am i really supposed to??
- Thread starter Southern
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Southern.. if the hearing person said something off about the deaf person or about deafness in general in the presence of the deaf person.. why dont you call the hearing person on their sh@t? Ya better not have done that yourself either(I'm concerned about this by part of your comment: "I said off things myself from time to time.").
That is simply an extreme case of disrespect, plain and simple. If it was in done in front of the deaf person, then the hearing person out of the room analogy doesn't compare..very well.. It's more like 'haha, I can say anything in front of the deafie, haha!'. That's totally belittling/dehumanizing the deaf person, a rift has already been created.. by the hearing person.
That is simply an extreme case of disrespect, plain and simple. If it was in done in front of the deaf person, then the hearing person out of the room analogy doesn't compare..very well.. It's more like 'haha, I can say anything in front of the deafie, haha!'. That's totally belittling/dehumanizing the deaf person, a rift has already been created.. by the hearing person.
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I agree..if the hearing people are aware that a deaf person is in their presence and starts saying negative comments about deaf people, that is just extremely disrespectful. However, I have know in situations in a deaf group, some deaf people make nasty comments about hearing people in front of hearing people using ASL which makes them just as wrong too.
For you to interpret that...nah..save yourself the trouble and tell that hearing person or persons that they are being disrespectful. It can start a bar brawl so have to use judgement on whether it is worth it or not. I can usually sense when hearing people are mocking me or talking about me so I usually ask my husband or hearing friends what they are saying or I will go up to them myself and ask them what's up. LOL! Usually, my husband would confront the hearing person or persons before I suspect anything. We have had a few incidents of that happening but luckily those hearing people would be so shocked that my husband was able to hear their nasty comments to react.
Shel, I'm with you that it utlimately goes both ways but I was disappointed reading this thread that nobody even suggested calling the hearing person(s) on their sh@t. It was all about the Deaf person.. excuse me, what about the rude hearing person?
And you go girl, hearing people being stupid aren't confronted about it often enough!
And you go girl, hearing people being stupid aren't confronted about it often enough!
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About confronting whoever is mocking me, I make sure that they are mocking me first. Imagine if I confronted an innocent hearing person.
There are times I am not sure and I dont do anything about it then later I find out from my hearing friends that I was right. I am like, "Why didnt u say anything in the first place?" They were like "U didnt ask and we didnt want to cause problems." I guess it is an awkward situation for many people in that kind of situation.
Cathartes and Shel don't get it twisted, the deaf person of whom i speak is my best friend. Had this person said something with regard to deafness or made fun of him in anyway in that respect i would knock his throat to his feet and the hearing person would now have to talk through his toes. Please note i said the comment was off colored as in a comment of a sexual nature, which i will not repeat here. For you Cathartes i will refine my analogy. If a hearing person had been in the room and another hearing person said something about the first hearing person that is off colored. The second didn't hear it for what ever reason not paying attention who knows.... i would not tell that person. even in the same room. both hearing. Some things are better left unsaid. I have seen Deaf people do this "what did you say??".... Oh nothing" or talk about some one who is in the same room but whose back is turned. And i am feircely protective of my friend. Not because he is Deaf, because he can more than take up for himself, but because he is my friend. As for me making a joke as to Deafness that wouldn't make a whole lot of sense since i come to this site, (a Deaf site) everyday. I studied and practiced for 2 hours everynight to learn signs during my 7 weeks and learned 1,000 signs and am with my Deaf friends the majority of the week, every week. And i would not spend nearly 1,000.00 over the next 2 years on ASL classes to be better and to sign in ASL rather than English. No that is not a joke that i would make. Not because ooooo it is taboo but because i am a better person than that. Read my words for what they are and don't add your own meanings into them.
Also i started a thread some weeks ago with regards to a situation that happened to me in a bar titled "how should i act" which i will provide an update on that whole situation. It is in our world our culture, please feel free to read it.
Also i started a thread some weeks ago with regards to a situation that happened to me in a bar titled "how should i act" which i will provide an update on that whole situation. It is in our world our culture, please feel free to read it.
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Southern, if I twisted your words, then help me here. What do u mean by "What if it is (the off colored comment) about the person that is deaf?" and then u went to say "when this happened to me I dont tell them". That is where I got the impression that something was said about the deaf person that u didnt feel comfortable telling the person what was said so it must have not been such a nice comment. Correct me if I am wrong but that was how I interpreted it.
Taric25
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Sex interpretation
Southern, sweetie, when I'm with my Deaf/Hard-of-Hearing/Oral Deaf/Latened Deafened/DeafBlind friends, I always intepret everything, a lot of times, to the distain of the Hearing people, "No! Don't don't interpret that!"
I remember, one of my DeafBlind then-friends, Barry, was at the house of my HearingBlind friend, Nader. To make things worse, Nader is a Muslim, and Barry is a Jew. Nader has one Hard-of-Hearing roommate, Kirk, and one Oral Deaf roommate, John. Nader has lost a lot of his sense of touch, so Deaf people can't really fingerspell into his hands. They must speak. Barry is not totally Blind. He's Low-Vision, so he can see signs of White hands against a black shirt. (If the interpreter is Black, then he can see the signs against an off-white shirt.) He can speak well, but Nader had some problems understanding his speech. Nader tried to fingerspell to Barry, but Nader was wearing a white shirt, so I interpreted. Anyway, Nader is Straight, but Barry is Gay and had no problem talking about his sexuality. Nader's mom, Linda, talked about how it's a sin, then when she saw me signing, she exclaimed "No! Don't don't interpret that!" Barry went on to say something to the effect of how Homosexualily is normal and Heterosexuality is abnormal. Nader had just about had it up to here, but after a while, Nader's whole family stopped seeing me as part of the conversation and more of a conduit of the conversation. They realized that if they didn't want Barry to respond to something, they shouldn't ask me not to interpret it. They just shouldn't say it, just like if they were talking to anyone else.
IMHO, in any situation, I try to interpret as much as possible and leave the fact that I am interpreting as a medium of the conversation.
Another example occured, when I was at a LGBT (Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transexual) get-together. There was a Hearing woman, who only knew how to fingerspell, and I thought it was rude to leave her out of the conversation, so I interpreted for her, however, some of the Hearing people who were signing, found this distracting, because they found it very strange to hear someone else's interpretation of what they were signing. In a way, it sounded like an annoying echo. I solved this by scooting next to her more closely and whispering my interpretation in her ear. She also found it much more enjoyable, because when she wanted to add her comments, all she had to do was talk, and I would interpret for her. It was just like as if she was talking to anybody else.
This annoying echo hasn't only occured with sign-to-voice, it's also occured with voice-to-sign. When I was with Barry in Boystown (the gay area of Chicago), we met one of my Hearing Gay friends. When Barry would sign, I would voice, but as soon as I started voicing, my friend would look at me. "What are you trying to read my lips?" "No, but you're talking, so I should make eye contact." "No, I'm not talking to you. Barry's talking to you." "Oh, ok," but as soon as I resumed voicing, my friend looked at me out of reflex. I guess Hearing people have a habit of turing their attention to something they hear. Also, because Barry is DeafBlind, when my friend voiced, I couldn't stand behind him, to interpret. I had to stand close to Barry, so he found it hard to speak, since he saw that annoying echo, when I was signing. Luckily, we found a situation with better lighting, and I was able to stand behind him and interpret.
When I was with a different DeafBlind friend of mine, David and a Hard-of-Hearing friend of mine, Stuart, we went to Berlin night club in Boystown. One drunkard came up and asked what we thought of the change in music at Berlin. I was about to butt in, but I decided that it's better to let my friends answer for themselves. When my friends responded that they couldn't even really hear the music in the first place, the idiot responded with, "Well can't you feel the vibrations?" David turned to me and signed, "Need help?" I told him to keep signing, and the drunkard just kept watching. He finally said, "Ok, I'm gonna' go. I just wanted to say goodbye." Yech! I was really glad to know sign, so I wouldn't have to talk to him. I decided that if any other troll was going to come up to us, I was just gonna' sign to my friends and not pay attention to the voice. Sufice'd to say, I didn't have any more problems that night.
Well, no, that's a lie. David isn't totally Blind. He has Usher Syndrome, so he has difficulty seeing in the dark. The lighting got worse, as more people came in. When David wanted to signed something, I didn't understand, I asked him to speak it, but he has a speech impediment and the loud music didn't help either. I felt bad, as most of our conversation was either him or me saying, "What?"
I'm not a slave to my Deaf friends, though. When Barry and I were walking through boystown, he asked me to describe things to him, in sign, which he couldn't see. He asked, "What's this building?" when we walked in front of Steamworks. "Oh, this is the bath house." "OH REALLY! TAKE ME! INTERPRET FOR ME!" I decided that would not work, so I signed, "Ok, first, you don't need me to interpret, because no one really talks anyway, and second, I'm not going in there now."
Southern, sweetie, when I'm with my Deaf/Hard-of-Hearing/Oral Deaf/Latened Deafened/DeafBlind friends, I always intepret everything, a lot of times, to the distain of the Hearing people, "No! Don't don't interpret that!"
I remember, one of my DeafBlind then-friends, Barry, was at the house of my HearingBlind friend, Nader. To make things worse, Nader is a Muslim, and Barry is a Jew. Nader has one Hard-of-Hearing roommate, Kirk, and one Oral Deaf roommate, John. Nader has lost a lot of his sense of touch, so Deaf people can't really fingerspell into his hands. They must speak. Barry is not totally Blind. He's Low-Vision, so he can see signs of White hands against a black shirt. (If the interpreter is Black, then he can see the signs against an off-white shirt.) He can speak well, but Nader had some problems understanding his speech. Nader tried to fingerspell to Barry, but Nader was wearing a white shirt, so I interpreted. Anyway, Nader is Straight, but Barry is Gay and had no problem talking about his sexuality. Nader's mom, Linda, talked about how it's a sin, then when she saw me signing, she exclaimed "No! Don't don't interpret that!" Barry went on to say something to the effect of how Homosexualily is normal and Heterosexuality is abnormal. Nader had just about had it up to here, but after a while, Nader's whole family stopped seeing me as part of the conversation and more of a conduit of the conversation. They realized that if they didn't want Barry to respond to something, they shouldn't ask me not to interpret it. They just shouldn't say it, just like if they were talking to anyone else.
IMHO, in any situation, I try to interpret as much as possible and leave the fact that I am interpreting as a medium of the conversation.
Another example occured, when I was at a LGBT (Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transexual) get-together. There was a Hearing woman, who only knew how to fingerspell, and I thought it was rude to leave her out of the conversation, so I interpreted for her, however, some of the Hearing people who were signing, found this distracting, because they found it very strange to hear someone else's interpretation of what they were signing. In a way, it sounded like an annoying echo. I solved this by scooting next to her more closely and whispering my interpretation in her ear. She also found it much more enjoyable, because when she wanted to add her comments, all she had to do was talk, and I would interpret for her. It was just like as if she was talking to anybody else.
This annoying echo hasn't only occured with sign-to-voice, it's also occured with voice-to-sign. When I was with Barry in Boystown (the gay area of Chicago), we met one of my Hearing Gay friends. When Barry would sign, I would voice, but as soon as I started voicing, my friend would look at me. "What are you trying to read my lips?" "No, but you're talking, so I should make eye contact." "No, I'm not talking to you. Barry's talking to you." "Oh, ok," but as soon as I resumed voicing, my friend looked at me out of reflex. I guess Hearing people have a habit of turing their attention to something they hear. Also, because Barry is DeafBlind, when my friend voiced, I couldn't stand behind him, to interpret. I had to stand close to Barry, so he found it hard to speak, since he saw that annoying echo, when I was signing. Luckily, we found a situation with better lighting, and I was able to stand behind him and interpret.
When I was with a different DeafBlind friend of mine, David and a Hard-of-Hearing friend of mine, Stuart, we went to Berlin night club in Boystown. One drunkard came up and asked what we thought of the change in music at Berlin. I was about to butt in, but I decided that it's better to let my friends answer for themselves. When my friends responded that they couldn't even really hear the music in the first place, the idiot responded with, "Well can't you feel the vibrations?" David turned to me and signed, "Need help?" I told him to keep signing, and the drunkard just kept watching. He finally said, "Ok, I'm gonna' go. I just wanted to say goodbye." Yech! I was really glad to know sign, so I wouldn't have to talk to him. I decided that if any other troll was going to come up to us, I was just gonna' sign to my friends and not pay attention to the voice. Sufice'd to say, I didn't have any more problems that night.
Well, no, that's a lie. David isn't totally Blind. He has Usher Syndrome, so he has difficulty seeing in the dark. The lighting got worse, as more people came in. When David wanted to signed something, I didn't understand, I asked him to speak it, but he has a speech impediment and the loud music didn't help either. I felt bad, as most of our conversation was either him or me saying, "What?"I'm not a slave to my Deaf friends, though. When Barry and I were walking through boystown, he asked me to describe things to him, in sign, which he couldn't see. He asked, "What's this building?" when we walked in front of Steamworks. "Oh, this is the bath house." "OH REALLY! TAKE ME! INTERPRET FOR ME!" I decided that would not work, so I signed, "Ok, first, you don't need me to interpret, because no one really talks anyway, and second, I'm not going in there now."
Southern, "off colored" also can mean racist or bigoted, not just sexual. It was reasonable to assume it could have been something Deaf related. You say it wasn't so okay.
As for the modified analogy.. it still depends on the context- the location of the persons involved. If everybody had been hearing & the "slandered one" would have directly heard or very likely overheard the comment, then that still falls under 'haha I can say anything in front of the deafie, haha' and deserved to be called on their sh@t. This seemed to be the likely sceneario as in your originial analogy you had the "slandered" hearing person OUT of the room.. which left the impression your deaf friend most likely was in the same room and possibly mere feet away from each other.
As for being friends with a deaf person & being am ASL student etc.. you'd be surprised at how many of those same persons are or can be rude/disrespectful to their Deaf friend or towards deaf persons in general. Just because you 'carry the card' doesn't *automatically* mean you're a perfect gentleman with your deaf friend. I/we don't know you and please note I did quote a specific part and say I was concerned as it was ambigious. Now you say you would never do that to your friend, and I will believe you.
As for the modified analogy.. it still depends on the context- the location of the persons involved. If everybody had been hearing & the "slandered one" would have directly heard or very likely overheard the comment, then that still falls under 'haha I can say anything in front of the deafie, haha' and deserved to be called on their sh@t. This seemed to be the likely sceneario as in your originial analogy you had the "slandered" hearing person OUT of the room.. which left the impression your deaf friend most likely was in the same room and possibly mere feet away from each other.
As for being friends with a deaf person & being am ASL student etc.. you'd be surprised at how many of those same persons are or can be rude/disrespectful to their Deaf friend or towards deaf persons in general. Just because you 'carry the card' doesn't *automatically* mean you're a perfect gentleman with your deaf friend. I/we don't know you and please note I did quote a specific part and say I was concerned as it was ambigious. Now you say you would never do that to your friend, and I will believe you.
Great story! And I love you already..
But seriously.. that was perfect: "They just shouldn't say it, just like if they were talking to anyone else."Okay let mt put it like this. Not slander. I tried to keep it clean but fine for the sake of clarity. I have a hearing friend who makes off colored sexual remarks all the time. He has said wow you sure have some nice tits to a female friend or wow I bet your pu**y tastes great. If my female friend didn't catch that I wouldnt repeat it both hearing in this situation. Hehas also asked me to show him how good I can arch my back. But in that little game I always shut him up. Lol The friend I speak of can take things a bit too far but he is a good guy. I treat all my friends equally as possible. As I said before if it was in direct convo then yes no matter what is said I would interpret it. Back ground noise is what I am talking about. Also my deaf friends have told me they don't need everything told to them. And I have stoped and said oh that person said..... To which I get, "um okay" with the I don't care look on their face. It is a party for heavens sake or social gathering. They know my skill level but they don't walk around explaining every conversation to me at Deaf events. If there are 100 people how could anyone. Also I do say things. Like once we were at a store and signing and a woman said oh I bet they are talking about us. With out even looking at her I said, "honey you are not that important" she didn't like that.
Also hearing people say things knowing the other hearing cannot hear what is said. Not with the hahaha you are 20 feet away from me can't hear me attitude. But if I give my hearing friends the courtusy of not repeating every single thing that goes in my ears why should I treat my Deaf friends completely different.
Also I have hung out with some Deaf and there were other hearing around who knew sign. One girl has been taking classes for nearly 4 years. Well suddenly the deaf began signing a lot of slang (so I am told) and they were going extremely fast. I said to the hearing friend whose skill is beyond mine, wow I can't understand any of this. She said neither can I. She asked a deaf friend who was laughing along with them what was being said so here it is. "Aw poor hearing running so fast trying to catch us 'what did you say?' run faster look drool coming out run faster. No we deaf are too fast poor hearing you can't catch us" well the hearing girl was offended. She felt they were making fun of us in front of us knowing they were to fast for us to pick up what was said. I took it as them just picking as friends do. She said she was hurt and then people start crying cause they didn't mean it hurtfully. Just like when I signed "run" wrong every one, all deaf, died laughing and repeated it over and over cause it looked like the sign for "diarrea" LMAO. Yeah I felt like a fool but if you can't laugh at yourself good lord. If I misprounce a word my hearing friends pick on me for that.
Also hearing people say things knowing the other hearing cannot hear what is said. Not with the hahaha you are 20 feet away from me can't hear me attitude. But if I give my hearing friends the courtusy of not repeating every single thing that goes in my ears why should I treat my Deaf friends completely different.
Also I have hung out with some Deaf and there were other hearing around who knew sign. One girl has been taking classes for nearly 4 years. Well suddenly the deaf began signing a lot of slang (so I am told) and they were going extremely fast. I said to the hearing friend whose skill is beyond mine, wow I can't understand any of this. She said neither can I. She asked a deaf friend who was laughing along with them what was being said so here it is. "Aw poor hearing running so fast trying to catch us 'what did you say?' run faster look drool coming out run faster. No we deaf are too fast poor hearing you can't catch us" well the hearing girl was offended. She felt they were making fun of us in front of us knowing they were to fast for us to pick up what was said. I took it as them just picking as friends do. She said she was hurt and then people start crying cause they didn't mean it hurtfully. Just like when I signed "run" wrong every one, all deaf, died laughing and repeated it over and over cause it looked like the sign for "diarrea" LMAO. Yeah I felt like a fool but if you can't laugh at yourself good lord. If I misprounce a word my hearing friends pick on me for that.
And yes carthartes you are so right about hearing who sign being jerks. Met a guy who is taking ASL classes to get a deaf boyfriend but has no Deaf friends. He has never had a boyfriend well my anger about him is in another thread. He is learning for the wrong reasons you are right there are some. I am not one though.
Etoile
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Whoa! Okay, here's my response. If it is not part of the conversation you are having, I wouldn't worry about it. However, if you hear it in the background and then you have a shocked or embarrassed look on your face, like you are surprised...then you should explain to the deaf person what you are so surprised about because they will probably be wondering!
H
HoHGuyOhio
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One time, back when I was a student, I went home to visit my family in my little home town in Missouri. My mom was excited, because she used to run into a deaf guy at Hardee's (which had become a local senior citizen hangout). She called me from Hardee's to tell me he was there and asked me to come and talk to him. So I drove up to Hardee's and talked to this deaf guy...the only deaf guy in my home town. He went on and on about how depressed he was about his divorce and how his relationship with his children had soured as a result. Then out of the blue he starts talking about my mom in a really disgusting and sexual manner (he wanted to taste her girly parts). I had been voicing the whole thing for my mom until that point, then I stopped and started signing heatedly to this guy. She was like, "What's he saying?" I think I made up something and then asked him to leave.
Oy vey.
Oy vey.
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Did the deaf guy know that she is your mom? He has to be out of his mind to talk about a lady like that in her presence whether she can understand him or not.
Okay.. here's the part that keeps confusing me, you say your friend makes lewd comments directly to people.. and then..?? Did he say something to him or to you right in front of your deaf friend?
As for background noise:
That was great!
No, you don't HAVE to tell the deaf person(s) everything what's being said by strangers, persons not involved nor in "your convo circle". It also depends on the context and the individuals.. some probably would like to know if someone within close hearing range were talking about them, others probably wouldn't want to know.yeah he will say something and depending on what is said some one will say something back or tell him to stop. He is kinda known for saying outragous things not just of a sexual nature. Like asking his manager if they have an 8 ball of coke. But this guy was not the one who made the comment infront of my Deaf friend. The situation for which i started the thread was a guy i didn't know but was a hearing friend of my Deaf friend. And he kinda said it in space, not to anyone in particular but i was just like, you could have kept that.
Shel, "don't get it twisted" is a saying like don't misconstrue. Not saying you twisted my words, just saying to not take what i said wrong. Don't get the situation wrong. As if you could hold the situation in your hand and twist it up an now it is different than what i had intended or the way it actually is.
Shel, "don't get it twisted" is a saying like don't misconstrue. Not saying you twisted my words, just saying to not take what i said wrong. Don't get the situation wrong. As if you could hold the situation in your hand and twist it up an now it is different than what i had intended or the way it actually is.
eh i am kind of good at detachment. i might look fine but am really mad. I act like i don't hear things a lot.
Taric25
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Ily2
I'm glad you enjoyed my story.
Oh, I love you too, darling.Great story! And I love you already..
I'm glad you enjoyed my story.