Difficuties

[C-NICE]

Well t don't see this conspiracy succeeding especially since CIs cost 5o to 100gs and ear and our health care in this country is a joke. Yeah they are going to get together and get congress to pass universal health coverage so every deaf child can get a CI. Lets no forget those third world countries with deaf kids. Contrary to your stated opinion there are kids with CIs who sign and are bilingual.

 

[hoichi]

Well t don't see this conspiracy succeeding especially since CIs cost 5o to 100gs and ear and our health care in this country is a joke. Yeah they are going to get together and get congress to pass universal health coverage so every deaf child can get a CI. Lets no forget those third world countries with deaf kids. Contrary to your stated opinion there are kids with CIs who sign and are bilingual.

can you pls answer the question i asked you thank you.
quote me in your reply

and i have never stated no children with CI grow up with sign..

so PLS qoute my actual words in your replies to me.
thank you

and i've answered every question you asked me, in good faith, and in the spirit of cooperation here on this forum i expect you to answer my sincere and pointed question to you..

 

[hoichi]

Yikes - I forgot the question, could you plse repeat?

Fuzzy

how would you feel if multi-nationals and orgs related to them and their professional apparatus actively worked to keep jewish kids away from other jewish kids so that they "do not revert back to being jew?"
how about native children? so that they "Do not revert back to being native?" how about black children so that they "do not revert back to being black?" how about gay children so that they "do not revert back to being gay?"

the above are very sincere questions to you,
id like a sincere answer

thank you

 

[C-NICE]

Answering your question children with CI are deaf when they are not wearing them. So it is impossible for the multinationals to achieve their goal you state they have. You are (My only intent is to state fact) is the best evidence yet. You make it clear that that there will always be those that choose to live without sound no matter what is invented.

 

[hoichi]

Answering your question children with CI are deaf when they are not wearing them. So it is impossible for the multinationals to achieve their goal you state they have. You are (My only intent is to state fact) is the best evidence yet. You make it clear that that there will always be those that choose to live without sound no matter what is invented.

that's not what i asked you. and i used Deaf..i asked you a very pointed and specific question in regards to very specific behaviour and actions.
so pls can you quote my exact question to you and under it provide your sincere answer the actual question i asked you.

thanks teach

i appreciate it

and again if YOU posses evidence that shows THEY do not do what i have been stating, in action and policy pls
nows the time..

 

[C-NICE]

Their policy and what they can achieve are two different things. The last thing I checked ASL still exist no children have been shown on CNN being herded into hearing camps with their CIs on. Katie Leclerc the actress learned to sign in HS as an elective. ASL id really in danger when High Schools teach it as an elective.

 

[hoichi]

Their policy and what they can achieve are two different things. The last thing I checked ASL still exist no children have been shown on CNN being herded into hearing camps with their CIs on. Katie Leclerc the actress learned to sign in HS as an elective. ASL id really in danger when High Schools teach it as an elective.

can you pls qoute my very words in your reply thank you.
my question was very specific. so pls quote it with your reply

we can discuss ASL but by your own admission you do not know it, nor do you know anything much about it so before i slam numbers on you, its prob best for us to first address the questions i already asked you.

so pls
can you answer the actual question i asked you. quote my very words.
thank you
oh
and what subjects,and or grade do you teach?

 

[C-NICE]

One I am a computer/business professional. 2. The only reason I have my career in thanks to my Nada right now. 3. Eventually in order to keep my career a CI will be in order. The multinational invented the CIs I got to see a happy six year old with his beaming with joy parents the last time I was at The Cleveland Clinic for my last audiology appointment.

 

[Audiofuzzy]

how would you feel if multi-nationals and orgs related to them and their professional apparatus actively worked to keep jewish kids away from other jewish kids so that they "do not revert back to being jew?"
how about native children? so that they "Do not revert back to being native?" how about black children so that they "do not revert back to being black?" how about gay children so that they "do not revert back to being gay?"

the above are very sincere questions to you,
id like a sincere answer

thank you

I wouldn't like that.
Now my question.

How would you feel if those very same multi-nationals, orgs and other apparatus not only did not kept Jewish kid apart from
other Jewish kids "so that they ... etc" but worked and helped them to communicate with each other even better?

Fuzzy

 

[hoichi]

One I am a computer/business professional. 2. The only reason I have my career in thanks to my Nada right now. 3. Eventually in order to keep my career a CI will be in order. The multinational invented the CIs I got to see a happy six year old with his beaming with joy parents the last time I was at The Cleveland Clinic for my last audiology appointment.

can you answer the actual question i asked you?

im sure you've faced and handled more difficult questions in your life.
so pls
answer my sincere question to you

 

[hoichi]

I wouldn't like that.
Now my question.

How would you feel if those very same multi-nationals, orgs and other apparatus not only did not kept Jewish kid apart from
other Jewish kids "so that they ... etc" but worked and helped them to communicate with each other even better?

Fuzzy

thank for you answering audiofuzzy, i appreciate you honesty and sincerity

so you would not like that

are you asking me, what i would think if these multi-nationals and related entities did NOT do what they do, ie actively work and engage in policies and actions to keep Deaf away from other Deaf kids and deny them sign language?

but instead worked toward helping them communicate with each other?

since we know as a fact the polices of the stated companies and organizations and again its no secret, i take your question as a hypothetical and not a statement of challenge to known facts of CI/AO/AVT/AGB.. behaviors towards Deaf

as to answer your question. , i have no bones with private companies doing what they do as long as 1)they do NOT actively work towards the elimination of my culture, language, and people. 2)that their polices do NOT work towards that aim, 3)and that they do NOT actively work towards keeping Deaf children away from Deaf children.
with all the above entails fully,

if the above criteria is met, then id be pretty much out of this.

i have a history in this, i've witnessed these very practices, and i've read the reports, i've seen the studies, i have read years worth of literature in this field, in my spare time i read phd these on this topic..

im very versed and well rounded in this topic and discussion. by not only being fluent in both languages involved, but a member fully of one of the communities involved and i wa s born into the other....

ie
im not just some stranger on the web thinking he knows stuff, when i don't..
ive been in this fight for 30 years..i know the parties involved, and the claims and counters, i know the history, and the ideologies that drives not only them, but OUR resistance to them

im solid

so now that after some time, you have answered my question, and again thank you. and i knew you wouldn't be the kind to actually like whats occurring. but i had to get you to state it to be sure.

so now we both agree on that, and indeed you wouldn't like it,

why not help us stop it?


you have a role to play in the future of Deaf and our language and our people, even if you are not Deaf,

its going to take a village, and then some

help us stop them

 

[hoichi]

i also want to add, to be more clear re your "even better" part to your question.
we know as a fact, that visual kinetic languages are far better suited to visual people ie Deaf then auricular or phocentric based languages.

especially in the "critical period" (and this actual period is debated within the relevant academic literature)
Denying visual kinetic languages to Deaf babies in the stage where the most need it, is essential criminal. and there is NO cause at all to do it besides ideology.

the implant itself doesn't do it, so we know the actual behaviour are not at all to do with the technology per se or the biology, its the ideological and constructs of the combined system that does it, and that's what needs to be challenged..

there si no do it better then a visual kinetic language for a Deaf baby or child...after all they can perceive the actual language..
unlike auricular phone centric ones..

they do what they are doing over ideology period!!
help us stop them

 

[Jezie]

I wouldn't like that.
Now my question.

How would you feel if those very same multi-nationals, orgs and other apparatus not only did not kept Jewish kid apart from
other Jewish kids "so that they ... etc" but worked and helped them to communicate with each other even better?

Fuzzy

Curious...
You say you would not like it. The question you post to Hoichi has me wondering something. Are you okay with the eradication of a culture if you deem it an improvement on them?

 

[Audiofuzzy]

Are you okay with the eradication of a culture if you deem it an improvement on them?

well, first you must establish what for you is "eradication as an improvement on them".


Fuzzy

 

[DeafDucky]

as a tiny side note in reference to the use of tech such as voice to voice vs sms/texting-- I know at least one hearing person who will not use voice calling if she can help it- only if she has to- she doesn't like it and prefers texting or emails/online chats. So it's not just isolated to deaf folks.

Carry on.

 

[Jezie]

well, first you must establish what for you is "eradication as an improvement on them".


Fuzzy

Going from Webster dictionary here at the house it sates eradicate means to remove something completely. While improve means an act to make or become better... now better seems an objective word for it falls back on to improve. So, that seems to be up to you...

 

[Audiofuzzy]

Going from Webster dicti
onary here at the house it sates eradicate means to remove something completely. While improve means an act to make or become better... now better seems an objective word for it falls back on to improve. So, that seems to be up to you...

I did not ask what it mean by dictionary definition.
I asked what it means TO YOU within the context of what we are discussing.
Don't be evasive if you want to participate with me, please. Reply straightforwardly and honestly.

Fuzzy

 

[Jezie]

I did not ask what it mean by dictionary definition.
I asked what it means TO YOU within the context of what we are discussing.
Don't be evasive if you want to participate with me, please. Reply straightforwardly and honestly.

Fuzzy

Not evading... I asked a question... I do not believe answering a question with one is answering it at all... that is evading my original question. Then, if you would like I will happily answer you.

 

[Audiofuzzy]

eradication of a culture if you deem it an improvement on them

okay, let's start, then ... so, for you improvement is??
a/living things as they are?
b/ combining Deaf Culture with technology, including CI, HAs, other
c/making the entire population deaf,
d/making the entire population hearing?
and, finally
e/ I need to know you understand that you know what sacrifice is. I need to know you understand that sometimes for the better of our children we need to sacrifice what is very dear and near for us.

If you don't reply I am not gonna tell you what I feel.
Fuzzy

 

[hoichi]

eradication of a culture if you deem it an improvement on them

okay, let's start, then ... so, for you improvement is??
a/living things as they are?
b/ combining Deaf Culture with technology, including CI, HAs, other
c/making the entire population deaf,
d/making the entire population hearing?
and, finally

these are questions, yes

e/ I need to know you understand that you know what sacrifice is.

WE know full well what sacrifice is to those not us wanting it for us...we do NOT at all bow to this dictate nor accept it. sorry to disappoint. this is our world too.
a canadian living true to the ideas of assimilation and colonialism i see, alas it worked so well against natives no kidding.

I need to know you understand that sometimes for the better of our children we need to sacrifice what is very dear and near for us.

then go sacrifice yourself...for the children....no one will stop you.

WE take great exception to you or anyone nominating us to be sacrificed...sorry. NO WAY LADY! we have a history with people nominating us to be sacrificed. the poison gas used on jews was first used on us, the T4 program was used on us before it was later applied to others, the smoke stacks were spewing our ashes and smoke before the ovens of auschwitz kicked in.

We have been nominated for sterilization against our will, for assimilation, WE were nominated to be prohibited to marry each other, for sacrifice, nominated to have our language and culture wiped out..so excuse us here.

when WE state to you, very politely

sacrificing us and our culture is NOT negotiable and NOT even on the table in this discussion. period!!

you wouldn't be over at a jewish board nominating them to get sacrificed so PLS spare us this nonsense!!

this world is as much ours as it is yours!!

we have every damn right to be here as you do, as does our children, and their children and their children and their children..and theirs and theirs....

it is NOT ACCEPTABLE at all for you or anyone to nominate us for sacrifice!!
so ask you if you cannot break yourself form such hideous ideals to not post them.
WE are Deaf here.

If you don't reply I am not gonna tell you what I feel.
Fuzzy

oh yes pls pray tell, tell us how you really feel..