Definition of "book learning"

Jiro, you're never supposed to use the "g" word. We're all supposed to pretend that we're playing with exactly the same brain power. Now, athletic prowess, that's ok to flaunt. :laugh2:
 
Reba said:
Other than doing illegal or immoral activities in order to gain material things, people don't have to sacrifice "self" for quality of life.

:P
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I think I could write a book on this sentence.

People don't have too -- But the do -- Worse they are encouraged to by typical reasons given to either stay in school or further their formal "education". High school grads earn more than drop outs. College grads earn more than high school grads. Ad nauseam.

In our world "quality of life" is seldom stressed except in the form of "gaining material things."

Often people do illegal and/or immoral things because they are not sacrificing their self to gain material things. Like Rosa Parks riding in the front of the bus or Brittany Spears posing pregnant and nude.

Reba said:
I guess I have a more optimistic, positive outlook on life. I don't resent people who (legally) earn more than me.


:P
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I don't resent people who legally or illegally earn more than I. It has nothing to do with me. Criminals, for whatever reason they do it, regardless of their earnings, take their chances with the law and/or angry victims.

People who legally earn more than I take their chances with the economy. Tomorrow that job may not be there... I know of a couple now... People who don't know how to live without their speed boat and Cadillac.

As long as a farmer needs his crop harvested, as long as I can tie animal balloons I will earn my daily bread.

I resent the guy who borrowed my 1/2 wrench and never returned it. He did nothing illegal, the law says I let him have it in the first place: Returning it is up to him and totally voluntary. Nor did he gain a wrench. I would have let him use it the next time he needed it.

Sounds like you have pretty much done what you have enjoyed in your life. Military, interpreting, and from the sound of it your "hard work" was not drudgery. I think that is wonderful.

I think the difference between us is you have never been called a loser and told "You can better yourself" by people who are incapable of understanding -- I am happy being where I am doing what I do.

I have never seen material things make a person happy. Gaining material things becomes an addiction that people will sacrifice friends, family, and self for.

Addicts are seldom happy people.
 
Jiro said:
if you're damn good at whatever you're doing, you will gain a type of recognition for it. It may not be shown in tv or appear in magazine but a respected acknowledgment by the community is more than enough for me - hence "word of mouth'
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Sometimes it really irritates me when someone says what I am thinking better than I would have said it myself.

:smash:
 
Berry said:
I resent the guy who borrowed my 1/2 wrench and never returned it. He did nothing illegal, the law says I let him have it in the first place: Returning it is up to him and totally voluntary. Nor did he gain a wrench. I would have let him use it the next time he needed it.
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You need to let go of that resentment for your own sake.

Believe me, I've been "wronged" many times, in small and big ways. But I can't cling to those things in life that are negative. Once that I'm satisfied that I've done all I can do to rectify a situation, then I let go.

Sounds like you have pretty much done what you have enjoyed in your life. Military, interpreting, and from the sound of it your "hard work" was not drudgery. I think that is wonderful.
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Yes, I enjoy what I do. Even when I had to work in "drudgery" I had a goal in mind, and that kept me going. I've done my share of cleaning public restrooms, routine clerical work, cooking on the line, cleaning up after the elite, customer service, and lots of dirty, sweaty outdoor labor. But those were a means to ends that have been very rewarding. Also, I looked upon every kind of job as a learning experience. My jobs also exposed me to all kinds of people in all kinds of socio-economic situations, for which I'm thankful.

I think the difference between us is you have never been called a loser and told "You can better yourself" by people who are incapable of understanding -- I am happy being where I am doing what I do.
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No, no one has said that to my face. Actually, I'm harder on myself than anyone else is.

I'm usually the "cheerleader" who supports and encourages the people whom others have called "losers." I have seen it happen to other family members and friends, and it really riles me.


Addicts are seldom happy people.
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I'd amend that to say that they are never truly happy or at peace.
 
Reba said:
My only disagreement with you is about "greed." Do you really consider it "greedy" to want pay raises and job advancements? If someone earns those things, how is that "greed?"

Don't hard working people have the right to improve the material quality of their lives without being considered "greedy?"

There are people who desire to learn new knowledge and skills. If they can parlay their knowledge and skills with a desire to apply them, enjoy what they do, fill a need within the community, and earn a living from that, who should call that "greed?"
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You raise a point there. :hmm: Personally, I'd only call it greed if people do unethical things to get rich.
 
Berry, that's how I see it, too. Happiness is sometimes the simple things in life. Leave me to play the piano for a few hours or so without distractions or disruptions, I'll find myself content. One of the many examples when simplicity in life is good for the soul.
 
I was indoctrinated with a healthy does of the Puritan work ethic. Hard work is good but it's bad to become a workaholic.

There is a lot of unethical activity in the business world. Some of it is in the "gray area." Not illegal but not ethical.
 
sallylou said:
I was indoctrinated with a healthy does of the Puritan work ethic. Hard work is good but it's bad to become a workaholic.

There is a lot of unethical activity in the business world. Some of it is in the "gray area." Not illegal but not ethical.
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Perhaps I should rephrase what I said to blatantly unethical work. Advertising can fall into a gray area; I'm a former advertising and graphic design major.
 
Is advertising really unethical? I thought that the purpose of advertising is to get people to buy a particular product. As critical consumers, we don't have to buy a product. Although, I do want one of those snugglies that make you look like a fool. . . (I digress)

If a product is harmful and the ad is misleading about the safety of the product, then it's unethical, like tobacco ads were in earlier decades. Maybe the prescription drug ads are over the line? I don't even know what the advertised drug does and the ad tells me to ask my doctor if this drug is right for me.

The ordinary commercials for glade, coke, ronco products (remember the food dehydrator?), etc. are not unethical. If I can resist the urge to grab my credit card when the tv announcer says, "Wait! There's more! You also get..." then I am making my own decision. That is, assuming that the food dehydrator won't blow up in my face but that's a product liability issue.
 
sallylou said:
Is advertising really unethical? I thought that the purpose of advertising is to get people to buy a particular product.
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I worked in public relations for a while, and I tried a stint as a salesman.

The purpose of advertising is to create a desire in a person so strong they will over look the fact their money could be better spent, or saved, elsewhere.

True stronger willed people will refuse to be tempted -- but is it ethical to pick on, or seduce, someone who is weak willed and just "can't resist"?

Certainly not illegal or immoral, but is it ethical?
 
I couldn't do it. I have a delicate conscience though. :dunno2:
 
sallylou said:
I couldn't do it. I have a delicate conscience though. :dunno2:
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I couldn't either. That is why I'm not making the big bucks I could have made.

By the way, if getting rich is anyone's primary aim the best path is not through education, it is through selling. Top salesmen make outrageous amounts.
 
Berry said:
I couldn't either. That is why I'm not making the big bucks I could have made.

By the way, if getting rich is anyone's primary aim the best path is not through education, it is through selling. Top salesmen make outrageous amounts.
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my brother is one of the top salesman you speak of.
He's only graduated high school. Bought his 3,300 sqft house in one of the most expensive cities in the nation when he was 23.
 
Jiro said:
if you're damn good at whatever you're doing, you will gain a type of recognition for it. It may not be shown in tv or appear in magazine but a respected acknowledgment by the community is more than enough for me - hence "word of mouth'
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But my point is that recognition has only made its way into language in a narrow set of fields.
 
The most wealthy people inherit money. The wealthiest self-made people are entrepreneurs with good business and marketing skills. And the guys who invented derivatives, sold them on Wall Street, and got bailed out by the taxpayers.
 
sallylou said:
The most wealthy people inherit money. The wealthiest self-made people are entrepreneurs with good business and marketing skills. And the guys who invented derivatives, sold them on Wall Street, and got bailed out by the taxpayers.
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Take a quick study of the railroads. Nothing new here.
 
No, same old idea. This is the first time that a deal was so public and that the taxpayers have to directly bear.
 
sallylou said:
Is advertising really unethical? I thought that the purpose of advertising is to get people to buy a particular product. As critical consumers, we don't have to buy a product. Although, I do want one of those snugglies that make you look like a fool. . . (I digress)

If a product is harmful and the ad is misleading about the safety of the product, then it's unethical, like tobacco ads were in earlier decades. Maybe the prescription drug ads are over the line? I don't even know what the advertised drug does and the ad tells me to ask my doctor if this drug is right for me.

The ordinary commercials for glade, coke, ronco products (remember the food dehydrator?), etc. are not unethical. If I can resist the urge to grab my credit card when the tv announcer says, "Wait! There's more! You also get..." then I am making my own decision. That is, assuming that the food dehydrator won't blow up in my face but that's a product liability issue.
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As a rule, no. There are some gray areas like when an ads say "4 out of five Denists approve of product x" What they don't tell you is the context behind this approval. Perhaps dentists recommend product x because of it's stock value not because it's sugar free.

Blatant disregard for people's safety is a whole another can of worms like that peanut butter company (I think it was Peanut Peanut Corporation of America) who blatantly disregarded people's safety by knowing the product was tainted and they sent it out regardless. If they had their own advertising dept who knew about it, that dept could be legally held responsible.

I think the safety dept was too lax. You need laws and people who are willing to enforce it. A law is no good if no one will enforce it.
 
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