Drill Baby Drill

[TheOracle]

<sigh> And you all thought sugarcane ethanol was a bad idea.

 

[darkdog]

I don't want 100% green jobs and it is impossible to maintain our economy without energy, including oil. I just want increase the MPG in vehicles, invest in clean energy, better regulation and safety law, along with oil drilling in our country.

The only way to increase MPG in vehicles is to increase the efficiency of engines (an engineering problem that can't be solved by government mandate), make hybrids (which are expensive, so the cost/benefit is questionable), or make cars lighter. Usually, the auto companies make the cars lighter which makes them less safe. Besides, it doesn't really cut down on gas usage as much as you'd think. When people see their cars are more fuel efficient, they tend to drive more.

As for investing in clean energy, I don't think a cent should go to subsidizing any energy source. If some green energy source is inefficient, then it should fail in the market until engineers and scientists figure out how to make it efficient enough to compete in the market. When you have subsidies, you get crony capitalism, where the government picks winners and losers.

Do you consider regulation and safety law on oil as government interference? If you say yes so I don't want new oil drilling at all without better regulation and safety law because I don't want repeat of oil spilling that happened in last year and more Americans blame on Obama than BP does, that made me feel so sad because they don't understand. I just want federal government to be out of situation with oil spill, except for oversee, offer permit licenses and adopt the penalties since oil companies are supposed to be complete liable for that. BP is already capped at $75 millions for liability, that's not enough.

Good safety laws and regulations are important and necessary. What I oppose is what the administration is doing now- blocking drilling permits, even despite court orders. Many offshore oil rigs have already left for foreign shores because of it, costing us jobs and wealth.

Was there a poll showing more Americans blaming Obama than BP? There might have been- I just don't remember it. Anyway, I think most people know this is BP's fault, but the administration's performance was not good. For instance, three days after the lead started, they refused the Netherland's offer to send oil skimming ships. It took them months to cut through all the red tape.

Europe uses much less oil than our country does and we should follow their way to reduce of oil usage, also they do have oil drilling with better regulation, that what I want to prevent oil spill from occur. Use less oil will make oil more availability in future for our live needed to use it, however my statement isn't limited to USA only, it does applies to other countries that use a lot of oil, especially China and India too.

Europe is less spread out than we are, so public transportation works better for them. Also, they're not quite as wealthy as we are and wealthier countries use more oil (seeing that oil is the engine of the economy). Interestingly, wealthy countries are easier on the environment than poor countries. The only way to use less oil without getting poorer is to make more energy-efficient technology or use other sources of energy.

You mentioned oil availability. I'm not worried about that. Peak oil theories have been around since the 70s and yet we keep finding more and more oil. We have many more decades of oil, if not centuries, and plenty of replacements already available. I say, keep the oil, along with coal, nuclear, natural gas, etc. flowing, have reasonable safety regulations, and realize there will always be some risk.

 

[Foxrac]

<sigh> And you all thought sugarcane ethanol was a bad idea.

No, not me and I'm big support of ethanol if customers want use as alternative to gasoline.

 

[Foxrac]

The only way to increase MPG in vehicles is to increase the efficiency of engines (an engineering problem that can't be solved by government mandate), make hybrids (which are expensive, so the cost/benefit is questionable), or make cars lighter. Usually, the auto companies make the cars lighter which makes them less safe. Besides, it doesn't really cut down on gas usage as much as you'd think. When people see their cars are more fuel efficient, they tend to drive more.

As for investing in clean energy, I don't think a cent should go to subsidizing any energy source. If some green energy source is inefficient, then it should fail in the market until engineers and scientists figure out how to make it efficient enough to compete in the market. When you have subsidies, you get crony capitalism, where the government picks winners and losers.


Good safety laws and regulations are important and necessary. What I oppose is what the administration is doing now- blocking drilling permits, even despite court orders. Many offshore oil rigs have already left for foreign shores because of it, costing us jobs and wealth.

Was there a poll showing more Americans blaming Obama than BP? There might have been- I just don't remember it. Anyway, I think most people know this is BP's fault, but the administration's performance was not good. For instance, three days after the lead started, they refused the Netherland's offer to send oil skimming ships. It took them months to cut through all the red tape.


Europe is less spread out than we are, so public transportation works better for them. Also, they're not quite as wealthy as we are and wealthier countries use more oil (seeing that oil is the engine of the economy). Interestingly, wealthy countries are easier on the environment than poor countries. The only way to use less oil without getting poorer is to make more energy-efficient technology or use other sources of energy.

You mentioned oil availability. I'm not worried about that. Peak oil theories have been around since the 70s and yet we keep finding more and more oil. We have many more decades of oil, if not centuries, and plenty of replacements already available. I say, keep the oil, along with coal, nuclear, natural gas, etc. flowing, have reasonable safety regulations, and realize there will always be some risk.

How does government mandate has prevented engineering's ability to make improvement and fuel efficient engine? I haven't hear about our government is blamed or not. Yup, I agree about hybrid is expensive and unsure about hybrid will be cheaper in future, also hybrid cars have expensive maintenance too, I believe so. Well, it is capitalism and it is up to people to drive more whatever they want, it is their money.

I don't want subsidize on energy sources either because it cost money and make our taxes go up. Yup, the clean energy source should invested by private companies or organizations with some of government support, especially grant and if it doesn't work so we have look for other way.

I forgot about where poll were from but it was year ago. I agree with you about problems in Obama Admin like block the drilling permit and not enough to do to improve the regulation for future oil drilling in after ONE year. If regulation is updated so oil drilling is supposed to resume and I think Obama need respect court order but unsure if appeal court did blocked or not. BP is full liable for oil spill and Obama Admin for poor handling over situation with oil spill.

Some European countries are wealthy like UK, France, Sweden, Norway, Switzerland, etc but oil usage is much lower than USA does, also you are correct about Europe is far less spreading than USA. We have to deal with sprawling issue and they are out of control for many years. McMansions are not popular anymore and newer houses will be built with different style and more smaller size.

Situation with Obama Admin over oil issue isn't my priority for election and I care about social issues as my priority.

 

[darkdog]

How does government mandate has prevented engineering's ability to make improvement and fuel efficient engine?

I don't mean government prevents engineers from improving the designs. I mean that government can't make engineers improve the design. They already have a market incentive to design more efficient engines, so it really depends on the physics.

I don't want subsidize on energy sources either because it cost money and make our taxes go up. Yup, the clean energy source should invested by private companies or organizations with some of government support, especially grant and if it doesn't work so we have look for other way.

Then it doesn't make sense to support corn ethanol because it only survives due to government subsidies and mandates. I'm not necessarily opposed to research grants for R&D into energy sources, but that's different from subsidies.

Some European countries are wealthy like UK, France, Sweden, Norway, Switzerland, etc but oil usage is much lower than USA does, also you are correct about Europe is far less spreading than USA. We have to deal with sprawling issue and they are out of control for many years. McMansions are not popular anymore and newer houses will be built with different style and more smaller size.

Most of Europe is wealthy, but per capita income is not quite as high as the US. I think only Norway and Luxembourg have higher per capita income than the US, but I haven't double-checked that.

I never saw sprawl as an issue that has to be dealt with. I remember listening to a professor go on and on about urban sprawl while I was sitting there thinking "Who cares?" I still wonder the same thing. If people don't mind spending a lot of money on a McMansion and a lot of time in a long commute, who am I to use the power of government to stop them? If McMansions are becoming less popular, it's because people decide they're not worth the money. If people don't want to spend a good chunk of their day in rush hour traffic, you won't see much sprawl. As I see it, it's a self-correcting "issue".

 

[Beowulf]

No, not me and I'm big support of ethanol if customers want use as alternative to gasoline.

One summer I helped an engineering professor work on a project paid with a government grant. We rented a small steel warehouse, had boilers and plumbing installed, and made 200 proof alcohol from sugar (floor sweepings). He did something the the carburetor of an old truck and ran it with the alcohol. That was about 20 years ago and I have no idea what the updates could be, but we proved it was feasible.

 

[deafskeptic]

I don't support oil drilling unless improve the MPG, invest in clean energy and better safety/regulation are included.

Personally, while we drill I think we should also invest in alternative energy as well and yes we need clean energy and better safety stuff. We won't be able to use oil forever.

 

[Jiro]

Personally, while we drill I think we should also invest in alternative energy as well and yes we need clean energy and better safety stuff. We won't be able to use oil forever.

as Reba pointed out earlier - this nuclear power IS the alternative energy. the most practical and cost-effective option to this date.

 

[TXgolfer]

Personally, while we drill I think we should also invest in alternative energy as well and yes we need clean energy and better safety stuff. We won't be able to use oil forever.

Invest what???? The lint in Uncle Sam's pocket?

 

[Jiro]

Invest what???? The lint in Uncle Sam's pocket?

at least lint's flammable...

 

[Reba]

One summer I helped an engineering professor work on a project paid with a government grant. We rented a small steel warehouse, had boilers and plumbing installed, and made 200 proof alcohol from sugar (floor sweepings). He did something the the carburetor of an old truck and ran it with the alcohol. That was about 20 years ago and I have no idea what the updates could be, but we proved it was feasible.

What about vehicles that have fuel injectors instead of carburetors? Do you think they could also be modified?

 

[StSapphire]

as Reba pointed out earlier - this nuclear power IS the alternative energy. the most practical and cost-effective option to this date.

Yeah, I'm an environmentalist, and everything I've read indicates that Nuclear power is still the safest, cleanest, and most efficient method of energy production.

Of course, with the earthquakes in Japan causing a meltdown scare, we'll never actually get any more plants here, because the politics on issues like this is fueled by nothing but NIMBYs.

Offshore drilling, however, isn't even an issue - for those of you indicating that we ought to do that (even ignoring the fact that it's decimating protected natural habitats, because clearly the earth exists solely for our convenience... :roll, have you actually looked at the numbers? The expected gains from US offshore drilling are minimal, the current sites in the Gulf where oil companies can currently drill are heavily under-utilized, and even if anything is opened up, offshore drilling is so time-consuming and expensive that there would be exactly zero gains for another 10 years or so.