ASL vs Oral in Education

SJCSue said:
Interpretrator, I love studying world languages! I was very excited about my college offering Arabic and Russian last spring. In hs, I studyed four years of Spanish, two years of French, a year of Italian and a semester of ASL. There are times at work when I wish I remeber more of Spanish I learned in school. I am 25% Puerto Rican (from my grandfather the singer).
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Your grandfather a famous singer? Anyone we know? My uncle was born in PR and played pro baseball for the Phillies in the 80s. :)
 
shel90 said:
Your grandfather a famous singer? Anyone we know? My uncle was born in PR and played pro baseball for the Phillies in the 80s. :)
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His name was Blas Hernandez. :) However, I am mainly Irish and German. :)
 
deafdyke said:
And there's ALSO the fact that there's a lot of money in going oral only.
The kids need speech therapists, access to good quality health care, CIs,hearing aids etc......wheras ASL really doesn't have a way for hearies to make money off of it.
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I agree 100% with you. Also many hearing people have hang-up about sign language. Funny, I have this hang-up about speaking and I am surprised that they didn't have this hang-up. I learned to speak as I had no choice as I was in the oral school. My hang-up is the expectorating part (that is spitting). I don't want somebody's germs!!!! Once a fat guy's spit landed on my face and boy, did I really lose my temper. Sign language is very sanitary.
 
Buffalo said:
I agree 100% with you. Also many hearing people have hang-up about sign language. Funny, I have this hang-up about speaking and I am surprised that they didn't have this hang-up. I learned to speak as I had no choice as I was in the oral school. My hang-up is the expectorating part (that is spitting). I don't want somebody's germs!!!! Once a fat guy's spit landed on my face and boy, did I really lose my temper. Sign language is very sanitary.
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Hahahaha! I never thought of it as it that way! Sign language being sanitary! That's a good one and SO TRUE!!!!
 
Buffalo said:
I agree 100% with you. Also many hearing people have hang-up about sign language. Funny, I have this hang-up about speaking and I am surprised that they didn't have this hang-up. I learned to speak as I had no choice as I was in the oral school. My hang-up is the expectorating part (that is spitting). I don't want somebody's germs!!!! Once a fat guy's spit landed on my face and boy, did I really lose my temper. Sign language is very sanitary.
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LOL! That is too funny!
 
jillio said:
Makes more sense than some of the reasons they come up with for not using sign! :giggle:
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What reasons they have come up for not using sign ??? I can think of many reasons for them to learn sign!! The biggie is the reason they should learn sign in case they lose their own hearing.
 
Buffalo said:
What reasons they have come up for not using sign ??? I can think of many reasons for them to learn sign!! The biggie is the reason they should learn sign in case they lose their own hearing.
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The biggest reason is that it is too hard, and that if they allow deaf children to use sign, it will interfere with them developing oral skills. And, of course, there is always the one that oral English is the language that the hearing parents speak, so the deaf child should have to adapt to that. In my opinion, all reasons based on ignorance.
 
Cousin Vinny said:
While I'm all for more ASL classes and awareness, I'm not so sure if ASL should be offered as a part of the foreign language requirement for a high school education. An elective would make more sense, I guess.

Part of my reason is based on my experiences as an ASL teacher, having taught high school classes. By large, hearing students do not seem to want to learn about ASL . . .
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Sorry about the edit, Vinny, but just a quick comment. I think I could agree for ASL to be an elective, but, if they don't want to learn it (free in high school), then when they see me or other deaf/hoh folks running around with hearing dogs, they shouldn't stop us and ask questions. After all, they turned down a free education to learn all about it, now they want something for free, not to mention they are interrupting us? I don't think so. I don't mean to sound snobby, but it's true.

Not sure where LMM is, but she and I both take our hearing dogs and their responsibilities very seriously. She may bend, as do I about "educating" someone who asks, but for the most part, I don't give any information free that I would charge for. :deal:
 
jillio said:
The biggest reason is that it is too hard, .
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If the deaf babies need to have CI in order to wire their brain for sounds, therefore the hearing babies need to learn sign language in order to wire their brain for signs. If they aren't learning sign language, develop some type of implant that will help them learn sign language and push it on them. (hehehe)

jillio said:
and that if they allow deaf children to use sign, it will interfere with them developing oral skills.
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Unfortunately, this forbidding of sign language interfere with deaf kids' education. Jillio, you and I know this old idea of one losing his/her speech once one learn sign language is B.S.! I learned sign language on the school bus (it was the only place I can sign openly). I didn't really want to learn to speak until I was about 12. When I realized that the deaf people are really the minority and I don't want a menial job, is when I really was motivated in learning to speak.

jillio said:
And, of course, there is always the one that oral English is the language that the hearing parents speak, so the deaf child should have to adapt to that. In my opinion, all reasons based on ignorance.
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Yup. Yup. Yup. I doubt they will give up their power over deaf education. Greedy! I am not happy with the quality of the deaf education. I just think if there is an all-deaf board and deaf/CODA teachers, we could make it better down the road. Think role models. The big problem is that the parents might not sign with their kids from birth until they start school. Plus the oral failures from other schools and CI failures that hasn't learn sign language.
 
The orginal post poses some good questions. I see over and over on this site that some folks promote ASL in young students citing that it's proven a better method. Then why aren't these people doing whatever it takes to make it happen and promote this with all of the research and emperical metrics and other evidence. I can't imagine that if the kids benefit from this approach that the educators would not be interested in it. I really don't think there is a conspiracy against the deaf. If that were the case then none of the newer methods would have evolved. They have evolved out of the genuine desire to help, not hinder. Where are the ASL advocates? It's easy to gripe about stuff but it's those that step up and do something about it that really make a difference. And to be clear on my personal position, its one of choice. I am not condoning the oral approach by posting here.
 
Buffalo said:
If the deaf babies need to have CI in order to wire their brain for sounds, therefore the hearing babies need to learn sign language in order to wire their brain for signs. If they aren't learning sign language, develop some type of implant that will help them learn sign language and push it on them. (hehehe)



Unfortunately, this forbidding of sign language interfere with deaf kids' education. Jillio, you and I know this old idea of one losing his/her speech once one learn sign language is B.S.! I learned sign language on the school bus (it was the only place I can sign openly). I didn't really want to learn to speak until I was about 12. When I realized that the deaf people are really the minority and I don't want a menial job, is when I really was motivated in learning to speak.



Yup. Yup. Yup. I doubt they will give up their power over deaf education. Greedy! I am not happy with the quality of the deaf education. I just think if there is an all-deaf board and deaf/CODA teachers, we could make it better down the road. Think role models. The big problem is that the parents might not sign with their kids from birth until they start school. Plus the oral failures from other schools and CI failures that hasn't learn sign language.
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Agree with you on all counts. And deaf education needs revision if our deaf students are ever going to get the benefit they deserve. That is why I am such a supporter of the Bi-Bi method. It includes the cultural aspects, the linguistic aspects, and employs exactly the role models that these kids need...successful deaf adults. Until we start educting deaf kids from the deaf perspective, rather than the hearing perspective, we will continue to underserve them.
 
Tousi said:
I stumbled across this today from the WSJ of all places.....

OpinionJournal - Leisure & Arts
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Yeah, I always find the communities interesting. I read recently about the one in Bali, Indonesia. I always find it paradoxical that when discussing cultural difference, there are fewer differences between 2 separate deaf cultures than between 2 separate hearing cultures. And from a communication perspective, the deaf can more easilty communicate cross culurally with other groups than can 2 hearing people.
 
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