Are you Pro-Life or Pro-Choice?

[Foxrac]

Whose choice?


No excuse. It's the law.


Not for the victim. A so-called "life" sentence for murderers is NOT pro-life for the victims.


The death penalty in the USA is part of the due process of law. It is legal, and therefor, not murder. It is justice, not revenge.

I'm not going to repeat myself again. If you don't get it the first ten times, ten times more isn't going to make a difference.

In all these posts that support "life" for the murderers, I don't read any support for the victims. I'm just sick of this.

Death penalty is illegal in several states.
Capital punishment in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

USA isn't worse as China does but before late 70's is alot more worse, also many of murder cases are goes to ADX, life in prison and federal prison, depends on court trial.

I agree with diehardbikers that death row is too easier for prisoners to terminate their life period because prisoners can end up their life before getting bored in prison or something like that.

 

[Reba]

Death penalty is illegal in several states....

The United States allows the death penalty in whatever states want to use it.

In the states where the death penalty is "illegal" executions are not carried out, so no laws are broken.

Therefor, death penalty executions in the USA are not "murder".

I'm not arguing; just clarifying.

 

[rjr2006]

pro-choice here

 

[Hwy99]

It is not a lame excuse. Look at a lot of children are being abuse by their parents. Why should they born to abuse parents then? I had a DVD - true and sad story "Young to Die". A mother neglect a girl a lot and told her that she do not wish to born her... and complaint that she sacrafie half of her life for raise her...

Well you overreacted my list, I didn't listed the "Rape" as lame excuse, read carefully.

I know from an experience. My mother had me when she was 17 years old and struggle with me and my siblings. She struggle with money because her husband spent money on gambling... etc... etc... etc... and let step-dad abuse us emotionally which is unfair for children suffer like this. My mother married 3 times... their relationship goes different after have babies. True! Have babies are responsiblity which is different as couple with no children. It goes the same thing with my sister as well. She had a child when she was 19 years old and bad mother to her 3 kids. She told me often that she is VERY regret to have babies at early age and have no life experience... It ends her to abuse drugs until she is dead last year.

Well think about it, if your mom abort you, then you won't be here to debate with us. Are you getting my point?

I know myself because my hubby & I were free and enjoy our life and travel alot for 7 years until we feel ready to start family. Oh yes, have family are a big step and responsibities.

Yes, the children change our lives.
Yes, the children cost us a lot of money.
Yes, we should be feel ready to be mature parents first before we started family, that´s why we wait for 7 years.

Why? Because they are not mature enough to be mother or parents which is unfair for children. Look at them, abuse children, etc.

I find disguist when anyone label the parents for as lame excuse because I had been through and know what it really is.

Seems like you are too picky about how perfect life is, no matter what life they have, their life is very beautiful. If we abort them because their life is not perfect, then they won't be here for us to learn how to help them. Get my point?

Did you know that sex protection are not 100% safety, that´s how end unwanted babies? Would you want some mothers end unhappy and struggle her life like this when fathers left them and run away... or no interesting for babies.

It's not about parents, it's about the children.

I do against anyone who abort dozen of times without sex protection but they do use sex protection but it´s not 100% safety.

Yeah I agree with you, it's wrong when people get sex without the safe sex protection like condom, birth control pill, stuff. But it's still their fault, they knew they can stop pregnancy while sex. That is why I say "It is always shame on parents to send baby for adoption or abort the babies."

I half agree with you, half not agree with you

Umm, wanna clarify that a bit more?
Are you saying you dont think criminals should not
get the death penalty (even after DNA proves them
guilty), right?
You said "but let those people who did bad things to
exit the world" ok HOW SO? CARE TO EXPLAIN
THAT?
Put them on space ship and drop them off on Mars?
LOL! just kidddinnngggg!!

LOL! Well what I mean is the death penalty seems doesn't solve the gulity person for other victims because that qulity person would just exit the world as free. I think it's better things instead of death penalty, why not electrode that person everyday, every morning and night, that person suffer in the world for his mistake? It would be better than just kill him. Don't you get it?

That's his personal, you can't conflict with his personal.

I'm on same side as what he said.

Thanks

Wow, other hardhead member.

Yeah Defee seems too defended, he's just taking my side, Defee There's nothing wrong with that.

 

[vrsterp]

I'm really sorry you had to go through this. I know it happens. This is one of the reasons I'm pro life because young girls don't always have a choice. They are controlled by their parents/boyfriends who may want to get rid of the baby.

Instead, outlawing abortion makes them controlled by you. That's no better.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

You and I have fully debated this topic several times in several threads. I'm not going to get sucked into it again.

I'm not for "revenge." The death penalty is legal in my state and many others, so it is not "murder." It is the result of due process of law. Murderers who get "life" sentences often don't stay in prison until they die.

Yes, you are right that we do not need to repeat our debate about death penalty. You know my POV as the same I know your POV as well.

I obey USA's laws, and you obey Germany's laws.

Many Americans are against death penatly and hope it will be outlaw in different states.

Americans are against death penatly - Google-Suche

 

[Liebling:-)))]

I dont blame what Cheri said about your statement about the Christians are for pro-life and death penalty..so what?

I am afraid yes, see yourself what you, Marie, Cheri and Reba said here and several Christians. What you all support death penalty and against abortion are a pro-choice.

a lot of non-believers feel the same way too..geez.

Not really. Yes, you are right that some non-believers support death penalty but it´s not really many as believers.
Americans are against death penatly - Google-Suche

That statement you said shows that you still have some animosity
against the christians...tsk tsk.

I really has no idea what you are talking about... I only stated in general way what I saw many Christians in ADers support death penatly... You already said that you support death penalty... Right? Reba, Marie and Cheri already said that they support death penatly... Right? You all are Christians, right? Please use your common sense. I think it´s really silly and childish to accuse anyone for against the Christians... Nobody said negative about Christians but stated from saw their posts... That´s all... *shake my head*

 

[Liebling:-)))]

I am against the death penalty. I am also vegan and anti war. It's wrong to kill.

Forget add my post... Yes I am also anti-war, too.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Death penalty is illegal in several states.
Capital punishment in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

USA isn't worse as China does but before late 70's is alot more worse, also many of murder cases are goes to ADX, life in prison and federal prison, depends on court trial.

I agree with diehardbikers that death row is too easier for prisoners to terminate their life period because prisoners can end up their life before getting bored in prison or something like that.

Very true... That´s why I do not support death penatly. It was like "put crimes" sleep peaceful like what they did with the pet to "save their suffer". I want to see them suffer in prison as long as they are alive.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Well you overreacted my list, I didn't listed the "Rape" as lame excuse, read carefully.

See your own word...

Couldn't afford baby, not ready for responsibility, concerned how child would change lives, relationship problem, not mature enough, had all the children they wanted

IS A LAME EXCUSE

Where have I said about "Rape"? No, I tried to explain about the abusive parents accord your post "Couldn´t afford, not ready for responsibility, concerned how child would change lives, relationship problem, not mature enough, had all the children they wanted" which mean is IF they don´t beleive in abortion and are being force to keep their unborn babies when they doesn´t feel ready to be mature mother, etc like what you said in your post, could end to abuse their children and struggle with money, etc... which is bad environment for child... it could lead them commit suicidee, criminals.

Well think about it, if your mom abort you, then you won't be here to debate with us. Are you getting my point?

Well, I has to honest with you that I do not wish to being born to my parents but other parents. I suffered badly during childhood. Thanks therapy´s help to devolop what I am. I am glad to spent my years at boarding school than at home. I often envied my friends´s when I look their loving and lovely environment home and often wish my friend´s parents are my parents.

Seems like you are too picky about how perfect life is, no matter what life they have, their life is very beautiful. If we abort them because their life is not perfect, then they won't be here for us to learn how to help them. Get my point?

I see nothing wrong to make sure that children deserve better life and loving parents to expose them with good environment before start a family...because its about mature parents how to deal with responsiblities to bring their children up with good and loving enviroment. Children´s welfare and interest are most matter to me. You said that "not feel ready to be responsible, not mature, money, etc are lame excuse". I am myself mother of 2 teenagers and know what it alike. It´s not easy job to educate the children into good path... money, responsiblity, etc.. I would consider the parents as selfish for hurry up and want to be parents without think twice because they just want be parents and never thought how to deal responsiblities with children upbringing then end abuse or neglect them... expose them into bad teenagers. A lot of the parents struggle with money and run to government for money... and living at poor enviroenment where the children should not deserve like this. I the mothers for decide to give their babies up for an adoption with their strong willing when they KNEW they are not feel ready to be mature parents but I know the problem is the mothers often change their mind in last minute for want to keep their babies instead of give up for adoption then later regret for keep their baby... worst... That´s why I respect if the mothers decide to abort less than 12 weeks old fetus because they know that they are too weak to give their babies up for adoption after look at babies... cute faces... it makes them nightmares a lot...

It's not about parents, it's about the children.

No, it´s about both parents and children. It´s mother´s decision, not everyone because it´s her body and mind either she is ready to accept the responsibity as mature mother or not with her strength. It´s better way like this than force to keep baby and abuse/neglect them... It´s parents´ responsiblity to expose their children into good environment... it will go bad for the children if parents fail their responsibity. It will go good for the children if the parents feel ready being mature and responsibity parents.

Yeah I agree with you, it's wrong when people get sex without the safe sex protection like condom, birth control pill, stuff.

Yes, that´s right.

But it's still their fault, they knew they can stop pregnancy while sex.

But you know that sex protection are not always 100% safety which is unfair for mothers to carry unwanted baby. It´s their bodies and mind either they can accept their responsiblity as mothers and think twice either they are able to give their babies their love or not.

That is why I say "It is always shame on parents to send baby for adoption or abort the babies."

I respect your POV but I disagree with you on this because it´s mother´s body and decision. It´s them who raise their babies with their strength. Did you know that some mothers can´t get good strength to raise the children then end abuse/neglect them? I prefer to give babies up for adoption than abuse/neglect them.

I half agree with you, half not agree with you

Me, too... It´s no problem to agree to disagree each other over our POV...

 

[Liebling:-)))]

For unborn babies, if they are 18 weeks old or less, then they can be aborted because they have not developed their brain included the feelings. I do not know why they wait longer. Don't forget that you are a lady that could happen mistake to have a sex with a handsome man. You know you eat your scrambled eggs for breakfast. Oh, you forgot that you killed them. Gee. Of course not. It's because they have not developed. That's safe.

It's your own body to choose whether to have an abortion or not. It is not our business. We should respect people's choice. We should not tell a woman what to do with her life. You know what I mean.

Accord red bond... You did said in your previous post about this... Yes it´s good example but the people see it different.

Many foster parents abuse the children which is pretty common. Some kids commit suicide - two reasons: they cannot find their real parents, and they are depressed with abused foster parents.

It´s scary... I didn´t know "many" but I thought it could be "rare"...

 

[Hwy99]

See your own word...

Couldn't afford baby, not ready for responsibility, concerned how child would change lives, relationship problem, not mature enough, had all the children they wanted

IS A LAME EXCUSE

Where have I said about "Rape"? No, I tried to explain about the abusive parents accord your post "Couldn´t afford, not ready for responsibility, concerned how child would change lives, relationship problem, not mature enough, had all the children they wanted" which mean is IF they don´t beleive in abortion and are being force to keep their unborn babies when they doesn´t feel ready to be mature mother, etc like what you said in your post, could end to abuse their children and struggle with money, etc... which is bad environment for child... it could lead them commit suicidee, criminals.



Well, I has to honest with you that I do not wish to being born to my parents but other parents. I suffered badly during childhood. Thanks therapy´s help to devolop what I am. I am glad to spent my years at boarding school than at home. I often envied my friends´s when I look their loving and lovely environment home and often wish my friend´s parents are my parents.





I see nothing wrong to make sure that children deserve better life and loving parents to expose them with good environment before start a family...because its about mature parents how to deal with responsiblities to bring their children up with good and loving enviroment. Children´s welfare and interest are most matter to me. You said that "not feel ready to be responsible, not mature, money, etc are lame excuse". I am myself mother of 2 teenagers and know what it alike. It´s not easy job to educate the children into good path... money, responsiblity, etc.. I would consider the parents as selfish for hurry up and want to be parents without think twice because they just want be parents and never thought how to deal responsiblities with children upbringing then end abuse or neglect them... expose them into bad teenagers. A lot of the parents struggle with money and run to government for money... and living at poor enviroenment where the children should not deserve like this. I the mothers for decide to give their babies up for an adoption with their strong willing when they KNEW they are not feel ready to be mature parents but I know the problem is the mothers often change their mind in last minute for want to keep their babies instead of give up for adoption then later regret for keep their baby... worst... That´s why I respect if the mothers decide to abort less than 12 weeks old fetus because they know that they are too weak to give their babies up for adoption after look at babies... cute faces... it makes them nightmares a lot...




No, it´s about both parents and children. It´s mother´s decision, not everyone because it´s her body and mind either she is ready to accept the responsibity as mature mother or not with her strength. It´s better way like this than force to keep baby and abuse/neglect them... It´s parents´ responsiblity to expose their children into good environment... it will go bad for the children if parents fail their responsibity. It will go good for the children if the parents feel ready being mature and responsibity parents.



Yes, that´s right.



But you know that sex protection are not always 100% safety which is unfair for mothers to carry unwanted baby. It´s their bodies and mind either they can accept their responsiblity as mothers and think twice either they are able to give their babies their love or not.



I respect your POV but I disagree with you on this because it´s mother´s body and decision. It´s them who raise their babies with their strength. Did you know that some mothers can´t get good strength to raise the children then end abuse/neglect them? I prefer to give babies up for adoption than abuse/neglect them.




Me, too... It´s no problem to agree to disagree each other over our POV...

I am total speechless from your big post lol. All I can say neither way parents get mistake pregnancy, all the choices they have, adopt, abort, etc. are just a very terrible things.

I don't have any kids myself, but I have two pets, guinea pig and a cat, I know my own limitation, I always want a new dog, but I know I can't because I already have a guinea pig and a cat.

It's just like the parents, parents should know their own limitation too.

That's all I can say.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

You talked about the pets... Okay, I am going to share mine about my pets as well.

I am total speechless from your big post lol. All I can say neither way parents get mistake pregnancy, all the choices they have, adopt, abort, etc. are just a very terrible things.

I don't have any kids myself, but I have two pets, guinea pig and a cat, I know my own limitation, I always want a new dog, but I know I can't because I already have a guinea pig and a cat.

It's just like the parents, parents should know their own limitation too.

That's all I can say.

Oh yeah, I´m a terrible mother/owner because I took Kim, my 2nd cat´s 2 of 4 kitten away from her to new home... Terrible isn´t it?

I choose to give 2 kitten away because I know my limitation for not want to keep all of 4 kitten total to 6 cats. Right?

It´s the same thing with human who knows their limitation as well. It´s just unluck that´s because sex protection are not 100% safety... thats why they use their limitation and decide either they can do it or not.

 

[Mistyrose]

Wow, other hardhead member.

LOL! me hardhead?? Look at yourself!! haha..
YOU did the same thing!! in the other thread!!
Ahh, sweeeet revenge!!

 

[Foxrac]

LOL! me hardhead?? Look at yourself!! haha..
YOU did the same thing!! in the other thread!!
Ahh, sweeeet revenge!!

No, you are so, then whatever.

 

[Foxrac]

Forget add my post... Yes I am also anti-war, too.

Same here, I'm so.

 

[Foxrac]

I am afraid yes, see yourself what you, Marie, Cheri and Reba said here and several Christians. What you all support death penalty and against abortion are a pro-choice.



Not really. Yes, you are right that some non-believers support death penalty but it´s not really many as believers.
Americans are against death penatly - Google-Suche



I really has no idea what you are talking about... I only stated in general way what I saw many Christians in ADers support death penatly... You already said that you support death penalty... Right? Reba, Marie and Cheri already said that they support death penatly... Right? You all are Christians, right? Please use your common sense. I think it´s really silly and childish to accuse anyone for against the Christians... Nobody said negative about Christians but stated from saw their posts... That´s all... *shake my head*

I can call them an "not true pro-life".

dreama is one member that's true pro-life.

I feel that Reba has feeling about want homosexual to be punished by death penalty like in Iran does, also homosexual (not commit crime) are innocent like babies does.

 

[Maria]

I am afraid yes, see yourself what you, Maria, Cheri and Reba said here and several Christians. What you all support death penalty and against abortion are a pro-choice.


FYI, I am NOT pro-choice. Okay ? I am for pro-life. I just want to remind you that your POV and mine are different. Please, keep that in mind. And, also please, try not to lock this thread if, you keep arguin'. Respect them for their differences in POV/and opinions.

Please, call me Maria, not Marie.

 

[Maria]

Maria -

I do not support a death penalty. The reason is that some people are innocent. The police arrested the wrong people. It is a little bit common nowaday. In reality, many police really do not give a damn, and they really want is to get a reward from their job. That's what they want. You know some crazy police love to hurt people by beating them with their stick. It's their testosterone. My former boss was a cop, and he told me some stories. I cannot believe it.

Yep, I am aware of all this about the cops doin' their dirty works. It's why there's a DNA requirement to prevent innocent persons from goin' to jail. And, also some police departments are corrupted.

Actually, jailers do not have the right to voice their expression. They have the right to get a lawyer only one or two times. After that, they are stuck to deal with unfriendly police in the prison. It is very scary.

Right. They STILL do have the right to voice their expression by gettin' a lawyer. But, where's the unborn babies' right to expressed ?

For unborn babies, if they are 18 weeks old or less, then they can be aborted because they have not developed their brain included the feelings. I do not know why they wait longer. Don't forget that you are a lady that could happen mistake to have a sex with a handsome man. You know you eat your scrambled eggs for breakfast. Oh, you forgot that you killed them. Gee. Of course not. It's because they have not developed. That's safe.

I disagree with ya there. Life begins when the egg and sperm join to create a baby. Life is startin' to work by makin' the unborn child. Use your imagination or use the lab's microscope to bring closer to its microscope to see how the egg and sperm are workin' together to create a baby. THAT'S when life begins. If, a mother decides to abort fetus from her womb in later weeks, I still call her a murderer for killin' fetus, because of its heart beatin'. Heart beatin' represents " life ". Why would doctors have their heart beatin' monitors at hospitals ? Doctors will use paddles from " defilberator " machine to save patient's life. How come doctors rely on the hearts ? They know it's " life " heart. No heart, there's no life. Oh, yeah I am sure you know about the machine for the brain to see if, it is still activity for comatose patients and, if it shows a sign that it can't be reversed, then they will probably unplug the patient's life support machine and let the patient die, right ? Why life support machine ? Have you noticed most of doctors rely on " life " machines such as defilberator and life support ? Doctors knew the difference in between " life " and " death ".

It's your own body to choose whether to have an abortion or not. It is not our business. We should respect people's choice. We should not tell a woman what to do with her life. You know what I mean.

I understand. But, I don't like the idea of " killin' " unborn child when the unborn child can't voice to stop. It really bothers me. I have the feelin' for this poor unborn babies ( fetuses ).

Many foster parents abuse the children which is pretty common. Some kids commit suicide - two reasons: they cannot find their real parents, and they are depressed with abused foster parents.

I know. I've seen it all over papers and news. It's very heartbreakin'. Some foster parents don't show love. Some foster parents are just wantin' the money from the state to take care of the " unwanted " children. Not ALL foster parents are like that. It's best to give the baby to relatives/or families of mine IF, I decide not to keep the child rather than to strangers who are foster parents.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

I am afraid yes, see yourself what you, Maria, Cheri and Reba said here and several Christians. What you all support death penalty and against abortion are a pro-choice.


FYI, I am NOT pro-choice. Okay ? I am for pro-life. I just want to remind you that your POV and mine are different. Please, keep that in mind. And, also please, try not to lock this thread if, you keep arguin'. Respect them for their differences in POV/and opinions.

Please, call me Maria, not Marie.

Keep arguing? I am not come to make argue but convince the fact that it´s pro-choice accord Pacman´s link at post #136 when anyone are against abortion and support death penalty.

Respect? It has nothing do with respect when I disagree with your POV over pro-choice vs pro-life. What´s this debate thread for? We can debate with agree to disagree in polite way. Yes I know each person entitle her/his own POV but I still can disagree with their POV and explain them why.

I am allow to say that you are pro-choice no matter either you disagree with me or not. You has to accept the fact when you don´t like my POV about pro-life vs pro-choice.

I don´t like to hear those word "pro-choice" but I has to accept the fact that I am a pro-choice, not pro-life because I support abortion to save mother or baby´s life because their life are most matter and euthanasia.

Re-read those link what 'pro-life' is about.

Pro-life - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Anyway, thank you for correct me 'Maria', not Marie.