Declaration of Occupy Wall Street

[Jiro]

Who paid for your Associate's Degree, Jiro? And if your university wasn't trying to fulfill a quota to keep their Federal Funding coming in under EEOC, I doubt seriously you would have found a job as easily as you claimed to have.

what made you think I have an Associate's Degree?

I've stated repeatedly over past few years that I have 2 degrees. My tuition's paid for by FAFSA, grants, NJ VR, and my hard-earned money from 2-years time-out from college.

 

[DeafCaroline]

I gave up on listening to whiners too if they don't want to accept their own responsibility and the consequence of their decisions.

I too suffered a hefty consequence of my decision. I paid for it. The question is.... will they accept it and pay for it too?

If they could get a job, they would be able to pay for it. I wonder...if you were unemployed right now and dealing with a huge loan and creditors threatening you and harassing you and going so far as to threaten to take your parents' house if you don't pay (of which you can't because you're unemployed), if you would still be saying all this.

 

[TWA]

I have paid thousands to my student loan debt, but almost all of that has gone to interest thus far, and I have a very low interest rate compared to students that graduating in the years following my graduation year.

I don't believe student debt should be forgiven, but the system is definitely set up so that lenders can squeeze out as much money as possible from the students. That needs to change.

I'm just glad I did not pay a dime for grad school (teaching fellowship). It wouldn't have been worth it.

 

[TXgolfer]

I gave up on listening to whiners too if they don't want to accept their own responsibility and the consequence of their decisions.

I too suffered a hefty consequence of my decision. I paid for it. The question is.... will they accept it and pay for it too?

Exactly

 

[Jiro]

Ok, so it's rich kids squandering parent's money in college that's the problem, not the evil banks who gave exploitative loans to students who HAD to get loans because their parents can't afford their education, let alone for their partying in university.

that's not what I said. I said it's the kids.... not rich kids.

again, FAFSA is only one of many finance options for students today. Just one of them.

Jiro...would you hire a guy who taught himself to be a doctor instead of one that went to Harvard medical school?

If that doctor is legally qualified to practice and if his background is rock solid and reliable.... yep I'd hire him over some Harvard shmuck with self-entitlement attitude.

and secondly, why would you hire anyone who has a degree that is useless to your company?

Didn't I make myself clear before? I thought it was very easy to understand. I repeat - "I pay for result, not credential." If you can do what I pay you to do, then you're hired! Simple as that.

Many kids don't have what employers are looking for and that's just very unfortunate.

you're making it sound like all students who got loans then went to college and got useless degrees and partied their asses off on their parents' dime and therefore it's all their fault that the banks exploited them.

I'm suddenly hearing the cuckoo clock piping up somewhere.

so would you hire useless people then?

 

[jillio]

what made you think I have an Associate's Degree?

I've stated repeatedly over past few years that I have 2 degrees. My tuition's paid for by FAFSA, grants, NJ VR, and my hard-earned money from 2-years time-out from college.

Because you demonstrate no evidence of anything above that level. Most IT degrees are Associate degrees.

What 2 degrees do you have, Jiro?

And if FAFSA paid for your education, you are the only person in the history of the United States who has had their education paid for by an application.:roll:

VR money? And you are talking about people looking for handouts? Very hypocritical of you. And you don't have to pay VR money back. You don't have to pay grant money back. You don't have to pay state ed grant money back. Looks like you took all your free handouts and now want to look down on those who have to pay their way.

 

[Beowulf]

All this uproar over student loans...
When they get phased out, it will become interesting at who truly gets educated.

 

[Beowulf]

that's not what I said. I said it's the kids.... not rich kids.


If that doctor is legally qualified to practice and if his background is rock solid and reliable.... yep I'd hire him over some Harvard shmuck with self-entitlement attitude.


Didn't I make myself clear before? I thought it was very easy to understand. I repeat - "I pay for result, not credential." If you can do what I pay you to do, then you're hired! Simple as that.

Many kids don't have what employers are looking for and that's just very unfortunate.


so would you hire useless people then?

When society collapses, do you think your degrees will earn you a spot in one of the camps?

 

[jillio]

All this uproar over student loans...
When they get phased out, it will become interesting at who truly gets educated.

Yes, yes it will. I daresay the ones who are motivated enough to go into debt to get their education are the same ilk that will take advantage of future options.

 

[TXgolfer]

I have paid thousands to my student loan debt, but almost all of that has gone to interest thus far, and I have a very low interest rate compared to students that graduating in the years following my graduation year.

I don't believe student debt should be forgiven, but the system is definitely set up so that lenders can squeeze out as much money as possible from the students. That needs to change.

I'm just glad I did not pay a dime for grad school (teaching fellowship). It wouldn't have been worth it.

Sounds reasonable and wise to me. I would be pissed about some of the interest rates out there if I had to pay them....some seem OK. I also like what you said earlier about wish you had done 2 years in JC and then gone to Berkeley

 

[TWA]

VR money? And you are talking about people looking for handouts? Very hypocritical of you. And you don't have to pay VR money back. You don't have to pay grant money back. You don't have to pay state ed grant money back. Looks like you took all your free handouts and now want to look down on those who have to pay their way.

I wouldn't mind seeing this point addressed.

 

[Jiro]

If they could get a job, they would be able to pay for it. I wonder...if you were unemployed right now and dealing with a huge loan and creditors threatening you and harassing you and going so far as to threaten to take your parents' house if you don't pay (of which you can't because you're unemployed), if you would still be saying all this.

That's why I support Obama's plan although I have a mixed feeling about it. It's the one that will protect students from "loan sharks" as "grace period" until they get a job. it makes absolutely no sense to demand them to pay back the money if they're unemployed.

But the reason why I have a mixed feeling about it is because you (general you) are the one who made a deal with Devil. You should know very well what may happen if you can't pay it back. You should know very well that it's not absolutely certain that you'll get a job with certain salary after graduation. I opted for FAFSA and nothing else because it's safe. It allows grace period until I find a job.

What you said in your post about loan sharks and creditors - been there, done that. That's what I was talking about - a hefty consequence that I paid for. I was a fuck-up back then and squandered my parents' money. I goofed off and flunked it. I dropped out of college because the debt was piling up. The creditors were on my parents' ass. I wised up, worked my ass off, saved up money... and used it for when I went back to college. Graduated in just 2.5 years. Shortly after, I landed a job with excellent benefit and good salary. Paid back to my parents for their hardship and debt that was caused by me.

Now... the question is.... will they accept their responsibility and pay for it? I did with heavy price.

 

[Daredevel7]

I was talking to an intern today about her life. She told me that she is pursuing an industrial engineering degree. I asked if she has always liked math/science. She said, "No not really, but I happen to be good at it." I then asked her what she really liked to do. She said "I love history, but let's be honest, who can get a job with a history degree?"

Smart gal, right?

To me, it's a bit sad, really.

 

[Jiro]

Because you demonstrate no evidence of anything above that level. Most IT degrees are Associate degrees.

ok. I say same for you but you don't see me asking you a lowball snarky comment like that, didn't ya?

What 2 degrees do you have, Jiro?

not important.

And if FAFSA paid for your education, you are the only person in the history of the United States who has had their education paid for by an application.:roll:

?

VR money? And you are talking about people looking for handouts? Very hypocritical of you. And you don't have to pay VR money back. You don't have to pay grant money back. You don't have to pay state ed grant money back. Looks like you took all your free handouts and now want to look down on those who have to pay their way.

oops sorry - not VR. I meant to say NJ state college grant. They offer $4,000 for those who go to college and that was enough to pay for my tuition since I graduated from in-state college. NJ VR did pay for my hearing aids because at that time, my father was unemployed.

I looked and researched long enough to find out how to pay for my tuition. If they did same, they would be in same shoes as me.

 

[jillio]

I was talking to an intern today about her life. She told me that she is pursuing an industrial engineering degree. I asked if she has always liked math/science. She said, "No not really, but I happen to be good at it." I then asked her what she really liked to do. She said "I love history, but let's be honest, who can get a job with a history degree?"

Smart gal, right?

To me, it's a bit sad, really.

Agreed.

 

[Beowulf]

I was talking to an intern today about her life. She told me that she is pursuing an industrial engineering degree. I asked if she has always liked math/science. She said, "No not really, but I happen to be good at it." I then asked her what she really liked to do. She said "I love history, but let's be honest, who can get a job with a history degree?"

Smart gal, right?

To me, it's a bit sad, really.

Yes, it is. It will come at a high price later on, when her mental health deteriorates and the costs have a rippling effect.

 

[jillio]

ok. I say same for you but you don't see me asking you a lowball snarky comment like that, didn't ya?


not important.


?


oops sorry - not VR. I meant to say NJ state college grant. They offer $4,000 for those who go to college and that was enough to pay for my tuition since I graduated from in-state college. NJ VR did pay for my hearing aids because at that time, my father was unemployed.

I looked and researched long enough to find out how to pay for my tuition. If they did same, they would be in same shoes as me.

That is still money that doesn't have to be paid back. Your tuition wasno more $4,000 a year? And you asked why I thought you had an associate's degree? Did you live at home with mom and dad? Like I said, took your free money and ran, and now want to look down on those that have paid for their education with loans. Shame on you.

Unemployed father? Then you should have a bit more emapthy for those that are going without jobs. You took advantage of the fact that your father was unemployed and accepted money from VR and a low enough household EIC to get your NJ grant money from the state, byt you want to degrade others who are trying to pay their way by taking out loans to pay tuition that is 3 times your $4000 a year per sememster. Get ahold of yourself.

 

[Jiro]

When society collapses, do you think your degrees will earn you a spot in one of the camps?

it wasn't my degree that got me here. it was my qualification, experience, and attitude that got me to where I am.

Gimme Gimme Gimme? nonsense... What camp would accept me with that kind of attitude?

 

[Beowulf]

That is still money that doesn't have to be paid back. Your tuition was $4,000? And you asked why I thought you had an associate's degree?

Like I said, took your free money and ran, and now want to look down on those that have paid for their education with loans. Shame on you.

Awww, take it easy on him. He is only 30.

 

[TWA]

Sounds reasonable and wise to me. I would be pissed about some of the interest rates out there if I had to pay them....some seem OK. I also like what you said earlier about wish you had done 2 years in JC and then gone to Berkeley

C'est la vie. I was young and wild and wanted to go off to college and live in the dorms like everyone else. I don't fault college students for the choices they made that got them into these high debt burdens, BUUUUTTTTT, expecting debt forgiveness is ridiculous. How fair is that to all the families that have paid their kids' education from their own hard earned money?

The vast majority of undergraduates I taught at Purdue did not have this gimme gimme attitude that Jiro is blasting off about. Most of them came from working class backgrounds. They were good students and worked hard, and they often supported themselves with side jobs. All of them expressed concern that they were having to take out so much loans and that the interest rates were high, but they had no other choice. None of them were demanding a handout, but at the same time, they all expressed bitterness over their situation. The issue of unfair student debt is a very real one that needs to be addressed.

Now, contrary to the undergrads, most graduate students I went to school with had massive amounts of debt that they didn't seem to give a care to at all. They were taking out loans on top of the fact that they were already getting teaching fellowships, which should have covered all their living costs. There was absolutely no need for them to take out loans, and yet they did. They were just dilettantes, sitting around the bar table thinking that as soon as they graduated they would land their high paying professorship and their debt would magically disappear. These types disgust me, but, and I am quite certain of this, these tools represent a tiny majority of the people with student loan debt.