Should the legal drinking age change?

Cheri said:
Hummm..... Some members here thinks it's okay to have youngster learn the taste of alcohol beverage, I guess the same goes for drugs too right? So if there any dangerous involving with your kids in the nearest future, Don't come crying here about it, Because, that's your own problem for letting them curious the first place. Yep, I'm being blunt because you guys don't even think the real issue is putting the kids on the spot of getting hurt. What a crazy world with crazy people living in it. :ugh:

I think you misunderstood my statement.
I let kids do...
That does not mean to my kids. What about other hundred million of kids on the earth? What can we do? There is nothing we can do but God made a fine mess since the era of Adam and Eve....
 
diehardbiker65 said:
Offering them these sips or dope won't help at all, and have the potential negative impact on them.

If your smart enough, talk open and be straightforward about danger of these stuff. Trust me, kids will LISTEN to you even though they might seem not.


Why should the kids hide from the parents when they allow them to drink wine or beer with meal in the house?

At my hubby's birthday party on New Year Eve 2004 in resturant, 15 years old son of my friend drink beer front of his parents. My children can have if they like but they didn't because they don't like it.

My hubby started to drink beer with family meal when he was 14 years old. Did he is an alocholic? No, he knows his limit as Euroepans, too.
 
Dennis said:
I disagree. I think those parents allowed them to drink because they themselves drink to get drunk. They don't seem to care much about anything except themselves. Drunks typically have underlying problems that need to be treated.


Correct! The people who suffer physchological disorder feel overcome by the desire to have a drugs and drink because they use drugs and drink as way to forget the problems or relax, anxiety, anger, depression, etc..and also unhappy family atmopshere could affect self-esteem & lead more depression & feel being failure to make them think suicide, too... It's how to get people addict to drugs/alochol.
 
ButterflyGirl said:
You need to read the other posts about the Europeans allowing their children to drink some sips of alcoholic beverages. Once these children are taught to drink some sips, they sneak behind their parents' backs to get more than just a sip.

They knew their children were taking some sips at the party but the children decided to have more than sips so they went behind their backs to drink a whole bottle of beer. I am trying to point out that I am so against parents who allow their children to have a sip of alcoholic beverages which I believe will lead them to drink more behind their parents back.

:roll:
 
I think you are getting wrong idea what I am saying.

I do not need to show my kids drinking! I can explain to them why I don't drink that way, they would look up at me and see other suckers get their life fucked up, they will follow my footstep,.

Liebling:-))) said:
Why should the kids hide from the parents when they allow them to drink wine or beer with meal in the house?

At my hubby's birthday party on New Year Eve 2004 in resturant, 15 years old son of my friend drink beer front of his parents. My children can have if they like but they didn't because they don't like it.

My hubby started to drink beer with family meal when he was 14 years old. Did he is an alocholic? No, he knows his limit as Euroepans, too.
 
Liebling:-))) said:
Why should the kids hide from the parents when they allow them to drink wine or beer with meal in the house?

At my hubby's birthday party on New Year Eve 2004 in resturant, 15 years old son of my friend drink beer front of his parents. My children can have if they like but they didn't because they don't like it.

My hubby started to drink beer with family meal when he was 14 years old. Did he is an alocholic? No, he knows his limit as Euroepans, too.

Extactly... that what I felt and made me wonder about Europe's cultures so strong respect and give children a sip drink of alocholic which my friend telling me everything about their cultures.. I've been there and learned sumth'n like new styles their own. I have no rights critizite their cultures and respect highly their own. I don't even complain at all.. Espically North America quite totally different compare than Europe does, reason too much high law and trying to effort people "reminder" as do not allow them young children/teenagers may learn sip or else.. TOTAL ZERO.. Unfortunally So many young children/teenagers are sneaking and curiouisity turns it out "DRUNK already". Sad!

Of course I've already been there and seen my older son already sneak and took whisky and passed out in his bedroom... I discovered the whisky already emptied. Turns me fumed yes.. honestly.. Which he not supposed to steal whisky of mine and drank whole thing along w/his friend.. I wish He should have ask me first and try curiouis drink sip but too late.. He want himself and learn sumth'n more curiouisty what Mom's drink ???
Yes I'm part of responbile because didn't pay attention at all cuz due socializite people are in my place for partying celebrating.. I'm glad, My older son already learned his lesson because of sick somatch.. and easily barf.
I'm hoping he could not touch whisky afterall but.. cannot see what he doing.. I knew he is still hiding..
 
Sweetheart said:
I apologize. I disagree with you. Here USA have bad record of drunking and driving. I counted MANY people who I knew died by drunking and driving. My friend died from that, my sister's best friend died from that, my another sister's friend died from that, my brother's coach and his wife died by that, many people that i knew who in my life died by drunking and driving. Since I live in Michigan, I remember in one year I forgot WHICH, around 30 people died from drunking and driving in Michigan. All of them are underage. I noticed that and I agreed with the laws in USA that everybody have to be 21 years old to drinking. I consider it more SAFE. When I was young, I complained that becuase I cant drink when I was young so I sneaked to drinking some for fun. Then, my mom decided to taking me out to Canada to drinking whatever I want that when I was 19 yrs old, I love it becuase its freedom. Until now I am 21 yrs old, I realized why USA set that law. I agreed with for EVERYBODY'S SAFE. I apologize. That's USA's laws that we cant change. Same like people want USA to change smoking cigs to not allow so they can allow you know, weed... Because Cigs can kill people of cancer, Weed nothing hurt... Many reasons why people complain abt cigs, weed, drugs, everything.. We cant change thats so far I knew that we cant change the laws. But one thing for drinking, I rather it to be STAY to be 21 instead of 18 yrs old. For safe...


Interesting, you said yourself "Here USA have bad record of drunking & driving".

May I ask you question?

Why US Government didn't increase the driving legal age but just alcohol? Why blame alcohol? - not cigarettes or drugs? huh?

We should blame people, not alcohol because it's them who choose to abuse/disrespect alcohol to be drunk and driving!!!!

You said yourself that you drink alochol under 21 years old. Are you become alochol addict after that?

Interesting, cigarettes and drugs are much high to kill people than alochol.


Weed nothing hurt

:jaw: :Ohno:


I rather to not let teenager driving until they are old enough to be sensible and respect alcohol and traffic law...

I rather to drive and pick my children up from club than let them drive alone because it's safe....
 
Sweetheart said:
But in USA rare to having that education abt drunking and driving, thats why. I want them to have in ALL OF SCHOOLS in all of states, not even MISS ONE... In my school dont have ONE... my friend's school do have one... What different between of them so thats why I said why not all of them have it... Same for everything that need to teach kids to learn something abt out of the world so they will learn more before they get out of the world and get confused or something like that... My mom taught me ALOT abt out of world when I was 13 yrs old. She warned me alot but I noticed some of my friends didnt learn ANY abt out of world, I was like eh... Why not they learn abt it also? :dunno: I want all of schools to having that kind of education for everything for their safe.


Yes, I can understand and agree with you about driving and drinking education like sex education because they related to health issue...

Okay, let me tell you about my country.

Every students at school are educated by teachers & police about drinking and driving, including traffic law.

Did you know why it's illegal for the parents in Europe to teach their children how to drive? Yes, it's illegal in Europe. If we want to learn how to drive then go to driving school at from 18 years old. We were taught there about drinking and driving, traffic law... First of all we have to fill the question and answer test about driving laws until we passed our test then take driving lesson and then pass then get driving licesne.


*I have to go home now and will be back for further post tonight*
 
mld4ds said:
I think you misunderstood my statement. That does not mean to my kids..


Did I mention your name? Show me where did I? How do you know I'm speaking of your post? I was not direct my post to you, I was speaking generally. ;)

Liebling said:
Well, drugs or cigarettes are more dangerous than alcohol...


There is no differences, Alcohol is drug too.

http://www.lecturelist.org/content/view_lecture/1235
Alcohol is responsible for deaths, injuries and unhappiness

http://www.tallrite.com/LightRelief/alcoholwarning.htm

http://www.bupa.co.uk/health_information/html/healthy_living/lifestyle/alcohol/alcohol3.html
Alcohol is a drug that depresses the brain. We all know the cheeriness that can come with the first drink, but alcohol can actually cause severe depression. 'Letting go', another effect which can initially be pleasant, gets some of us into difficulties, because when our petty or angry side gets exaggerated by alcohol, friendships or marriages can be threatened.


http://www.mhcs.health.nsw.gov.au/health-public-affairs/mhcs/publications/5375.html
Drinking regularly above these levels may contribute to high blood pressure (a risk factor for heart disease and stroke) and increase the risk of cancer, liver disease and brain damage

http://kidshealth.org/parent/emotions/behavior/alcohol.html
The short-term effects of drinking include:

distorted vision, hearing, and coordination
altered perceptions and emotions
impaired judgment, which can lead to accidents, drowning, and other risky behaviors like unsafe sex and drug use
bad breath
hangovers
 
diehardbiker65 said:
I think you are getting wrong idea what I am saying.

I do not need to show my kids drinking! I can explain to them why I don't drink that way, they would look up at me and see other suckers get their life fucked up, they will follow my footstep,.


That's correct babe! ;) I pity those children who have parents who offer them alcohol. :Ohno:
 
Liebling:)))]You made an exaggerating post here. :rofl:
Laugh all you want. It is making you look like an idiot anyway. You are copying another member's saying about me exaggerating :roll:
 
Children are going to try alcohol wether if the parent gives it to them or not. It doesn't matter how many times we tell them it's bad if they want to try it they are going to. While, I personally do not agree with giving children alcohol, in some countries it is a part of their culture and I will not bash that. But, I do know someone that has in the past. When I asked her why she had given her 16 yr old something to drink, she said that she's going to drink anyway and that she feels safer if she gives it to her at home then someone else putting something in her drink. While I don't agree with the method, it's still not my place to judge.
 
Look at me, I've tried to taste few of German spirits last December. Do I learn to drink more and more after have some sips? Excuse me, I laugh.
Was I referring that to adults? No, I was referring that to underaged children. Now you need to read the posts more carefully.
 
Cheri said:
Did I mention your name? Show me where did I? How do you know I'm speaking of your post? I was not direct my post to you, I was speaking generally. ;)

Yup, you mentioned some members which that includes me.... See my post.
:cool:
 
mld4ds said:
Yup, you mentioned some members which that includes me.... See my post.
:cool:


Whatever man, You are jumping to the conclusion, I didn't mention names I said "some members" It doesn't mean "you" I've been posting since page one and this is your first time you posted recently, So; what makes you think it's all about you? Good Grief Men! :giggle:
 
ButterflyGirl said:
Laugh all you want. It is making you look like an idiot anyway. You are copying another member's saying about me exaggerating :roll:

:rofl: wow, now you see yourself what you saying here. :rofl:

me and copying ? blah! I am an adult and have my own opinion after read any posts, not copying others.

Unfortunlately yes, I has to say open that your posts here is an exaggerating...

Example:

You accussed someone to label you as exaggerating or lying your story which it´s not. I would suggest you read someone´s posts carefully.

You claimed that anyone become addict to alcholic more and more after get some sips and watch parents drink wine or beer everyday then they get to learn to drink more and more...

Who says that the parents drink wine or beer "everyday"? Nobody here says that we drink alcohol everyday.

You can image it´s worst when you smoking 3 or 5 times a day in everyday...



Was I referring that to adults? No, I was referring that to underaged children. Now you need to read the posts more carefully.

I know it´s underaged children, you are talking about but I made my post in general way saying children (not babies to toddlers) and adult because children and adult are human. ;)
 
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As a teenager, you get a lot more freedom, but with that freedom comes responsibility. You are now making most of your own decisions. When making a decision, knowing all the facts can help you decide what is right for you. Choosing not to drink alcohol may be a difficult decision, but it is the right choice to make. Underage drinkers risk not only their own health and well-being, but they can also hurt their family, friends and even strangers.

Every year, you glaze over during the alcohol chapter in Health class. You have heard all the hype about the dangers of alcohol, but you're still convinced it won't happen to you. Alcohol continued to be the number one drug of choice for adolescents despite proof that alcohol is dangerous for teens. One reason is because your body is going through rapid physical development. Another is drinking and driving. The number one killer of young people is alcohol related vehicle crashes. You have an inexperienced driver who has decided to numb his/her brain with alcohol.

Alcohol is absorbed into the bloodstream, where it is carried to the rest of the body. Some of the parts of the body it affects are:

Liver-The liver filters blood, but can only metabolize alcohol at a limited rate. Excess alcohol invades the liver cells and this can lead to diseases such as cirrhosis and cancer.

Stomach-Alcohol can make a person sick to the stomach and can cause ulcers and other problems in long-term drinkers.

Heart- Alcohol can overwork the heart. This can lead to high blood pressure and heart disease.

Brain- Alcohol kill brain cells. It depresses the central nervous system. This means it not only affects the brain itself, but also impairs coordination, balance, concentration, reflexes, vision, reason, and judgment

Why is drinking illegal for people under 21?

Everyone asks this question, but there are very good reasons behind the law. The federal government has established a nationwide limit of the sale of alcohol to persons on and above the age of 21. Studies continually show the harmful effects which alcohol has on the development of the body. The first twenty years are a time of rapid physical development, and alcohol can truly harm this. In addition, it is more likely that young drivers will misuse alcohol, and be involved in more fatal vehicle crashes due to alcohol.

About drinking and driving

If you've heard it once, you've heard it a million times - drinking and driving is a deadly combination. This is true for all ages, but especially for teens. Think about all the skills it takes to drive a car: coordination, balance, concentration, reflexes, vision, reason, judgment. Alcohol slows down everyone of these skills and when you combine that will a driver that doesn't have a lot of experience, there can be nothing but danger.

In 1995, alcohol-related vehicle crashes claimed the lives of 2,206 youth in the United States.
Pennsylvania lost 77 youth to drinking and driving - that number is 36.4% of youth fatalities.
If the numbers are not convincing, maybe some real stories are. Ask around, and you will find that you know someone who has been affected by a drunk driver.

Don't wait until you're in an accident, don't wait until someone you know has been killed or injured by a drunk driver, don't wait until you've been charged with driving under the influence - decide now that you don't need to drink.

Fitting in - without alcohol

Kids who drink often blame peer pressure as the reason. Remember, part of the maturing process is taking responsibility for your own actions. Nobody ever said growing up was going to be easy, but keeping a few things in mind may make things easier.

Focus on the positive things in your life, and spend time doing activities that you enjoy. Whether this is done in school, sports, art, recreation, religion, or other activities, there are alternatives to drinking.
Think through the situation. This is an emotional time in your life. You may be tempted to act first and think later. Taking a few minutes to think about the consequences may save you a headache later, or may even save your life. You want to be in charge - you don't want your parents controlling your life. Remember, since alcohol effects your brain, alcohol will control your actions.


The Law

For many, getting a driver's license is one of the highlights of being a teenager. It means that you are growing up, and accepting new responsibilities. Underage drinking will affect these privileges, whether you are driving or not.

If you are convicted of:

Lying about your age to obtain alcohol or
Purchasing, consuming, possessing, or transporting alcohol or
Carrying a false identification card.
You may have you driving privilege suspended for a minimum of 90 days and face fines. If you are under 16, this suspension begins on your 16th birthday.

Pennsylvania's new Zero Tolerance Law makes it illegal for a minor (anyone under the age of 21) to drive with any measurable amount of alcohol in their blood. A minor can be charged with a DUI (Driving under the Influence) with a BAC of .02%. What does that mean? It could mean as little as a sip of beer. DUI charges may include jail time, fines, attendance at Alcohol Highway Safety School, treatment for a drug and/or alcohol problem and increased insurance costs. Is it worth it??? Want to hear? (wav 82kb)

Another legal deterrent is your schools policy towards alcohol and drug possession. It is generally against school policy to possess alcohol or drugs (including tobacco) on school property or at any school function. This can result in suspension and referral to a drug & alcohol treatment facility for evaluation.



Choosing not to drink alcohol
 
Cheri, I read your links but it saying for heavily drinkers... Yes, it affect if you are heavily drunk and drink more than 3 alcohol a day in everyday...

I already explain in my previous post with link

http://www.alldeaf.com/showpost.php?p=436149&postcount=99

Alcohol And Health
http://www2.potsdam.edu/hansondj/AlcoholAndHealth.html

A little red wine may help to ward off cancer
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,8122-1333324,00.html

Red & white wines are good for cholesterol level, heart diease, lung, blood pressure.... only if you drink one or two glass a day but it´s bad if you drink heavily... more than three glasses a day and drink everyday...

Doctors recommended my hubby to drink a glass of red wine to prevent heart diease and blood pressure since he had heart rhymus last October 2004. His health is good.

I don´t drink beer and any spirits because I don´t like them but a glass of white or red wine and champagne at most saturdays. I drink cherry liqueor very rarely. My hubby like beer, wines and champagne...


Angel, I read your link but it sound that it´s for heavily drinkers, not moderate drinkers.
 
The way I see it is when young kids begin drinking before age 15 are four times more likely to develop alcoholism than those who begin drinking at age 21....Some parents don't often think about how alcohol effect their children's mind and their bodies, yet I see some of you thinking it no big deal, one sip won't harm your children, I'm sorry but I have to disagree with that, how is it going to help your children learn that alcohol is bad for them when you're allowing them to drink a glass or two.... :shock:
 
Children, Alcohol and Parenting

Drinking by children is often seen as a problem, but traditional alcohol education promoting abstinence is ineffective. Simply doing more of what isn't working cannot lead to success, so what should you do as parents?

The Problem

Underage drinking is common and seen as a major problem by many people in the United States. Legislation has been passed in a futile effort to prevent those under the age of 21 from purchasing or consuming alcohol.

School alcohol education programs generally try to convince students to abstain both now and as adults by using scare tactics: teaching that alcohol is a poison, by equating it with illegal drugs, and by promoting the "gateway theory" that alcohol leads to marijuana which leads to cocaine and other hard drugs.

In spite of the billions of dollars spent, the enormous efforts of teachers, the commitment of vast amounts of student time in school, alcohol education has failed to prevent young people from consuming alcohol. 1 Large numbers of young people consume alcohol by their teen years.

Issues

It's illegal in the US for a 20 year old man to toast his bride with a sip of alcohol at their wedding. He can vote, serve on juries, write a will, defend his country by serving in the military, hold public office, hold top national security clearance, operate his own business, hire employees and otherwise conduct himself as a mature and responsible adult, yet he can't legally have a sip of alcohol.

Prohibition for young people is actually contrary to American tradition. In colonial America, even small children were served alcohol beverages by their parents, who considered alcohol a natural and normal part of life. Religion taught that alcohol is the "Good gift of God," to be used and enjoyed in moderation. What was prohibited was the abuse of alcohol. Alcohol consumption was widespread, but drinking problems were rare. 2

Facts


When children are served alcohol by their parents, drinking problems are generally low. When children are prevented from drinking until an older age, drinking problems tend to be high. The evidence is overwhelming. 3

In many groups around the world, virtually everyone drinks and they drink both frequently and regularly, but they have very few drinking problems. Such groups familiar to Americans include Italians, Greeks, Spaniards, Jews, and Portuguese. What are the keys to their success? In such groups:

Alcohol itself is seen as a neutral substance - neither good nor bad in itself. It's not a poison and it's not a magic elixir that can solve peoples' problems. It's how alcohol is used that is important.

People can choose either of two equally acceptable options: (a) to abstain or (b) to drink responsibly and in moderation. What is totally unacceptable for anyone under any circumstance is the abuse of alcohol. Alcohol abuse is simply never tolerated.

People learn how to drink from an early age within the safe and supporting environment of the home. They don't learn how to drink from their friends and acquaintances, who aren't looking out for their best interests. Common sense suggests that it's better to learn how to drink in the parent's house than in the fraternity house.

Alcohol & Parenting

As parents, we actually have more influence on our children than anyone or anything else, although we often erroneously feel powerless in the face of television, movies, our children's peers and other parts of society. 5

Our children learn from observing our behavior and we are the most significant role models in their lives. Therefore, we need to:

Be good role models. We need to be living, day-to-day examples of good drinking behavior.

Reject "do as I say, not as I do."If we abuse alcohol, we can't expect our children not to follow in our footsteps when they begin to drink.

Convey appropriate attitudes. We should never laugh at intoxication or inappropriate behavior. We can use news events, TV episodes, movies, or personal events as opportunities to discuss what is appropriate and inappropriate behavior.

Instead of stigmatizing alcohol and trying to scare children into permanent abstinence, we need to recognize that it is not alcohol but rather the abuse of alcohol that is the problem.


Teaching responsible use does not require the consumption of alcohol any more than teaching world geography requires visiting Nepal or teaching civics requires that children run for elective office or vote in presidential elections. We teach civics to prepare children for the day when they can vote and assume other civic responsibilities if they choose to do so.

Of course, letting children consume alcohol in moderation within the family and home setting is especially valuable in helping them realize that drinking really is a natural and normal activity that does not, in itself, confer "adulthood" or "maturity." Either choosing to abstain or to drink responsibly is a real sign of maturity and good judgment.

Because either drinking in moderation or abstaining are both equally acceptable options for adults, we must prepare children for either choice. To do otherwise is both ineffective and irresponsible.

We need to prepare our children to live in a largely drinking world. We need, by our own words and deeds, to teach such things as:

Don't drink and drive.
Don't ride with anyone who has been drinking; be a designated driver.
Don't operate equipment, climb ladders, boat, or engage in similar activities, when drinking.
Don't become intoxicated; being drunk involves an element of risk.
Don't participate in drinking games or drinking contests. 7

We can also teach:

How to refuse a drink politely
How to "lose drinks" that have been forced on them
How to prepare or order "mocktails"

And teach them:

That "a drink is a drink is a drink," and they're all the same to a Breathalyzer. Standard drinks all contain equivalent amounts of alcohol. A drink is:

A 12-ounce bottle or can of regular beer
A 5-ounce glass of wine
A 1 1/2 ounce of 80 proof distilled spirits (either straight or in a mixed drink 8

That only the passage of time can sober a person after drinking too much. Coffee, cold showers, fresh air and similar remedies are ineffective.

That people shouldn't drink on an empty stomach.

That drinking should be limited to no more than one drink per hour.

That eating slows the absorption of alcohol into the body.

That women experience the effects of alcohol at lower consumption rates.

That inexperienced drinkers become intoxicated with much less alcohol than
do experienced drinkers. They are much more likely to have traffic accidents after consuming small amounts of alcohol. Even a single drink dramatically increases the chances that a teen-aged driver will have an accident.

That many people (problem drinkers, pregnant women, patients on certain medications, etc.) should consult with their physicians to determine if they should abstain from alcohol.

In spite of noble intentions and the expenditure of massive amounts of time, effort and money, the evidence shows that our current abstinence-oriented alcohol education is clearly ineffective. Simply doing more of what isn't working cannot lead to success. Teaching moderation is demonstrably more effective.

We need to use proven ways in raising our children to avoid alcohol problems.

Our young people are our future and they deserve nothing less.

Research continues to find that parents exert more influence over their offspring than do peers.

The latest report, by researchers at Columbia University and Queens College and published in Adolescent and Family Health, found that young people select friends who share their attitudes about drinking. And their attitudes have been shaped by observing their parents. Therefore, the peer group largely reinforces what young people have already learned from their parents


http://www2.potsdam.edu/hansondj/ChildrenAndParenting.html
 
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