Clapping or Hands Flying?

Other people's perspective:

This entry was posted on Sunday, February 22nd, 2009 at 2:34 pm and is filed under EDUCATED!. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.
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34 Responses to “Clapping or Hands Flying?”

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enaid1434 Says:

yes True..Make me confused that why I don’t believe not like wave hand ..Loved claps are very best nbr #1.I agree with u 100 percent…
February 22nd, 2009 at 4:43 pm
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Ed Says:

Hey Jack…Yes… I remembered in 70’s in CSDB changed into Hands Flying and felt lost related to Hands Flying. I am 200% agree with you!!! Clapping and/or Fists give more spirt?
February 22nd, 2009 at 5:14 pm
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Jane Says:

I DID COMPLAINED ABOUT FLYING HANDS BECAUSE I DISAGREE VERY MUCH.
I AM SICK OF HEARING PEOPLE CONTROL DEAFIES.DEAFIES DO NOT CONTROL HEARING PEOPLE.
FLYING HANDS LOOKS LIKE RELIGION SINGING.
ANOTHER ONE LOOKS LIKE “FINISH”

I HOPE DEAFIES WILL SEE VLOG AND GO BACK TO CLAP HANDS.
LET DEAFIES WARN HEARING PEOPLE.
HOPE TO HEAR BETTER IN NEAR FUTURE ABOUT CHANGING BACK.

PS I SAW HEARING PEOPLE FLYING HANDS, I ASKED WHY THAT..SHE SAID JUST FOLLOW. I ASKED IF SHE IS IN SINGING RELIGION OR FINISH…SHE MUTED FAST AND AGREE WITH ME…SMILE.
February 22nd, 2009 at 5:30 pm
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Cynthia Roberson Says:

I absolutely agree with you!! Waving of the hands is a bit absurd..
February 22nd, 2009 at 5:38 pm
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Amy Cohen Efron Says:

Jack,

I am disappointed with your vlog. I challenge you to provide proof that AG Bell started this hand waving. I know you may not be able to provide that because it is a myth!

How did this hand applause/wave started in United States?

It started by Deaf people in France when Bummy Burnstein went there for the celebration of Laurent Clerc’s 200th birthday. After each presentation, Bummy was very touched by Deaf French people waved their hands. He brought this back to USA and shared with Deaf Youth Leadership Camp in 1986 at Minnesota, and it spread like a wildfire, and kept spreading until the Deaf President Now in 1988 and the DeafWay in 1989.

Here’s the information:

FAQ: History of Visual Applause for the Deaf

Jack, please provide evidence about AG Bell fooling the audience. It is a MYTH that you are spreading. I am disappointed at you, and yet, I am not surprised to hear that from you somehow.

You may not realize that this visual applause started long, long time ago. Way before the time frame you said on the vlog.

Amy Cohen Efron
February 22nd, 2009 at 5:43 pm
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karen Says:

Thank you for bringing this up. Yes, yes, lets go back to using the old sign (clapping) !!
February 22nd, 2009 at 6:29 pm
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Carole Hill Says:

WOW I agree, it is a good point. I sometimes do flying and clapping. I sometimes forget about flying when i clapped. then i switched to flying.

This time i will try to remember to clap hands.
February 22nd, 2009 at 6:41 pm
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Jim DeMers Says:

Jack,

Congratulations! I am glad you brought up old give a round of applause. What bothers me about new symptom of applause for a long time? I could see why you have some experiences what happened to the damn story. I appreciate your chronicle.

Good Luck!
February 22nd, 2009 at 6:49 pm
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Deaf Applause « The Deaf Edge Says:

[...] wake up this morning to find this post on DeafRead by Jack Barr, discussing the origins of the Deaf applause… where you wave your hands in the air instead of [...]
February 22nd, 2009 at 6:52 pm
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Edward Nugent Says:

Hands flying wave start by deaf France in 19 century. Deaf have been using hand flying wave for over 200 years. The story about 2 deaf, who went to the meeting in 70’s is a hoax story.
February 22nd, 2009 at 6:58 pm
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Edward Nugent Says:

Hands waved to Amy Cohen Efron, I always believed hands flying belong to Deaf culture. Good job Amy!
February 22nd, 2009 at 7:56 pm
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E. Lynn Jacobowitz Says:

I agree with Amy Cohen Efron’s comments and facts. Also, I support hand waving “UPPLAUSE” as it is Deaf way - the visual clapping. When one claps, one loses about 10 calories. When one “upplauses”, one loses about 1000 calories. I think UPPLAUSE is healthier for our arms. LOL.
February 22nd, 2009 at 9:04 pm
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luz sevall Says:

hi jack; you can click to use service@tube.com and inform on your vlog to ask every deaf people’s computer about agree or disagree??if you want to do … i do agree with you about clap hands. thanks by butterfly
February 22nd, 2009 at 9:07 pm
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Bryen Says:

To be sure, Hand-Waving is a strong symbol of Deaf identity and it really is a cool one. We’re expressing a statement along with our applause by making hands wave more vigorously than clapping. The “effect” of hand-waving is equally as loud as the sound of clapping. Whereas, the visual effect of hand-clapping is somewhat lessened because it is lower.

Jack made AGBell the defining reason why we shouldn’t hand-wave. But I don’t think that is material to the actual issue of hand-waving. So what? None of us think of AGBell when we hand-wave. We think of cultural identity. If it is true that AGBell did that, then their goal failed miserably because it made our culture even stronger and more distinct.

What’s more important is to discuss whether hand-waving is sufficient or even appropriate. There are confusions of protocol at times. For example, if it is a deaf presententer to a deaf audience, certainly hand-waving is appropriate. But, what if it is a hearing person presenting to a deaf audience? Or a mixed situation with both deaf/hearing presenters and a deaf/hearing audience? What if you are the only deaf person in the audience?

The intent of applause, whether it be hand-waving or hand-clapping, is to show support or commend the presenter. We show support for the presentation. Whatever method we choose, we need to choose the one that best expresses our support. It isn’t about establishing our cultural identity, because not every presentation is about Deaf Culture. A hearing person does not hand-clap to assert his/her hearing culture, but to commend the presenter.

Going back to my example of only deaf person in the audience, are we truly commending the presenter if we are the only person in the audience hand-waving? I don’t know. But I think for that hearing presenter, the louder the applause (more claps), the more that person is complimented.

I remember once seeing a show years ago on television with Marlee Matlin as guest. The host wanted to show the hearing audience how we applaud by waving our hands and asked the audience to do that. With the cameras on the audience, the audience did just that, at the same time looking at each other with a sense of confusion. There was an awkward silence during the hand-waving and it was clear that hand-waving did not have the same impact to this audience as it does to a Deaf audience.

I don’t think there is a right or wrong answer to which method is most appropriate. I think for all of us, we have to judge each situation and insert the best method we see to support or commend the presenter.
February 22nd, 2009 at 9:24 pm
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Bryen Says:

Perhaps a better compromise to which method to use (as I discussed various scenarios above) is to hand-clap in the air instead of in the chest area?
February 22nd, 2009 at 9:26 pm
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deafmutearthur Says:

yeah! Yeah! Bring clappings back and be proud to make noise with claps so thunder god will hear our proud clappings so loud enough to wake up dead…
February 22nd, 2009 at 9:33 pm
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KATHY CLARK Says:

No matter where it started, when it started or how it started. It looks very silly!
It may have impressed the speaker Bummy 200 yrs ago and Bummy was heart warmed (maybe they were really telling him to finish up already?) but I think it was meant the same as a standing ovation in this day and age for a person.
It’s done once in awhile when emotion carries people away, but not on a continous basis.
Instead of raise hands waving, STAND UP AND CLAP!
the American Way, not hearing or deaf way!
February 22nd, 2009 at 9:59 pm
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Wildcataz Says:

HI all, I’m sorry to say that I disagree with this situtation. I liked Flying hand so quiet way to do.. I rarely use applause.
February 22nd, 2009 at 10:14 pm
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Dave D Says:

Agreed. I’ve heard this - and went back to clapping.
February 22nd, 2009 at 11:35 pm
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Tornado Len Green Says:

Hey Jack’s Eyes!!!!
Pah!!! I thought I was only person feel uncomfortable when Deaf use Upplaud than clap.

I never liked upplauding because looks like saying “Big Fiiiinnnniiiisssshhhhhhhhhhh”

Fuck these inventor and those who still use hand wavings!

Clapping is very VISUALLY CLEAR and makes sense to anyone, even with low IQ have better common senses to clap than an educated person who upplauds.

Start clapping again…….. don’t want to see new phrase…… Deaf people can do everything except hear or/and CLAP? hahahaha!!! We can clap because we can see people clap because they like something that is very good.

Way to go Jack’s Eyes!!! Big High 5 Slap!
February 22nd, 2009 at 11:47 pm
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H.J. Says:

I agreed with clapping hands 101% to hell with flying hands.
February 23rd, 2009 at 12:46 am
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Mishka Zena Says:

Jack, you provided the wrong information and unfairly blamed AGBell for sign that Deaf people came up. Please do check Deaf Edge’s vlog.
February 23rd, 2009 at 12:50 am
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nmagliocchino Says:

I DONT KNOW THAT… IT S VERY INTERTESTING WHAT I LISTEN FROM YOU.
February 23rd, 2009 at 1:21 am
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J Says:

Yes, I always feel weird when ppl ‘wave’ their hands. I will be very glad when applause will come back again.
February 23rd, 2009 at 1:23 am
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Bobbie McK Says:

CONGRATULATIONS!!!
I agree with you 100% about clapping hands. You are great. Keep up with your Vlog.
Stand up and CLAP real loud!!!!
Thank you.
February 23rd, 2009 at 1:49 am
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J_J1967 Says:

Jack,, I have always clapped, when my deaf friends were using the hand wave, I found it a bit akward.
Regardless who started it, is irrelevant..I prefer to clap rather than use the hand wave.
Jack keep up the good work.

J_J1967
February 23rd, 2009 at 1:53 am
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Danny P Says:

I agree with you 100%. I never like hands flying and that has no feeling after well spoke or well played so I like clapping that makes us stronger and tradition!
February 23rd, 2009 at 2:02 am
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Ati Says:

High flying hands are acting like MONKEY !!! i prefer clapping !!! good show !!!
February 23rd, 2009 at 3:15 am
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kris Says:

i agree with jack….clapping is natural
like deaf and hearing world….

i am proud of jack:)
February 23rd, 2009 at 3:43 am
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dick gratzke Says:

hi jack i think clapping hands is more exciting abt itself shows feelings its good i agree with u jack and thanks for telling us go back the way it suppose to be !!!!!
February 23rd, 2009 at 4:03 am
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Faerie Says:

Can you prove it’s AG Bell that started it? It doesn’t make sense to me that they would want to start that, seeing as they wanted Deaf people to be oral and “assimilate” (not stand out) to the hearing world.

Waving hands would be something that makes Deaf people stand out, so I just don’t see the sense in saying that AG Bell started that. Not sure I agree with you, but you can post whatever you want.
February 23rd, 2009 at 4:11 am
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Nanette Says:

Jack,
I know that you re forget asl is conflict because
already asl is techinque can’t back time.
Don’t let children confuse. They keep up proper
asl is future!!!!!!!
February 23rd, 2009 at 5:11 am
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Candy Says:

For the commenters here, there are TWO different things going on here.

ONE: Jack is saying that AGBell started this and he obviously did not do his homework because that information is false.

Which was the sole purpose of his vlog. He did not ask which is better? But, many of you commented that you liked one better than the other. That’s fine.

TWO: Deaf people are free to use clapping or hand waving, however they feel comfortable. But, this was not the purpose of this vlog.

This is an example of misinformation that creates hysteria which creates mob mentality. Let’s just bury this deep resentment towards AGBell because it has become a source of false information time and time again and creates unnecessary division. It’s silly. What’s next? :)
February 23rd, 2009 at 5:22 am
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Teresa Jo Says:

Jack, yes, totally agree with you.

I often felt hesitate using hand waving. Its just doesn’t feel right, but I sometime just tag along with group. Certainly do felt difference between clapping and hand waving. Hand clapping make me feel inspiriting than hand waving. Because it does make sound, sometime loud. Hand waving is all silent.

And of course, it can be confusing with “finish” signing. Hand clapping has no confusing, thats for sure!

Glad you did bold annoucing your comment. Way to go … high 5 slap!
 
History of Visual Applause for the Deaf

The ancient Romans had "a set ritual of applause for public performances, expressing degrees of approval: snapping the finger and thumb, clapping with the flat or hollow palm, waving the flap of the toga, for which last the emperor Aurelian substituted a handkerchief (orarium), distributed to all Roman citizens".1 This last item is the earliest record of what is now called the "Chautauqua salute", which consists of waving a handkerchief in the air. However, note that this applause was used by all Romans, not just by or for the deaf.

The waving of handkerchiefs was apparently independently reinvented at several times in several places. It is said that the thunderous applause that came at the end of the 1824 premiere of late-deafened Ludwig van Beethoven's Ninth Symphony not only included a handclapping ovation, but the audience also "stood, they clapped, they stamped their feet, they waved their handkerchiefs".2 There is also a mid-19th century record that an audience waved its handkerchiefs for the late-deafened Czech musical composer Bedrich Smetana.3

And at a 1980 Canadian deaf softball association tournament banquet, a dim hotel banquet room made it difficult to see hands clapping, so people picked up and waved their napkins instead. In 1984, there was a follow-up to the earlier Canadian event when the National Festival of Arts for the Deaf was held in Edmonton, Alberta, and all its participants were issued "clapkerchiefs", specially-printed pieces of light cloth specifically for the purpose of waving applause. One witness reported that several attendees who forgot to bring their clapkerchiefs resorted to waving their hands in the air instead.4

There is an 1892 description of spectators at a Washington, DC baseball field who cheered the exploits of deaf professional baseball player William Ellsworth "Dummy" Hoy by standing up and "wildly waving hats and arms".5 The Chautauqua salute itself first appeared in 1877, when Canadian deaf man Samuel L. Greene attended one of the Chautauqua Assemblies at Fair Point on Chautauqua Lake, New York. He gave three prayer selections in signs and received great handclapping applause for it. The platform superintendent, John H. Vincent, rose and suggested, "Since the speaker cannot hear your applause, take out your handkerchiefs and wave them in appreciation".6 This was done and became popular at other Chautauqua meetings and then spread nationwide, until it was banned around 1914 by public health authorities who feared that the practice might help spread germs at the time that tuberculosis and other diseases were ravaging large parts of the U.S. population.7

Why did the practice of waving handkerchiefs not pick up again later? This is only speculation on my part, but I note that the use of handkerchiefs fell out of use during the 1950s and 1960s. Today, it is rare to find a man or woman, deaf or hearing, who still carries a fabric handkerchief around. If no handkerchief is available, obviously it can't be used for waving. Swishing a small, flimsy Kleenex through the air just isn't the same thing, even if you happen to have one handy.

The modern American Deaf practice of fluttering the hands in the air evidently came to the U.S. from France in late 1985. In a magazine article, Gerald "Bummy" Burstein told of attending the 200th anniversary birthday celebrations for Laurent Clerc in France that November. Just prior to that, he attended the French Deaf people's national convention, and noticed that each presentation ended with "clapping" made by twisting the arms and hands above the heads. Impressed by this display of visual applause - which also followed his own presentation - he told the story the following summer to participants in the 1986 Deaf Youth Leadership Camp in Minnesota. The campers and staff immediately picked up the French deaf applause and continued to use it themselves for the rest of the camp session. It spread throughout Deaf U.S.A. like a virus from there, and became especially prominent during the 1988 Gallaudet "Deaf President Now" protest and the 1989 "Deaf Way" international conference.8

So, when, and by whom, in France did the fluttering-hand applause begin? Ah, there we are stuck for now. I have found nothing in English about this, and even if that information exists somewhere in French, I can't read French. This form of visual applause may possibly date back to the large French "deaf-mute banquets" that began on the anniversary of the abbé de l'Épée's birthday in 1833, and ran annually for many years. Unfortunately, I have found no record of how applause was done at those banquets, so we cannot make that link.
 


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