriate oral language AND if they are able to communicate with their Deaf parents in ASL, then all is good. But if these hearing kids are ASL only, then they are missing something. I have seen this, and this is just as wrong as the reverse situation. My daughter and I have a great relationship and excellent oral communication together. I am saddened when I read about deaf kids who do not feel that way--their parents SHOULD learn to communicate with them however possible from the very beginning!

Now, my daughter is interested in learning sign language, and so am I. ASL is a SECOND language to BOTH of us--I am not sure if we will be learning SEE or ASL since we BOTH communicate in spoken English as our FIRST language. All I know is this--we both would like to learn, we both would like to communicate with others who do not speak, and we still would both like to continue to converse with people who do speak English. We may even learn other foreign languages together, but we will continue to communicate with each other through English--spoken and written(emails, notes, texting, etc.). Since we have always had wonderful communication together through the English language, we will probably always continue to do so.

In the highly unlikely scenario that some suggest, if my daughter suddenly switches from a very fluent spoken English language to fluent ASL only, I will learn and I will communicate with her however she feels most comfortable. But, don't you see how unlikely that is for someone who is HAPPY using spoken English and is actually having a bit of trouble learning ASL? It is kind of like suggesting that someone who speaks fluent English and then learns fluent Spanish later in life will suddenly drop their English language and expect all of their English speaking friends and family to converse with them in Spanish only. They can fluently communicate in both languages and will switch accordingly depending on the situation. BUT--sometimes a person only knows enough Spanish to "get by" and can kind of communicate with other Spanish speakers, but feels much more comfortable when they can relax and speak in their native English language. It will be interesting to see if my daughter can become fluent enough in ASL to sufficiently be bilingual--since she is fluent in English, it may be hard for her to suddenly reverse her thinking and put it in the correct order. She may end up being more fluent in SEE (or pigeon sign?) than actual ASL--we'll just have to see how it goes. But the two of us will most likely continue to communicate in English--we have long and meaningful talks now and I doubt that will end just because we are learning other languages, too.

Once again--communication is the key--and the ability to communicate with parents when the child is young is highly important. As the child gets older and the child's world expands, the ability to communicate with other family and friends is the key. Their world will expand more and more, and the ability to communicate with more people will continue to increase in importance. In America, the main language is English--it will be hard to do many things if one cannot communicate in English, but there are options. Spanish is becoming more and more a part of our language system in America--but should we all learn Spanish, or should the Spanish speakers learn English or find ways to interpret English to Spanish? And for those Americans who travel or spend a lot of time in other parts of the world, they should try to learn the native language and not expect everyone in other countries to speak English--they will have a hard time if they do not learn the language of the place where they will be spending a lot of time. If someone is fluent in ASL but travels to other countries, won't it be just as difficult to communicate if they don't learn the manual language of where they are traveling? Human beings often are able to find ways to communicate even when they are working with two very different communication modes--it is sometimes difficult, but it can be done. Either one person tries to learn the other person's language, or the reverse happens, or they find a third person who knows both languages to interpret for them, or they come up with a new language that they both learn to understand--at that point, communication occurs. We just need to be willing to try many channels in order to get to the ultimate goal--communicating together! :)
 
deafbajagal said:
It doesn't matter if the child has hearing aids, CIs, or whatever. It doesn't matter what communicate mode has been chosen for the child...and it doesn't matter what language the child learns first (or at the same time as another). What matters is the child has a hearing loss. This child is going to need lots and lots of language therapy. Even children with mild hearing loss needs language therapy. 27/7...isn't enough. What matters is that the parent(s) who know their child better than anyone else (we hope anyway) has been given the full set of options by a professional who is not biased and will be supportive of the parent's decision. What matters is that there is consistency with what the child needs in order to benefit most.

A lot of hearing parents want their child to hear as much as possible, have the best possible speech, and be intergrated into the world which mostly inhabits hearing and speaking folks. It is understandable because this is the view of their "norm." Deaf folks like myself have a different "norm". I don't see speech and even hearing a necessity to be successful in life. I want full access to the world...and no matter how hard I try to have perfect speech or to hear with one of the best digital hearing aids in the world, I can never be fully intergrated in the world of hearing and speaking people. An example comes to mind. In all of those years at the family dinner table, I never ever fully understood what was going on. Last year I had Thanksgiving dinner with deaf friends who conversed in ASL. I had to excused myself...and cried in the bathroom because I realized it was the first time I understood and enjoy Thanksgiving. This is my "norm." Experiences such as this one is what made me the person who feels the passion to work with deaf children and their parents. My "norm" and perspective is difficult to relate to or to understand when you're not in deaf shoes.

Let's get this out in the opening...the ugly truth is the deaf community is not an open community. It is very closed to members...even I had a hard time joining in simply because I didn't grow up signing the whole time. There can be a long, winded discussions of the implications of why the community is so close-knit, but that's another topic. Bottom line is...how can we as deaf people judge parents when we don't always open our arms to them? How can we dare reject people...especially after many of us face rejection again and again? It is time we stop saying that our way is the only way and start being supportive to all people regardless if they have a CI, HA, big deaf family, uses ASL, uses SEE, etc. Those things don't matter. A community of people joined together to explore the best decisions for each child and to support one another...that is what matters.
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I would hug you right now if I could.
 
Deborah said:
BTW--it is NOT ok for hearing parents to NOT communicate with their child if the child's main language is ASL, and it is NOT ok for Deaf parents to NOT communicate with their child if the child's main language is spoken English. That IS where the problem occurs--if the child is unable to communicate orally with hearing parents, then the parents HAVE to learn a way to communicate with their child. The most important thing is for the child to be able to express him or herself and to understand his or her parents, and the parents need to be able to pick up on the child's language in order to meet the child's needs. If oral language doesn't work quickly, then it is time to try something else--at least until there is sufficient oral language--and in many cases, there IS and nothing else is needed in order for the kids and parents to fully communicate. But, if not, something else IS needed.

I also worry about hearing kids of Deaf parents--those kids need opportunities to learn speech as all hearing kids do--if they are exposed to plenty of spoken language and develop appropriate oral language AND if they are able to communicate with their Deaf parents in ASL, then all is good. But if these hearing kids are ASL only, then they are missing something. I have seen this, and this is just as wrong as the reverse situation. My daughter and I have a great relationship and excellent oral communication together. I am saddened when I read about deaf kids who do not feel that way--their parents SHOULD learn to communicate with them however possible from the very beginning!

Now, my daughter is interested in learning sign language, and so am I. ASL is a SECOND language to BOTH of us--I am not sure if we will be learning SEE or ASL since we BOTH communicate in spoken English as our FIRST language. All I know is this--we both would like to learn, we both would like to communicate with others who do not speak, and we still would both like to continue to converse with people who do speak English. We may even learn other foreign languages together, but we will continue to communicate with each other through English--spoken and written(emails, notes, texting, etc.). Since we have always had wonderful communication together through the English language, we will probably always continue to do so.

In the highly unlikely scenario that some suggest, if my daughter suddenly switches from a very fluent spoken English language to fluent ASL only, I will learn and I will communicate with her however she feels most comfortable. But, don't you see how unlikely that is for someone who is HAPPY using spoken English and is actually having a bit of trouble learning ASL? It is kind of like suggesting that someone who speaks fluent English and then learns fluent Spanish later in life will suddenly drop their English language and expect all of their English speaking friends and family to converse with them in Spanish only. They can fluently communicate in both languages and will switch accordingly depending on the situation. BUT--sometimes a person only knows enough Spanish to "get by" and can kind of communicate with other Spanish speakers, but feels much more comfortable when they can relax and speak in their native English language. It will be interesting to see if my daughter can become fluent enough in ASL to sufficiently be bilingual--since she is fluent in English, it may be hard for her to suddenly reverse her thinking and put it in the correct order. She may end up being more fluent in SEE (or pigeon sign?) than actual ASL--we'll just have to see how it goes. But the two of us will most likely continue to communicate in English--we have long and meaningful talks now and I doubt that will end just because we are learning other languages, too.

Once again--communication is the key--and the ability to communicate with parents when the child is young is highly important. As the child gets older and the child's world expands, the ability to communicate with other family and friends is the key. Their world will expand more and more, and the ability to communicate with more people will continue to increase in importance. In America, the main language is English--it will be hard to do many things if one cannot communicate in English, but there are options. Spanish is becoming more and more a part of our language system in America--but should we all learn Spanish, or should the Spanish speakers learn English or find ways to interpret English to Spanish? And for those Americans who travel or spend a lot of time in other parts of the world, they should try to learn the native language and not expect everyone in other countries to speak English--they will have a hard time if they do not learn the language of the place where they will be spending a lot of time. If someone is fluent in ASL but travels to other countries, won't it be just as difficult to communicate if they don't learn the manual language of where they are traveling? Human beings often are able to find ways to communicate even when they are working with two very different communication modes--it is sometimes difficult, but it can be done. Either one person tries to learn the other person's language, or the reverse happens, or they find a third person who knows both languages to interpret for them, or they come up with a new language that they both learn to understand--at that point, communication occurs. We just need to be willing to try many channels in order to get to the ultimate goal--communicating together! :)
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Deborah..some deaf people have no oral skills so what are they supposed to do when it comes to this? They cant help it due to lack of auditory stimulation or unable to process sound to develop oral skills so to say that all deaf parents must learn to communicate with their hearing kids orally is not fair. Hearing parents have hands and eyes that work..they can learn ASL..deaf people have ears that "dont work" so kinda hard to develop oral skills there. Not to criticize you but to say that it is wrong for Deaf adults who have no oral skills not to use spoken English with their hearing kids is just being unrealistic.


As for one dropping their first language completely for ASL..that is unheard of, at least in my book. Spoken English is my first language and I learned ASL at the age of 25 and now I use ASL 90 to 95% of the time in my daily life. I have never completely dropped my first language. Even if I tried, it is impossible.
 
Shel,

I didn't mean that parents who cannot speak should suddenly be able to--what I meant was, they need to be sure that their hearing children are exposed to oral language as much as possible. I have met Deaf parents of hearing children--they are proud to be ASL only--they rarely socialize with anyone outside of the Deaf community--their hearing kids are being raised almost totally in a silent world. I haven't seen these kids in a long time--hopefully things opened up for them when they started school. Yes, ASL can be a wonderful language for that family, but shouldn't the parents find ways for their hearing children to pick up on oral language (if they cannot do it themselves. shouldn't they expose them to it as much as possible in other ways)? As I said, these kids were under 6 years old when I met them, but they weren't speaking on age level, and they were hearing. I am just saying that, unless the parents find hearing people for their hearing kids to be around, they aren't going to develop spoken English. This is just the reverse of what many are saying here--they say that deaf kids need to be exposed to ASL even though their hearing parents and families don't know it. The reverse is true of hearing children of Deaf parents--maybe the parents can't use speech with them, but the kids need to be exposed to hearing and speaking people--or oral deaf people with good speech--in order to learn it.

Anyone ever see the movie Nell? Jodie Foster played a young woman who was isolated in the woods with one woman--maybe a grandmother? The older woman had a stroke and had a hard time speaking. She did speak, but it was with a very heavy speech impediment. Nell learned to talk by listening to this woman with the speech impediment--Nell spoke as the old woman did because it was her only speech model. Yes, it is just a movie, but it is a true scenario--people learn to speak by being exposed to speech--people learn to speak by hearing others speak--kids learn English by hearing it spoken--kids learn French by hearing it spoken. Yes, if children cannot access a spoken language through their hearing, that is when a manual language comes in--but many CAN access spoken language with hearing aids or CIs. If the hearing aids or CIs aren't giving them enough access to spoken language, then yes, they need a manual language--but for many kids, the hearing aids and CIs ARE giving them good access to spoken language. And hearing kids who are not exposed to spoken language a LOT will not pick it up either--if parents cannot speak, they need to help their hearing kids access spoken language from other people in order for them to learn to speak. Yes, they will have great communication with each other through ASL, but those kids need to have lots of access to speech from someone--if not parents, then someone--maybe family members or friends of the family. Hopefully, Deaf parents of hearing kids have not isolated those hearing kids so much into the Deaf community that they have little exposure to spoken language. Just as many Deaf people think it is wrong from hearing families to not expose their deaf children to ASL, it is just as wrong for Deaf families not to expose their hearing children to spoken language. It goes both ways.

But, of course, when the kids are young, the number one thing is that parents and children communicate--as the child ages they will need to learn to communicate within wider and wider circles and be able to communicate with more and more people. Wherever the children go, being able to communicate with the people around them opens more and more doors for them. That is one reason why some people like to teach their kids SEVERAL languages--it opens up a bigger world for them. It is not an easy thing to do, though. I have learned some French and Spanish, but I am not fluent in them. My daughter chose to learn some Spanish, but she is not at all fluent in it. Perhaps, since we are moving to Florida, maybe we should try to not only learn ASL but we should learn more Spanish, too---it will certainly come in handy there!!
 
deafbajagal said:
Got to hand it to Rick for standing behind his beliefs in what is best for his child. I wish all of my parents of my students had that passion and determination.
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Thanks but remember along with all that passion and determination comes a slightly unhinged parent as well :) !

Rick
 
There are hearing children who are only exposed to spoken English in the home.
OMG! OMG! Somebody call the language police! OMG...oh wait. This is the "norm" of hearing family.

There are hearing children who are only exposed to American Sign Language in the home.
OMG! OMG! Somebody call the language police. OMG...oh wait. This is the "norm" of deaf family.

It is a matter of perspective. Why is it so important that the child who is hearing be exposed to spoken English? This view implies that English is superior to ASL. :(
 
deafbajagal said:
There are hearing children who are only exposed to spoken English in the home.
OMG! OMG! Somebody call the language police! OMG...oh wait. This is the "norm" of hearing family.

There are hearing children who are only exposed to American Sign Language in the home.
OMG! OMG! Somebody call the language police. OMG...oh wait. This is the "norm" of deaf family.

It is a matter of perspective. Why is it so important that the child who is hearing be exposed to spoken English? This view implies that English is superior to ASL. :(
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deafbajagal - I am not following you here. A hearing child cannot help but be exposed to spoken language.
 
deafbajagal said:
It doesn't matter if the child has hearing aids, CIs, or whatever. It doesn't matter what communicate mode has been chosen for the child...and it doesn't matter what language the child learns first (or at the same time as another). What matters is the child has a hearing loss. This child is going to need lots and lots of language therapy. Even children with mild hearing loss needs language therapy. 27/7...isn't enough. What matters is that the parent(s) who know their child better than anyone else (we hope anyway) has been given the full set of options by a professional who is not biased and will be supportive of the parent's decision. What matters is that there is consistency with what the child needs in order to benefit most.

A lot of hearing parents want their child to hear as much as possible, have the best possible speech, and be intergrated into the world which mostly inhabits hearing and speaking folks. It is understandable because this is the view of their "norm." Deaf folks like myself have a different "norm". I don't see speech and even hearing a necessity to be successful in life. I want full access to the world...and no matter how hard I try to have perfect speech or to hear with one of the best digital hearing aids in the world, I can never be fully intergrated in the world of hearing and speaking people. An example comes to mind. In all of those years at the family dinner table, I never ever fully understood what was going on. Last year I had Thanksgiving dinner with deaf friends who conversed in ASL. I had to excused myself...and cried in the bathroom because I realized it was the first time I understood and enjoy Thanksgiving. This is my "norm." Experiences such as this one is what made me the person who feels the passion to work with deaf children and their parents. My "norm" and perspective is difficult to relate to or to understand when you're not in deaf shoes.

Let's get this out in the opening...the ugly truth is the deaf community is not an open community. It is very closed to members...even I had a hard time joining in simply because I didn't grow up signing the whole time. There can be a long, winded discussions of the implications of why the community is so close-knit, but that's another topic. Bottom line is...how can we as deaf people judge parents when we don't always open our arms to them? How can we dare reject people...especially after many of us face rejection again and again? It is time we stop saying that our way is the only way and start being supportive to all people regardless if they have a CI, HA, big deaf family, uses ASL, uses SEE, etc. Those things don't matter. A community of people joined together to explore the best decisions for each child and to support one another...that is what matters.
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:gpost: !!! You're so right that the deaf community aren't an open community, They looked down on me if I was raised oral or if I was signing in SEE instead of ASL, or if I could speak and read lips.

But, You'll also have the hearing community looking down on us too, not all of those people are an open acceptance people.
 
faire_jour said:
Oh, and in our local TC classes, they use ASL signs in English word order while speaking English, not SEE. So I guess it depends where you are from...though our school just mereged our TC class with Bi-Bi so it doesn't even apply here anymore..
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Using this approach, is impossible because ASL shares no grammatical similarities to English. ASL is more a body, and facial expressions sign language. It has it's own rule of grammar and it's not English. SEE is actually Signing Exact English in word order, it is use in TC programs. :) Since your TC program uses ASL maybe this is why it's a failure program.
 
Deborah said:
I also worry about hearing kids of Deaf parents--those kids need opportunities to learn speech as all hearing kids do--if they are exposed to plenty of spoken language and develop appropriate oral language AND if they are able to communicate with their Deaf parents in ASL, then all is good. But if these hearing kids are ASL only, then they are missing something. I have seen this, and this is just as wrong as the reverse situation.
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I agree, in fact I'm a deaf mother of two hearing sons, and I do not force them to learn my language. If they're interesting in wanted to know sign language, I would be more than glad to teach them, but it's never a requirement, I can understand them when reading their lips and They can understand me because I use my voice, I taught them how to be clear in trying to speak to me, because communication is important, when we can understand one another. ;)
 
Deborah said:
Shel,

I didn't mean that parents who cannot speak should suddenly be able to--what I meant was, they need to be sure that their hearing children are exposed to oral language as much as possible. I have met Deaf parents of hearing children--they are proud to be ASL only--they rarely socialize with anyone outside of the Deaf community--their hearing kids are being raised almost totally in a silent world. I haven't seen these kids in a long time--hopefully things opened up for them when they started school. Yes, ASL can be a wonderful language for that family, but shouldn't the parents find ways for their hearing children to pick up on oral language (if they cannot do it themselves. shouldn't they expose them to it as much as possible in other ways)? As I said, these kids were under 6 years old when I met them, but they weren't speaking on age level, and they were hearing. I am just saying that, unless the parents find hearing people for their hearing kids to be around, they aren't going to develop spoken English. This is just the reverse of what many are saying here--they say that deaf kids need to be exposed to ASL even though their hearing parents and families don't know it. The reverse is true of hearing children of Deaf parents--maybe the parents can't use speech with them, but the kids need to be exposed to hearing and speaking people--or oral deaf people with good speech--in order to learn it.

Anyone ever see the movie Nell? Jodie Foster played a young woman who was isolated in the woods with one woman--maybe a grandmother? The older woman had a stroke and had a hard time speaking. She did speak, but it was with a very heavy speech impediment. Nell learned to talk by listening to this woman with the speech impediment--Nell spoke as the old woman did because it was her only speech model. Yes, it is just a movie, but it is a true scenario--people learn to speak by being exposed to speech--people learn to speak by hearing others speak--kids learn English by hearing it spoken--kids learn French by hearing it spoken. Yes, if children cannot access a spoken language through their hearing, that is when a manual language comes in--but many CAN access spoken language with hearing aids or CIs. If the hearing aids or CIs aren't giving them enough access to spoken language, then yes, they need a manual language--but for many kids, the hearing aids and CIs ARE giving them good access to spoken language. And hearing kids who are not exposed to spoken language a LOT will not pick it up either--if parents cannot speak, they need to help their hearing kids access spoken language from other people in order for them to learn to speak. Yes, they will have great communication with each other through ASL, but those kids need to have lots of access to speech from someone--if not parents, then someone--maybe family members or friends of the family. Hopefully, Deaf parents of hearing kids have not isolated those hearing kids so much into the Deaf community that they have little exposure to spoken language. Just as many Deaf people think it is wrong from hearing families to not expose their deaf children to ASL, it is just as wrong for Deaf families not to expose their hearing children to spoken language. It goes both ways.

But, of course, when the kids are young, the number one thing is that parents and children communicate--as the child ages they will need to learn to communicate within wider and wider circles and be able to communicate with more and more people. Wherever the children go, being able to communicate with the people around them opens more and more doors for them. That is one reason why some people like to teach their kids SEVERAL languages--it opens up a bigger world for them. It is not an easy thing to do, though. I have learned some French and Spanish, but I am not fluent in them. My daughter chose to learn some Spanish, but she is not at all fluent in it. Perhaps, since we are moving to Florida, maybe we should try to not only learn ASL but we should learn more Spanish, too---it will certainly come in handy there!!
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With Nell, she was exposed to only one person. Even if hearing kids of Deaf parents are exposed to only ASL which I find odd cuz there is TV, radio, neighbors, and so forth but for the sake of the argument, let's say the kids never are exposed to spoken English, just ASL, at least they are building a strong L1 language foundation. Any child whether in spoken or signed languages build that strong L1 language during their first 5 years will do fine later on especially when it comes to acquiring a 2nd language. Now, about Nell..I am vague about the movie but she didnt get a proper model of language at all just like with so many deaf children during their first 5 years which makes it hard for them to acquire language later on even though they do get exposed to ASL later on. Even their ASL is very weak. I have one student like that...he is weak in both English and ASL by being in an oral only program until he was 8 years old. When he transferred to my work, he knew no ASL and his spoken English was equivalent to a 3 year old. Now, that is not right. At least with hearing kids of Deaf children, they have that strong L1 language. Big difference. I studied linguistics, language acquisition, and child pychology during my grad work so I learned about this issue in addition to what I see in my professional field with so many deaf children being referred to my program at older ages with serious language delays. That's one of the biggest reasons why I believe all deaf children should be exposed to both since their diagnosis.
 
Cheri said:
I agree, in fact I'm a deaf mother of two hearing sons, and I do not force them to learn my language. If they're interesting in wanted to know sign language, I would be more than glad to teach them, but it's never a requirement, I can understand them when reading their lips and They can understand me because I use my voice, I taught them how to be clear in trying to speak to me, because communication is important, when we can understand one another. ;)
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That's good you can understand them by lipreading 100% of the time. I cant understand my daughter by lipreading 100% of the time and it leads to communication difficulties between the both of us sometimes. When she was born, I thought the same as you..that she is hearing, she must be exposed to mostly spoken language but guess what? It backfired on us in a lot of way cuz I just cannot understand her half of the time cuz with lipreading, it is mostly on guess work. I wish I had kept both language separate with her. With my son, I have kept both language separate and at the age of 2, he is soo fluent in ASL and spoken language..both are developing at a parallel rate.I have less communication difficulties with him than I did with my daughhter when she was at that age.
 
Cheri said:
Using this approach, is impossible because ASL shares no grammatical similarities to English. ASL is more a body, and facial expressions sign language. It has it's own rule of grammar and it's not English. SEE is actually Signing Exact English in word order, it is use in TC programs. :) Since your TC program uses ASL maybe this is why it's a failure program.
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Use ASL and it is a failure solely cuz of ASL? I brought 2 of my students from 2nd grade reading level to 4th grade reading level by the BiBi approach. So if ASL was to blame, then why were they able to be so successful with literacy if I used ASL? It probably was due to other factors why that TC program wasnt working. Research has showed a majority of TC programs have failed which is why many programs are starting to drop TC programs. It is more appropriate for an one-on-one basis but not for a classroom setting. No offense or anything.
 
deafbajagal said:
There are hearing children who are only exposed to spoken English in the home.
OMG! OMG! Somebody call the language police! OMG...oh wait. This is the "norm" of hearing family.

There are hearing children who are only exposed to American Sign Language in the home.
OMG! OMG! Somebody call the language police. OMG...oh wait. This is the "norm" of deaf family.

It is a matter of perspective. Why is it so important that the child who is hearing be exposed to spoken English? This view implies that English is superior to ASL. :(
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Right but I have never met a Deaf family who have ever completely shut their hearing kids away from spoken English. That is new to me.

What matters is that the kids build a strong first language before entering kindergarten and are ready to learn. I have never met a hearing child from a Deaf family that knew no English before entering kindergarten. Interesting..
 
loml said:
deafbajagal - I am not following you here. A hearing child cannot help but be exposed to spoken language.
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Right...to say that Deaf families completely 100% shut their hearing kids away from spoken language during their first 5 years of life is impossible. Unless the Deaf family lives all alone in the middle of nowhere. I am scratching my head here...maybe there are some that do and I just havent met them yet. LOL!
 
LOML, Cheri, and Shel...to answer your question: I was referring to Deborah's comment about Deaf families should expose their children to spoken English...;). That was the inspiration of the "norm" comment I made. You're right...it is pretty hard to isolate a hearing child from spoken language as it is all around the child (we hope anyways)...but I was more so emphasizing the viewpoint. So many comments are made innocently and with good intentions but in reality those comments implies that English is superior to ASL, which is in my view - unfair and untrue. That was the point I was trying to get across. Hope this makes more sense.
 
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