Was Jesus Gay?

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EyesBlueDeaf

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Right-Wing "Christians," Watch Your Back!
Was Jesus Gay?
By BRIAN J. FOLEY
http://www.counterpunch.org/foley05142005.html

Right-wing "Christians" hate gays. They denounce homosexuality as an "abomination." Many political analysts credit President Bush's reelection to the "Christians" who stampeded to the polls to vote against gay marriage.

Why the hate? Some mental health experts suggest that people who hate gays may be repressing their own homosexual tendencies. Indeed, we just saw the gay-bashing Republican mayor of Spokane go down, so to speak, in flames, after his same-sex sex was exposed.

Maybe these "values voters" are repressing something else. Could they harbor a fear that dare not speak its name, a fear that their "American Idol," Jesus, might have been gay?

Consider the evidence. Jesus never married. He was apparently dateless at the Cana wedding. He associated almost exclusively with men, bopping from town to town, incurring the wrath of religious elders.

The Bible doesn't detail any sexual encounters among these guys, but it does show Jesus telling them how much he "loved" them. He made his companions remove their sandals and washed their feet, drizzling warm water over their toes and rubbing them dry. They were cavorting in a park when police raided them and arrested Jesus; one of his friends had betrayed him with a "kiss."

Hanging out in parks with other men, kissing them, fondling their feet such behavior would not be tolerated in today's "mega churches." And just imagine the reaction to the robe and long hair, or the Palm Sunday parade!

Some Right-wing "Christians" might argue that the evidence is inconclusive, that the Bible wouldn't necessarily discuss someone's sexual orientation, especially if it were "normal." But what is normal? In our culture, people are assumed to be heterosexual unless they or someone else claims otherwise. Jesus' world was different, and perhaps more complicated. Jesus was a Jew, and Jews condemned homosexual acts. But Jesus lived under Roman occupation, and the pervasive Greco-Roman culture gave a green light to gay love. Et tu, Brute?

There's no proof that Jesus was heterosexual, either. He never claimed to be. He never denounced homosexuals. There is no Biblical evidence that Jesus ever had sex with anybody, though in his times, celibacy was considered abnormal. Sex is a natural human drive, so it's a good bet that the Son of Man got some. Since he hung out with twelve foot-washing, love-talking, kissing male companions, it's a good bet that it was among them he satisfied his urges (though we can't rule out, of course, that he was bisexual).

Try as they might, Right-wing "Christians" can't prove that Jesus wasn't queer. You can't prove a negative * a principle that should be familiar to many religious people who believe in God in part because God's existence can't be disproved. Religious people everywhere have relied on this basic fact of logic for millennia.

Even if God exists, who can prove any particulars about him, her, or it? Don't reach too fast for that Bible: the Good Book is just a document that claims to be true. The National Enquirer and The New York Times also claim to be true -- and many Right-wing "Christians" don't believe those. The Bible is even less reliable than those sources; its stories were written hundreds of years after the fact, by people who weren't eyewitnesses, and who relied on hearsay.

And those stories are often ridiculous, n'est-ce pas? A guy gets eaten by a whale, and survives in its gut for three days, until he's vomited to safety. A man is crucified and dies, yet rises. A young woman gets pregnant without having sex.

More to the point: No one can prove that God, if he, she, or it even exists, hates homosexuals. The opposite may well be true. According to the stereotype, gays have more sex partners, and more and better sex, than heterosexuals. They have more creative jobs, better decorated homes, and more disposable income -- especially where they can't adopt kids. By the standards of many Right-wing "Christians," gays are "blessed."

The only thing it seems can be trusted is Jesus' main commandment. To follow it requires no belief in the supernatural, just faith that the words were repeated and translated with reasonable accuracy. Indeed, one can follow it without even believing Jesus existed.

"Love one another." That includes loving homosexuals * which might include Jesus Christ himself. A Gay Jesus: What a wonderful way for God to test his followers' faith!

Most Right-wing "Christians," I bet, would rather be puked up by a whale.

Brian J. Foley can be reached at brian_j_foley@yahoo.com
 
Does John 21:20 Show That Jesus Was Gay?
James Patrick Holding

http://www.tektonics.org/gk/gayjesus.html
----------------------------------------------------


Then Peter, turning about, seeth the disciple whom Jesus loved following; which also leaned on his breast at supper, and said, Lord, which is he that betrayeth thee?

Though it has been a while since I last saw it (and I think it was from John Shelby Spong), this verse has been cited in the past as alleged proof that Jesus was homosexual. I imagine there are a few other verses used for this, and I know some folks like to claim David and Jonathan were gay lovers as well. One particular site admits there is no evidence of Jesus having a gay relationship, but uses this verse to say, "The incident makes clear that an emotional relationship existed between Jesus and the disciple closer than that which existed between him and any other, including Peter."

To put it bluntly, such arguments view intimate relationships through jaundiced Western eyes. Put your head on the breast of another man today here in America, and the jokes will fly. But in the ancient East, not so; and even today, such affectionate displays are typical on that side of the world, and well-publicized (remember all the news clips of Arab and Middle Eastern leaders kissing each other on the side of the face?), which is probably why we don't hear these sorts of verses brought up in service of homosexual Bible characters, except by the incredibly underinformed.

Abraham Rihbany (The Syrian Christ, 65), a native of the East early last century, bore with some patience the misinterpretations of modern Westerners (he named Robert Ingersoll particularly) who read the Bible through their eyes and tastes and missed certain points about what was being said and done. The particular instance of John 21:20 represents a custom "in perfect harmony with Syrian customs. How often have I seen men friends in such an attitude. There is not the slightest infringement of the rules of propriety; the act was as natural to us all as shaking hands. The practice is especially indulged in when intimate friends are about to part from one another, as on the eve of a journey, or when about the face a dangerous undertaking. Then they sit with their heads leaning against each other, or the one's head resting upon the other's shoulder or breast." By the same token, Easterners will use "terms of unbounded intimacy and unrestrained affection" to one another: "my soul," "my eyes," "my heart." Paul's holy kiss (Rom. 16:16, etc) is no more of a homosexual exchange.

Critics had best be sure they are not reading Eastern custom in Western terms when they make their arguments.
 
You beat me to it. :lol: I was going to start a thread with the exact same title last night, but I had something else to do and dropped it.
 
Levonian said:
You beat me to it. :lol: I was going to start a thread with the exact same title last night, but I had something else to do and dropped it.
LOL! Well, don't let that stop you.. Continue what you intend to do :) The more info we find, the better !
 
EyesBlueDeaf said:
LOL! Well, don't let that stop you.. Continue what you intend to do :) The more info we find, the better !

Well, what little info I could find from Googling around doesn’t amount to much. It seems that no serious theologian has ever proposed that Jesus was gay. The general consensus seems to be that since information about Jesus’ sexuality is completely lacking from biblical accounts, and there are no historical records concerning the matter, it’s just a non-issue. In other words, serious academic theologians and biblical historians simply say “we don’t know”.
 
Christians hating gays,mmmmm. I don't think so. SOME christians does and some gone to extreme. Key word SOME. Lord, have mercy, that's normal of human being taking advantage and misconceptions how they use the particular phrase and missing the point. How Jesus loves (AGAPE) them is the same love He has for us. If you aren't married, you are gay,, that's plumb jokes. Jesus loves, Mary magdalene, Mary and her sister Martha, and many other women. Jesus tempted just like us, but yet NOT HAVE SIN. Its normal just like the pharisees, finding fault of Jesus and still goes on today. Jesus died for ALL of our sins. Human theories is nothing but fallacy. Using the picture by those way later after Jesus was ascending. My faith stands. My faith in GOd rather than man.
 
If, you guys think that Jesus was gay, then He wouldn't have created Eve in the first place. In fact, He was NEVER gay to prove that He DID created Eve by takin' Adam's one rib out of his ribs. It shows that His Mind was NEVER thought or focus on just male.
 
No I dont think he was gay. He always share his love to everyone. both men and women, girls and boys, young and old, of all ages.
 
CyberRed said:
If, you guys think that Jesus was gay, then He wouldn't have created Eve in the first place. In fact, He was NEVER gay to prove that He DID created Eve by takin' Adam's one rib out of his ribs. It shows that His Mind was NEVER thought or focus on just male.
eh, come again?! Jesus made Adam and Eve - not GOD?? Jesus is not a GOD.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam_and_Eve
 
Jesus was NEVER gay. Jesus is so pure without any sins so he can be putting on the cross for our sins and saved us from death. If he does, then he won't be here to die for our sins then our lives are so worthless and nothing for hope!
 
EyesBlueDeaf said:
eh, come again?! Jesus made Adam and Eve - not GOD?? Jesus is not a GOD.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam_and_Eve
Jesus is not "a god"--Jesus is the God, and Jesus was the Creator of Adam and Eve.

Genesis 1:1
In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

John 1:1-3
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made

I John 1:1
That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life;

I believe the Bible, not Wikipedia.
 
EyesBlueDeaf said:
...Right-wing "Christians" hate gays.
Not true.


They denounce homosexuality as an "abomination."
True.


Many political analysts credit President Bush's reelection to the "Christians" who stampeded to the polls to vote against gay marriage.
That's not the reason why I voted for Bush.


Why the hate? Some mental health experts suggest that people who hate gays may be repressing their own homosexual tendencies.
Except Christians don't "hate gays".


Indeed, we just saw the gay-bashing Republican mayor of Spokane go down, so to speak, in flames, after his same-sex sex was exposed.
That's his problem.


Maybe these "values voters" are repressing something else. Could they harbor a fear that dare not speak its name, a fear that their "American Idol," Jesus, might have been gay?
Nonsense.


Consider the evidence. Jesus never married.
He died at age 33 years. He was still a young man. It was common back then for Jewish men to marry at a later age than they do now. Many of the Jewish patriarchs of the Bible married later in life. Do a little research.


He was apparently dateless at the Cana wedding.
Again, please do some cultural research. People didn't "date" in ancient Israel. That is a very modern Western cultural practice.


He associated almost exclusively with men, bopping from town to town, incurring the wrath of religious elders.
As an unmarried man, it would have been inappropriate for Jesus to travel with unrelated women. The religious elders weren't wrathful about Jesus travelling with men. They criticized Him for socializing with sinners.


The Bible doesn't detail any sexual encounters among these guys, but it does show Jesus telling them how much he "loved" them.
There weren't any "sexual encounters". Do you not know there are other kinds of "love", other than the physical? Don't parents love their children? Don't siblings love each other? "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life."

Why do you equate "love" with "lust"?


He made his companions remove their sandals and washed their feet, drizzling warm water over their toes and rubbing them dry.
Again, study the cultural history of that time and place. Washing someone's feet was NOT an erotic pasttime.


They were cavorting in a park when police raided them and arrested Jesus; one of his friends had betrayed him with a "kiss."
"Cavorting"?

John 18:1
When Jesus had spoken these words, he went forth with his disciples over the brook Cedron, where was a garden, into the which he entered, and his disciples.

Sigh...I'll say it again. Do some research about culture. Even today, you see Middle Eastern men greet each other with kisses. It has nothing to do with sex.


Some Right-wing "Christians" might argue that the evidence is inconclusive, that the Bible wouldn't necessarily discuss someone's sexual orientation, especially if it were "normal."
That's an odd thing to say. The Bible is very blunt about sexual relations, even ones that weren't "normal". Think about Lot and his daughters, or Absalom and Tamar.


But Jesus lived under Roman occupation, and the pervasive Greco-Roman culture gave a green light to gay love. Et tu, Brute?
The general Jewish population resented the Romans, and certainly didn't want to emulate any of their mores or behaviors. John the Baptist, Jesus' cousin and forerunner prophet, preached strongly against the illicit sexual behavior of the local leadership.

Matthew 14
3 For Herod had laid hold on John, and bound him, and put him in prison for Herodias' sake, his brother Philip's wife. 4 For John said unto him, It is not lawful for thee to have her.

Mark 6
17 For Herod himself had sent forth and laid hold upon John, and bound him in prison for Herodias' sake, his brother Philip's wife: for he had married her. 18 For John had said unto Herod, It is not lawful for thee to have thy brother's wife.


... There is no Biblical evidence that Jesus ever had sex with anybody...
Because He didn't have sex with anybody.


...though in his times, celibacy was considered abnormal.
Not among religious Jews.


Sex is a natural human drive, so it's a good bet that the Son of Man got some.
Sex is a natural human drive, and temptation is a fact. That doesn't mean every person gives in to every temptation. People are not animals.

Jesus was tempted with other human drives: hunger, thirst, ambition, power; but He resisted them all.

Matthew 4:1-11
1 Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil. 2 And when he had fasted forty days and forty nights, he was afterward an hungred. 3 And when the tempter came to him, he said, If thou be the Son of God, command that these stones be made bread. 4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God. 5 Then the devil taketh him up into the holy city, and setteth him on a pinnacle of the temple, 6 And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone. 7 Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God. 8 Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them; 9 And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me. 10 Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve. 11 Then the devil leaveth him, and, behold, angels came and ministered unto him.
 
At the end, Jesus always win. :applause:
 
Reba said:
He died at age 33 years. He was still a young man. It was common back then for Jewish men to marry at a later age than they do now. Many of the Jewish patriarchs of the Bible married later in life. Do a little research.

Reminds me of an old joke: how do we know that Jesus was Jewish? Because he stayed single until he was 35, went into his father’s business, and lived with a mother who thought he was God.
 
that is very wrong for you guys to start a thread...... thats very wrong
 
Why? Back up your assertions, even if they are just opinions. Why is it wrong to discuss whether or not Jesus was gay?
 
CyberRed said:
If, you guys think that Jesus was gay, then He wouldn't have created Eve in the first place. In fact, He was NEVER gay to prove that He DID created Eve by takin' Adam's one rib out of his ribs. It shows that His Mind was NEVER thought or focus on just male.
Jesus didn't make Adam and Eve. God did.
 
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