North Tower Exploding on 9-11

[jillio]

I don't spend much time any more on it either. I have friends who do, and it is sad to see them become obsessed with it. Just saying. It is starting to look like a bloody bad idea starting this thread.

Only when you attempt to discuss things with ostriches and tea baggers.

 

[Reba]

And that is not because the Muslims are inept. It is because they do not have the sophisticated resources available to them that are available in the U.S.

What sophisticated resources did they need that they couldn't get?

Since the hijackers were already in the USA, all the resources were available to them.

The Muslim hijackers got their flight training in the USA.

They bought their sophisticated box cutters here.

What else were they lacking?

 

[jillio]

"Since they were already in the USA" is all that needs to be said to support what I stated.

You have answered your own questions.

 

[Reba]

"Since they were already in the USA" is all that needs to be said to support what I stated.

You have answered your own questions.

Then you agree that Muslim extremists did have access to everything they needed to carry out the 9/11 hijackings and killings.

 

[Reba]

And that is not because the Muslims are inept. It is because they do not have the sophisticated resources available to them that are available in the U.S.

So how is they carry out terrorist attacks around the globe?

Not every attack requires sophistication.

 

[Jiro]

So how is they carry out terrorist attacks around the globe?

Not every attack requires sophistication.

exactly. this one was too sophisticated, well-funded, and well-orchestrated. Definitely can't be done by extremists. This reeks of government's backing. what government? I do not know. It only takes a few high-ranking officials to pull this.

 

[saywhatkid]

With all the obvious planning used, I find it interesting that there are people that doubt the abilities of Al-qaeda. This is all they do. It is their career. They train for years. They have financial assistance. They have their religion telling them they will be martyred for giving their lives. They blow themselves up in marketplaces or in vehicles. I am stunned at anyone that thinks this was a product of government. Stunned.

 

[Jiro]

With all the obvious planning used, I find it interesting that there are people that doubt the abilities of Al-qaeda. This is all they do. It is their career. They train for years. They have financial assistance. They have their religion telling them they will be martyred for giving their lives. They blow themselves up in marketplaces or in vehicles. I am stunned at anyone that thinks this was a product of government. Stunned.

just because they have money doesn't mean they can simply do it. It takes deep connection and expertise to pull it off.

Suicide Bomber doesn't take much resource to pull it off. Just pay for martyr's family and bomb... and then tell him to go to Location A and detonate. that's it. 9/11? definitely not what an ordinary terrorist can do. I didn't say this was a product of government. Just government's backing. It only takes a couple of rogue high-ranking government officials to pull it off.

flight schedules. immigration/passport paperwork. commercial flight training. communication & coordination. massive funds and moving funds around (not easy).

All above.... and the CIA, FBI, Interpol, etc. didn't catch a hint of it? bullshit.

 

[jillio]

Then you agree that Muslim extremists did have access to everything they needed to carry out the 9/11 hijackings and killings.

Where exactly did I say that?

 

[jillio]

So how is they carry out terrorist attacks around the globe?

Not every attack requires sophistication.

Where did anyone say anything about "every attack"? We are discussing one attack in particular. Each needs to be looked at individually.

 

[jillio]

Then you agree that Muslim extremists did have access to everything they needed to carry out the 9/11 hijackings and killings.

So, you assume that guilt in one instance is proof of guilt in all instances?

 

[Reba]

just because they have money doesn't mean they can simply do it. It takes deep connection and expertise to pull it off.

What makes you think they don't have deep connections and expertise, in addition to money? (Don't forget, money can buy lots of expertise and connections, too.)

...flight schedules. immigration/passport paperwork. commercial flight training. communication & coordination. massive funds and moving funds around (not easy).

Prior to 9/11, getting passport and immigration documents didn't require sophistication. Even now, our borders leak like a sieve.

Many potential terrorists can easily show up on student visas.

Moving funds around is no big deal (anyone from Jersey should know that, heh, heh).

Prior to 9/11, no one thought twice about the flight training. It wasn't restricted, and didn't require sneaking into.

Side note:

Prior to the revolution in Iran, we trained their fighter pilots on our Navy bases in America, and their military officers in our upper level training facilities. Obviously they didn't "forget" all that training when the Shah was given the boot.

It's not that hard for terrorists to find trainers. For the right price, you can find rogue experts in anything.

All above.... and the CIA, FBI, Interpol, etc. didn't catch a hint of it? bullshit.

They DID catch hints of the planning; they just didn't put it together and disseminate it properly.

 

[Reba]

So, you assume that guilt in one instance is proof of guilt in all instances?

Who's talking about "guilt?" You brought up resources. They did have the resources available.

 

[Reba]

Where exactly did I say that?

#80 and 82

 

[jillio]

Who's talking about "guilt?" You brought up resources. They did have the resources available.

Yep. US resources. And different attacks, different resources. You keep bringing up other attacks.

 

[jillio]

#80 and 82

Nope, just re-read them. You are no doubt seeing something that is not there as you are injecting your own perspective into my posts.

 

[Reba]

Where did anyone say anything about "every attack"? We are discussing one attack in particular. Each needs to be looked at individually.

I said "not every attack". That means, sophistication is not an important element for every attack.

In the case of the 9/11 attack, the Muslim hijackers had everything they needed to carry out their plot.

 

[jillio]

I said "not every attack". That means, sophistication is not an important element for every attack.

In the case of the 9/11 attack, the Muslim hijackers had everything they needed to carry out their plot.

Yep. Including US resources.

 

[saywhatkid]

Just government's backing. It only takes a couple of rogue high-ranking government officials to pull it off.

flight schedules. immigration/passport paperwork. commercial flight training. communication & coordination. massive funds and moving funds around (not easy).

All above.... and the CIA, FBI, Interpol, etc. didn't catch a hint of it? bullshit.

A few rogue officials is a lot different from a government backing.

Flight schedules are pretty easy to find online. Commercial flight training may not have been needed for all of this. There is flight simulator software that can be pretty realistic, combined with a basic knowledge of piloting. Massive funds are not complicated to move either. That is how drug cartels work, along with Mafia-style gangs. This particular terrorist group is top of the line. They do their homework. They spent years planning and preparing. If some deputy in Iraq secured some insider info, it hardly indicts the Iraqi government.

 

[saywhatkid]

I said "not every attack". That means, sophistication is not an important element for every attack.

In the case of the 9/11 attack, the Muslim hijackers had everything they needed to carry out their plot.

Agreed. They prepared for years. It was not a bomb strapped to a chest. It was a massive and coordinated attack.