Wanted to vent!

[shel90]

My co worker was telling me about her friend who works in a public school (she is hearing) for a deaf program there and what had been happening over there. The deaf children who go to her program are signers and there are deaf who dont go to her program who have CIs or are HOH that dont know sign and are mainstreamed full time. The problem is that those "oral"-only kids' parents dont want their children to associate with the signers cuz they are not good role models for spoken language. I was like WTF? Those children are being rejected by these parents simply because they were unable to develop spoken language??? I wonder if that is happening all over? That many parents prefer their deaf or hoh children to associate with others that can speak well or those that are hearing? Isnt that discrimination against those children who rely on ASL? What the hell is going on here? This is so wrong and I just wanted to vent!!!

It was mentioned that those parents dont want any deaf teachers who dont have good speech skills teaching their kids. Again, is that discrimination?

Why do people do this? Why the obsession with deaf kids developing perfect speech skills or deaf kids having to be around hearing peers instead of other deaf peers? What kinds of morals are being taught to those children?

I just had to vent cuz it is very wrong!

 

[Keanusmom]

As a parent who has made a few bad choices in picking schools/programs for my son, let me say this: We only want what we think is going to help our kids function in OUR society.

When you find out your child is deaf, depending on where you live, you are told your options as if they are your only options. You are TOLD what is "best" for your child during the IEP meetings. You are TOLD how your child will benefit from this or that special program. What you are NOT told is that there is a Deaf SOCIETY. You are not introduced to life as a deaf child./person. So all you know to do is what you think will help your child in his future.

What those parents probably don't understand is that exposure to ASL will only benefit their children- whether they use it in their everyday lives or not. It will not hold them back from anything.

They are also exposing children (deaf or hearing) to discrimination early. I truly feel that if a public school is going to have programs for the deaf, then ASL should be a part of the school curriculum.

Upon finding out that your child is deaf you should be introduced to the society (not just an Early Intervention advocate) via mixers, meetings, field trips, whatever. That way a child sees himself as normal SOMEWHERE, ya know?

Pennsylvania (Philly) is one of the best systems I have experienced when it comes to integrating the deaf/hearing worlds. My son has been to school in PA, GA and Mississippi.

 

[JeepGirl]

As a parent who has made a few bad choices in picking schools/programs for my son, let me say this: We only want what we think is going to help our kids function in OUR society.

When you find out your child is deaf, depending on where you live, you are told your options as if they are your only options. You are TOLD what is "best" for your child during the IEP meetings. You are TOLD how your child will benefit from this or that special program. What you are NOT told is that there is a Deaf SOCIETY. You are not introduced to life as a deaf child./person. So all you know to do is what you think will help your child in his future.

What those parents probably don't understand is that exposure to ASL will only benefit their children- whether they use it in their everyday lives or not. It will not hold them back from anything.

They are also exposing children (deaf or hearing) to discrimination early. I truly feel that if a public school is going to have programs for the deaf, then ASL should be a part of the school curriculum.

Upon finding out that your child is deaf you should be introduced to the society (not just an Early Intervention advocate) via mixers, meetings, field trips, whatever. That way a child sees himself as normal SOMEWHERE, ya know?

Pennsylvania (Philly) is one of the best systems I have experienced when it comes to integrating the deaf/hearing worlds. My son has been to school in PA, GA and Mississippi.

I wondered if AllDeaf has helped you with alot of positive thoughts about the deaf communities? Has it given you comfort knowing that its okay to have your son learn sign language? I hope it has helped you with the right choices and leading you and your son to the bright future! I know maybe not only Alldeaf has helped but given you more comfort.

 

[JeepGirl]

My co worker was telling me about her friend who works in a public school (she is hearing) for a deaf program there and what had been happening over there. The deaf children who go to her program are signers and there are deaf who dont go to her program who have CIs or are HOH that dont know sign and are mainstreamed full time. The problem is that those "oral"-only kids' parents dont want their children to associate with the signers cuz they are not good role models for spoken language. I was like WTF? Those children are being rejected by these parents simply because they were unable to develop spoken language??? I wonder if that is happening all over? That many parents prefer their deaf or hoh children to associate with others that can speak well or those that are hearing? Isnt that discrimination against those children who rely on ASL? What the hell is going on here? This is so wrong and I just wanted to vent!!!

It was mentioned that those parents dont want any deaf teachers who dont have good speech skills teaching their kids. Again, is that discrimination?

Why do people do this? Why the obsession with deaf kids developing perfect speech skills or deaf kids having to be around hearing peers instead of other deaf peers? What kinds of morals are being taught to those children?

I just had to vent cuz it is very wrong!

good vent.

I know its so hard for the hearing parents to understand the reality of what the Deaf child is going thru. the truth is... hearing parents may have not been told good things about Deaf teachers, deaf program, deaf students, deaf schools, etc. The parents do feel threaten in some ways because they are not deaf and their child is and they don't know what to do. It is a hard choice when a parent has NEVER been around deaf people and not understanding how we interact.

i won't call it discrimination but i'd have to say its offensive really.

 

[shel90]

good vent.

I know its so hard for the hearing parents to understand the reality of what the Deaf child is going thru. the truth is... hearing parents may have not been told good things about Deaf teachers, deaf program, deaf students, deaf schools, etc. The parents do feel threaten in some ways because they are not deaf and their child is and they don't know what to do. It is a hard choice when a parent has NEVER been around deaf people and not understanding how we interact.

i won't call it discrimination but i'd have to say its offensive really.

What gets me is that there is a signing program there and some teachers who are deaf there. Do the parents have the right to say that they dont want teachers who are deaf teaching their children? I am wondering about that.


I can understand if that there is no deaf program or no deaf children around but this school has a large deaf program there so I was like when I learned of this issue that is going on there (I cant reveal the school and state as per my friend's request).

 

[shel90]

As a parent who has made a few bad choices in picking schools/programs for my son, let me say this: We only want what we think is going to help our kids function in OUR society.

When you find out your child is deaf, depending on where you live, you are told your options as if they are your only options. You are TOLD what is "best" for your child during the IEP meetings. You are TOLD how your child will benefit from this or that special program. What you are NOT told is that there is a Deaf SOCIETY. You are not introduced to life as a deaf child./person. So all you know to do is what you think will help your child in his future.

What those parents probably don't understand is that exposure to ASL will only benefit their children- whether they use it in their everyday lives or not. It will not hold them back from anything.

They are also exposing children (deaf or hearing) to discrimination early. I truly feel that if a public school is going to have programs for the deaf, then ASL should be a part of the school curriculum.

Upon finding out that your child is deaf you should be introduced to the society (not just an Early Intervention advocate) via mixers, meetings, field trips, whatever. That way a child sees himself as normal SOMEWHERE, ya know?

Pennsylvania (Philly) is one of the best systems I have experienced when it comes to integrating the deaf/hearing worlds. My son has been to school in PA, GA and Mississippi.

Thanks for your input. My mom was basically told the same thing which is why she put my brother and I in oral-only programs only to end up having to send my brother to the Deaf school due to his inablilty to pick up on spoken language. I stayed and never learned ASL until I was in my late 20s. That is one huge regret in my life, not learning it growing up but the specialists told my mom that I was too smart for it and that I didnt need it. Now, look at where I am...I use ASL 90% of the time now. Go figure.

I think that school has a great deaf awareness program...just the parents of the children who are "oral" seem very resistant to having their children interact with the deaf signers. I think that is very very awful.

 

[jillio]

As a parent who has made a few bad choices in picking schools/programs for my son, let me say this: We only want what we think is going to help our kids function in OUR society.

When you find out your child is deaf, depending on where you live, you are told your options as if they are your only options. You are TOLD what is "best" for your child during the IEP meetings. You are TOLD how your child will benefit from this or that special program. What you are NOT told is that there is a Deaf SOCIETY. You are not introduced to life as a deaf child./person. So all you know to do is what you think will help your child in his future.

What those parents probably don't understand is that exposure to ASL will only benefit their children- whether they use it in their everyday lives or not. It will not hold them back from anything.

They are also exposing children (deaf or hearing) to discrimination early. I truly feel that if a public school is going to have programs for the deaf, then ASL should be a part of the school curriculum.

Upon finding out that your child is deaf you should be introduced to the society (not just an Early Intervention advocate) via mixers, meetings, field trips, whatever. That way a child sees himself as normal SOMEWHERE, ya know?

Pennsylvania (Philly) is one of the best systems I have experienced when it comes to integrating the deaf/hearing worlds. My son has been to school in PA, GA and Mississippi.

I agree with you 100%. And parents also need to learn that simply because an administrator sitting in an IEP meeting says, "This is best for your child." doesn't mean that the parent has to accept it. After having been told by early intervention advocates that I was not to use sign with my som because it would interfer with his oral skills, I ended up with a very, very frustrated deaf toddler. A few weeks of that, and it finally dawned on me that what was important was not HOW he communicated but that he COULD communicate. My next stop was the League for the Deaf and HOH, where he and I both began our journey into Deaf culture and ASL. Best thing I ever did.

And there were many IEP meetings where I was pressured to signan IEP that I was in disagreement with. I simply smiled, and stated that I would not be signing, and would see everyone in due process.

 

[jillio]

Thanks for your input. My mom was basically told the same thing which is why she put my brother and I in oral-only programs only to end up having to send my brother to the Deaf school due to his inablilty to pick up on spoken language. I stayed and never learned ASL until I was in my late 20s. That is one huge regret in my life, not learning it growing up but the specialists told my mom that I was too smart for it and that I didnt need it. Now, look at where I am...I use ASL 90% of the time now. Go figure.

I think that school has a great deaf awareness program...just the parents of the children who are "oral" seem very resistant to having their children interact with the deaf signers. I think that is very very awful.

I guess they are afraid that ASL is contagious! Either that, or they realize that there is an inclination of all deaf children to gravitate toward other deaf children, and it scares the hell out of them. Sad thing is, their attitudes rub off on their children, and they end up raising intolerant bigots.

 

[shel90]

I guess they are afraid that ASL is contagious! Either that, or they realize that there is an inclination of all deaf children to gravitate toward other deaf children, and it scares the hell out of them. Sad thing is, their attitudes rub off on their children, and they end up raising intolerant bigots.

And dont you think that is the root of the problem where Deaf people snub deaf people cuz they were snubbed by them as children?

I snubbed many of my brother's friends because they couldnt talk using spoken language but when I wanted to get involved in their community and learn ASL a decade or so later, they snubbed me.

I see many ADers here complaining about being snubbed by the Deaf community or say that Deaf people are closed minded. Well, I wonder if it started out with the parents teaching their children these kinds of morals?

Recently another AD member stated that his daughter wouldnt have anything in common with a deaf person who cannot hear so I am starting to believe the whole discrimination issues "Deafism" and so on really starts when the children are little. No wonder many Deaf adults who have been discriminated by oral deaf people growing up have this attitude as adults. It just only feeds the hatred and anger and these parents who are teaching those kinds of morals dont realize they are the ones who started the fire to this kind of hatred.

 

[Cheri]

Great vent there, Shel....

How come this doesn't even surprised me, because It doesn't.

You know, What hasn't changed is the reaction of parents when they are first informed that their child is deaf and professionals that works with the cochlear implant children and their parents also hasn't changed, the ones that believes that sign language is not even in necessary.

Hearing parents are so focused fulfilling on hearing and speech for their deaf child, and I for one shouldn't be surprised by this attitude of their discriminated against others who are not the same as their child.

Those who signs or does not depends on speech or does not have any residual hearing does not make anyone less a human being.

Whatever happened to treat people the way you want to be treated? It's always about them hearing parents their wants, their needs, their importance. It's a shame.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

First of all, good venting Shel90

I know how you feeling....

Yes, I know the parents often make mistake decision when they thought best for their children, that's because they LISTEN professional/Experts advices over real life experiences. That's problem... I often advised the parents to open their mind on BOTH sides.

Unfortunlately yes, I have to give you right, Keanusmom ...

Shel90, I don't think it's discrimination that's because the parents beleives professional/Experts's advice and thought best for their children. I think we should blame professional/Experts for negative/deny the parents over sign languages. The problem is their lack of knowledge over real life situation.

I hate to say "Yes" but I have to... Yes, the parents have the right to say No to deaf teachers for teach their children... Yes, they have the right to reject it... and They will look for another school if their protest are being ignored. I know it sound sucker... It's really sad that the parents did not know much about real life experiences but depend on Expert's advices...

 

[Liebling:-)))]

And dont you think that is the root of the problem where Deaf people snub deaf people cuz they were snubbed by them as children?

I snubbed many of my brother's friends because they couldnt talk using spoken language but when I wanted to get involved in their community and learn ASL a decade or so later, they snubbed me.

I see many ADers here complaining about being snubbed by the Deaf community or say that Deaf people are closed minded. Well, I wonder if it started out with the parents teaching their children these kinds of morals?

Recently another AD member stated that his daughter wouldnt have anything in common with a deaf person who cannot hear so I am starting to believe the whole discrimination issues "Deafism" and so on really starts when the children are little. No wonder many Deaf adults who have been discriminated by oral deaf people growing up have this attitude as adults. It just only feeds the hatred and anger and these parents who are teaching those kinds of morals dont realize they are the ones who started the fire to this kind of hatred.

Yes, I have no idea over the difference between deaf and Deaf until I learn from American forum... We never thought about the difference but just deaf...

I am sorry how and what you are being treat by Deaf people.

 

[Cheri]

Yes, I know the parents often make mistake decision when they thought best for their children, that's because they LISTEN professional/Experts advices over real life experiences. That's problem... I often advised the parents to open their mind on BOTH sides.

(nods sadly) It seems even so not a lot of hearing parents given up their time to really follow our advices that are given to them. At least we tried and done our best as we know how.

 

[GalaxyAngel]

shel, quite nice your venting..
I understandable...
I've been there when I was young and went mainstreamed school and raised oral class and no signing... Really hits me frustrater awful lot and lack of communication lead into misunderstanding. My parent were gave up and made their decision send me another school which it's signers at Deaf School. I've picked pieces of sign languages.

My parent were hoping that I can speak good and have good future but isn't cure! Reason I did spoke out my rights. I know my parent really want best interest for me future and always parent think everything WANTS FOR BEST A CHILD..

I've been seen so many Hearing Parents are selfish and want best interest for their child's future and not allowed use signers or associating with Deaf Students.

As long I'm not worry, Let Parent will realized themselves and not work for their child needs meets.

 

[jillio]

(nods sadly) It seems even so not a lot of hearing parents given up their time to really follow our advices that are given to them. At least we tried and done our best as we know how.

I thinkthat happens so much because when a hearing parent looks at their deaf child, the first thing they see is an inability to hear. The professsionals, as well, look only at that inability to hear and what can be done to fix it medically. If it were not so, then all CI centers would be doing more to insure that both parents and children have follow up services that addesses that child's development from all aspects. But it seems to me that they put a CI on a kid, and then say, "Well, I've done my part. See you later!"

No follow up counseling, no peer mentoring, no discussions of educational issues, no direction toward the psychological, emotional, social development of that child. All the focus is on hearing, and speaking. That is what my problem is with the way CI implantation is handled. We are taking a step backward. The Ci is a great tool, and it does provide sound perception for any number of individuals. But you cannot ignore the fact that sound perception or not, adequate speech skills or not, that is not all there is to a child.

 

[SxyPorkie]

And dont you think that is the root of the problem where Deaf people snub deaf people cuz they were snubbed by them as children?

I snubbed many of my brother's friends because they couldnt talk using spoken language but when I wanted to get involved in their community and learn ASL a decade or so later, they snubbed me.

I see many ADers here complaining about being snubbed by the Deaf community or say that Deaf people are closed minded. Well, I wonder if it started out with the parents teaching their children these kinds of morals?

Recently another AD member stated that his daughter wouldnt have anything in common with a deaf person who cannot hear so I am starting to believe the whole discrimination issues "Deafism" and so on really starts when the children are little. No wonder many Deaf adults who have been discriminated by oral deaf people growing up have this attitude as adults. It just only feeds the hatred and anger and these parents who are teaching those kinds of morals dont realize they are the ones who started the fire to this kind of hatred.

Good Point... I can understand your vents...

 

[Angel]

I thinkthat happens so much because when a hearing parent looks at their deaf child, the first thing they see is an inability to hear. The professsionals, as well, look only at that inability to hear and what can be done to fix it medically. If it were not so, then all CI centers would be doing more to insure that both parents and children have follow up services that addesses that child's development from all aspects. But it seems to me that they put a CI on a kid, and then say, "Well, I've done my part. See you later!"

No follow up counseling, no peer mentoring, no discussions of educational issues, no direction toward the psychological, emotional, social development of that child. All the focus is on hearing, and speaking. That is what my problem is with the way CI implantation is handled. We are taking a step backward. The Ci is a great tool, and it does provide sound perception for any number of individuals. But you cannot ignore the fact that sound perception or not, adequate speech skills or not, that is not all there is to a child.

So true, that what it seems like to me....Good post there Jillioie....


btw, Great vent Shel90, I know how you feel...

 

[Liza]

Dang, some parents could use some spine in some situations regarding their kids, and this is definitely one of them.

 

[Maria]

My co worker was telling me about her friend who works in a public school (she is hearing) for a deaf program there and what had been happening over there. The deaf children who go to her program are signers and there are deaf who dont go to her program who have CIs or are HOH that dont know sign and are mainstreamed full time. The problem is that those "oral"-only kids' parents dont want their children to associate with the signers cuz they are not good role models for spoken language. I was like WTF? Those children are being rejected by these parents simply because they were unable to develop spoken language??? I wonder if that is happening all over? That many parents prefer their deaf or hoh children to associate with others that can speak well or those that are hearing? Isnt that discrimination against those children who rely on ASL? What the hell is going on here? This is so wrong and I just wanted to vent!!!

It was mentioned that those parents dont want any deaf teachers who dont have good speech skills teaching their kids. Again, is that discrimination?

Why do people do this? Why the obsession with deaf kids developing perfect speech skills or deaf kids having to be around hearing peers instead of other deaf peers? What kinds of morals are being taught to those children?

I just had to vent cuz it is very wrong!

I would feel the same way as you feel. I hate to see this to happen. I feel for the deaf children with ASL rather than the children with CI ( oral ), because I can see that the deaf children with ASL are more innocent and hurt. I don't think that the hearin' parents have the rights to separate their CI kids from other " deaf " children who don't learn how to talk ( without CI ). All parents ( hearin' and deaf ) should encourage BOTH CI and deaf children to associate.

Look at this earth... all the trees accept the soil and the soil accept the trees in despite of their difference. Same goes with grass and flowers and so forth. That's what make the earth to look beautiful and natural. There's no ill-effected or do anythin' wrong to cause problem.

It's the parents who caused the problem and they are the ones who should go to counselin' because, it will cause some serious problem w/ " bully " later on when CI kids grow up.

 

[jillio]

And dont you think that is the root of the problem where Deaf people snub deaf people cuz they were snubbed by them as children?

I snubbed many of my brother's friends because they couldnt talk using spoken language but when I wanted to get involved in their community and learn ASL a decade or so later, they snubbed me.

I see many ADers here complaining about being snubbed by the Deaf community or say that Deaf people are closed minded. Well, I wonder if it started out with the parents teaching their children these kinds of morals?

Recently another AD member stated that his daughter wouldnt have anything in common with a deaf person who cannot hear so I am starting to believe the whole discrimination issues "Deafism" and so on really starts when the children are little. No wonder many Deaf adults who have been discriminated by oral deaf people growing up have this attitude as adults. It just only feeds the hatred and anger and these parents who are teaching those kinds of morals dont realize they are the ones who started the fire to this kind of hatred.

Exactly.