Whoops....sorry about that.....I should have reworded that a bit differently....Yes, there are a lot of LD kids who are nerologically scattered, and can and do reach at least functional academic levels in their area of concern...I didn't mean to imply that they were incapible of functional literacy....They ARE.....I do bash the public sped system....but at least they do tend to give LD kids (and high functioning mental disabiltiy kids too) decent math/reading and writing abilty.......However, it IS a fact (seen time and again) that the LD/general special ed population is a large group that doesn't score high on state testing.....It's also sadly a fact that special ed is a dumping ground.....
Evidence that historically deaf kids were thought of as mentally disabled
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Whoops....sorry about that.....I should have reworded that a bit differently....Yes, there are a lot of LD kids who are nerologically scattered, and can and do reach at least functional academic levels in their area of concern...I didn't mean to imply that they were incapible of functional literacy....They ARE.....I do bash the public sped system....but at least they do tend to give LD kids (and high functioning mental disabiltiy kids too) decent math/reading and writing abilty.......However, it IS a fact (seen time and again) that the LD/general special ed population is a large group that doesn't score high on state testing.....It's also sadly a fact that special ed is a dumping ground.....
WHAT? Sorry but you and your brigade were completly twisting my words...I said that EDUCATIONALLY and socially they may get TREATED LIKE they are mentally disabled! It's also a FACT that 40 something YEARS ago kids with mild/HOH losses were misdiagosed as being mentally disabled.....I NEVER said anything about that happening today.......I specificly said back in the '70s.
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Um, no I didn't post about this issue at all, I just read it. I only addressed your "perfect speech" brouhaha
Grummer
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whats happened in the 1970's is happening right now in the 2010's, with greater variation of results and greater amount of "academic inputs" from other feilds which have had more exposure or 'selected exposures' to the CI-related questions...and much less (now) on SL-related as these are now tended to be berated down to a mere 'social phenomenon' rather than as a 'social problems' or "social isses' it is almost as if, it is prefered not to acknowledge these recurring Deaf issues as a real social issues. these are now basicaly denied, displaced to somewhere else...
i cant say much more on this, mainly because there are actual lack of imperial, or substantial backings to this particularity social mishaps, but strangely or not strangely (depending on your outlook or ability to see pass media hypes), that problems of corruptions in aids to third world countries are taken more seriously as the audience from the west 'would believe those in power in these poor countries ARE probable to be quite greedy or something, it is like more believable' ike id say the OBVIOUS harm done to the many poor there are in plain sight, so the ideas of corruption its ''invitable' to the curious minds, but for d/Deaf people the harm isn't seen, not clear, it makes it difficult for audience to 'believe' there is corruption n the educational system, social welfare , rehabilitation system and so on, as they as 'rulers' are not easily seen to be juxatposed as to the roles of oppressor, when it is explicitly conveyed in media and 'ordinary social discourse' as "helpers" in society , in much the same way as aid workers in the third world countries...it is just that much, a LOT harder to see pass the BS...or roles and contradictive aspects which are seem as "NOT contradictiory", im not even sure what this "phenomeonon' is called in the world of academics, I wish i knew, and I hope that I will find some parrallel to then bring it in to here in AD...but yea well...
Ambrosia and some others. Id like to say something, you CAN'T say there is no "such thing as being treat as mentallay disabled' there is! and it is STILL prevalence in this day...and in the modern world of 'inclusion philosophy' that is now praised and worshipped by those are in special education fields, special education covers ALL sorts of disabilities, with wide range of how it goes from very minor like (dylexsic, (lightly) asperagers, adhds, speech mutes, or stutterers, to small prosthesis wearers (like a 1 foot not, entire leg), to something more serious and to the far end of serious like amputated with NO legs, of Deaf with NO speechs, and NO ASL...or deaf BLInd with NONE...and alot of inbetweens get muddled with 'overcoming themes', blah blah
anyway the inclusion concepts which is Now rampant, DOES lump it all together, DD is Right, and it is slowly 'getting better according to them- the wishy washy unrealistic educationalists) but its getting WORSE for the d/Deaf!...because THAT lumping of the mentally disabled IS being quite subtle, well how subtle??, as subtle as school policy of 'inclusion' they are being sooo clever, careful not to 'discuss how different they really are'...
no body ever questioned the aid-workers, but did anybody questioned king's or princes' lack of empathy? ethics are like international relations and international laws, these are bound and cant be shaken...in this manner how education is now 'run' with the idea of lumping is 'bound' too. I'm not ever sure if this is a good example, probably a very sucky bad example..but if any of you 'gets it' then great...
im off to enjoy a movie...
i cant say much more on this, mainly because there are actual lack of imperial, or substantial backings to this particularity social mishaps, but strangely or not strangely (depending on your outlook or ability to see pass media hypes), that problems of corruptions in aids to third world countries are taken more seriously as the audience from the west 'would believe those in power in these poor countries ARE probable to be quite greedy or something, it is like more believable' ike id say the OBVIOUS harm done to the many poor there are in plain sight, so the ideas of corruption its ''invitable' to the curious minds, but for d/Deaf people the harm isn't seen, not clear, it makes it difficult for audience to 'believe' there is corruption n the educational system, social welfare , rehabilitation system and so on, as they as 'rulers' are not easily seen to be juxatposed as to the roles of oppressor, when it is explicitly conveyed in media and 'ordinary social discourse' as "helpers" in society , in much the same way as aid workers in the third world countries...it is just that much, a LOT harder to see pass the BS...or roles and contradictive aspects which are seem as "NOT contradictiory", im not even sure what this "phenomeonon' is called in the world of academics, I wish i knew, and I hope that I will find some parrallel to then bring it in to here in AD...but yea well...
Ambrosia and some others. Id like to say something, you CAN'T say there is no "such thing as being treat as mentallay disabled' there is! and it is STILL prevalence in this day...and in the modern world of 'inclusion philosophy' that is now praised and worshipped by those are in special education fields, special education covers ALL sorts of disabilities, with wide range of how it goes from very minor like (dylexsic, (lightly) asperagers, adhds, speech mutes, or stutterers, to small prosthesis wearers (like a 1 foot not, entire leg), to something more serious and to the far end of serious like amputated with NO legs, of Deaf with NO speechs, and NO ASL...or deaf BLInd with NONE...and alot of inbetweens get muddled with 'overcoming themes', blah blah
anyway the inclusion concepts which is Now rampant, DOES lump it all together, DD is Right, and it is slowly 'getting better according to them- the wishy washy unrealistic educationalists) but its getting WORSE for the d/Deaf!...because THAT lumping of the mentally disabled IS being quite subtle, well how subtle??, as subtle as school policy of 'inclusion' they are being sooo clever, careful not to 'discuss how different they really are'...
no body ever questioned the aid-workers, but did anybody questioned king's or princes' lack of empathy? ethics are like international relations and international laws, these are bound and cant be shaken...in this manner how education is now 'run' with the idea of lumping is 'bound' too. I'm not ever sure if this is a good example, probably a very sucky bad example..but if any of you 'gets it' then great...
im off to enjoy a movie...
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Clearly this is not a bucket brigade, stopping fires. We are the the fire starters (any of you remember that song? that was from my predeaf days lol) we're more fire fanners I guess.
Can we be a posse? I've always wanted to have a posse.
Can we be a posse? I've always wanted to have a posse.
Mewtilation
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AlleyCat
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Yes, you did state that it was back in the 70's.
The problem I have with your posts in this thread and the one that is that "Is it worth it to be oral" thread was talking about TODAY. The answer to that question is subjective for everyone. I won't even address that here.
I don't think anyone is really disputing that there were a lot of misdiagnoses back in the 70's that you started talking about. I am 43 myself and when my deafness was diagnosed at 15 months old (back in 1971), a hearing test was ordered only as a back-up option, it was already assumed I was delayed. (Which I'm not, hearing loss was the only issue.) So this really did happen back in the 70's (and before, too) and perhaps on a case-by-case basis today, but frankly, this is not a common occurrence today.
There wasn't really a need to start a new thread dredging up old stuff that isn't pertinent to today's times.
whatdidyousay!
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When I was a little girl the other kids in our neighborhood told my older sister that I was retarded because of my speech and I talked very loud . I did not get a my first HA until I was about 8 yo so I had no idea how loud I spoke.
The thing that really pissed off was why didn't my jack#** Dr. realize I had speech defect when I was a little girl. Our family Dr. lived three houses from our house and saw me all the time playing outside.
Not uncommon and to an extent applied to me (in the olllld days)
. I was born in 1954. No one knew what my problem was. I asked my mom not too long before she died if I was put in a school for mentally disabled (whatever it was called back then). I had that memory that I didn't understand and I knew I went to the "school" before I went to kindergarten. She said yes. No one knew my issues were due to lack of hearing. So, I wasn't deaf but my hearing was not good. This is further proven when circa 1963 my dad got a BTE for me. Other types of aids existed but I needed the more powerful aid at that time.
I read a lot (cannot quote sources other than my own experiences and I have too many) that HoH and Deaf were thought to be mentally ill. It makes sense simply because the medical community had not evolved enough back then.
I'll nicely stop here after saying I do not like the push to sell of the community. But, at least, valid diagnosis of the HoH and Deaf are made at birth.
DD: Thanks for citing your sources
. I was born in 1954. No one knew what my problem was. I asked my mom not too long before she died if I was put in a school for mentally disabled (whatever it was called back then). I had that memory that I didn't understand and I knew I went to the "school" before I went to kindergarten. She said yes. No one knew my issues were due to lack of hearing. So, I wasn't deaf but my hearing was not good. This is further proven when circa 1963 my dad got a BTE for me. Other types of aids existed but I needed the more powerful aid at that time.I read a lot (cannot quote sources other than my own experiences and I have too many) that HoH and Deaf were thought to be mentally ill. It makes sense simply because the medical community had not evolved enough back then.
I'll nicely stop here after saying I do not like the push to sell of the community. But, at least, valid diagnosis of the HoH and Deaf are made at birth.
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If I recall correctly, in about five years from now, there would have a treatment for the deafness. It won't be 100% cure, but it's treatable option.
That means there probably would no need for any speech therapy, cue speech, English tools, or even ASL... So, be expected that there will be much less Deaf persons left in near future... I wouldn't surprise that I see no more or very fewer Deaf persons in my elderly age much later.
Eh.
Kids/Adults get the same reaction
I am treated sometimes as though I am stupid as well. There's need for understanding the nuances and obvious indications of the results of a hearing loss. I'm not a child. I am not stupid. With a hearing aid (and not) I can understand why people believe this. It falls under the guise of the "ignorance of society." It's all a learning process if people care to take the time to understand it.
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I still get that from some of my husband's family members. I was trying to joke around with his aunt who came from out of town on Christmas Day. As usual, she looked at me like I was a freak. sighs...I try so hard ,but still don't get through some people. Oh well.
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ugh. people have mirrors, and think they are windows.
rockin'robin
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Before I became deaf in the 60's....seems I was just a typical teenager...after my deafness, it changed drastically...even my sister said..."Deaf people are considered mentally retarded"....Never mind the fact that I finished school, acquired a very good job....Times have not changed much....
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I relate to that!
I never implied that it was......Just that I think that Deaf ed needs to be an OPTION among many....I don't think ALL dhh kids should attend Deaf School,and be locked into that as the only option......But I do think we need to reconize that a one size fits all approach (public school inclusion) is just as bad as saying that all dhh kids should attend deaf school.....the key needs to be offering a variety of approaches, and making sure that inclusion doesn't mean a ton of kids falling through the cracks......