CI's are just the start-Resistance is futile

faire_jour,

I think he was trying to be funny. I really hope he has a realistic outlook on stem cell research and what it will take to make it an option for treating hearing loss.

I've been thinking about the stem cell thing and whats to say that just because I have a CI now, doesn't mean I can't get stem cells later when they are proven to work. By then, when they know how to make the cochlea hair cells to grow in the right place, size and shape, they will have also know how to repair the damage done by the electrode aray of my current implant. BTW, how are they going to get the hair cells inside the cochlea? Cut a hole right? Well, I already have a hole in mine that is currently being used for the electrodes. This is a win win right? Plus, I am using my auditory nerves every day which could allow me to recover quicker if Stem Cells become an option. How I look at it is in maybe 15-20 years, I might give it a try if others have had good success.

Don't get to wound up. I agree with a few on the board in that I think a new forum for the Stem Cell debate would be good.
 
Steve, I honestly don't think he was trying to be funny at all. Seems like all he cares about is stem cells treatment and getting the perfect hearing, and nothing else.
 
SteveESP52 said:
I think he was trying to be funny. I really hope he has a realistic outlook on stem cell research and what it will take to make it an option for treating hearing loss.
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I realistically expect at least 20db improvement. Phi4sius know someone who improved 25db. Hope Phi4sius can provide his "before" and "after" audiograms!

I've been thinking about the stem cell thing and whats to say that just because I have a CI now, doesn't mean I can't get stem cells later when they are proven to work. By then, when they know how to make the cochlea hair cells to grow in the right place, size and shape, they will have also know how to repair the damage done by the electrode aray of my current implant. How I look at it is in maybe 15-20 years, I might give it a try if others have had good success.
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This is why ive decided to wait 5 years for stem cells instead of getting a CI now and having to wait 15-20 years. There's many other reasons for my choice.

BTW, how are they going to get the hair cells inside the cochlea? Cut a hole right? Well, I already have a hole in mine that is currently being used for the electrodes. This is a win win right? Plus, I am using my auditory nerves every day which could allow me to recover quicker if Stem Cells become an option.
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For you, they would have to remove the CI so yea they can insert the stem cells directly in the cochlea base opening. For me, stem cells will be injected into my arm and some will migrate upwards like it did to this guy who got 25db improvement. Ill take the safe route and 25db improvmement over risky surgery to implant the stem cells that might give me 50db improvmement if im lucky or end up losing it all among other complications. Stem cells should repair the auditory nerves too!
 
deafdude1 said:
I realistically expect at least 20db improvement. Phi4sius know someone who improved 25db. Hope Phi4sius can provide his "before" and "after" audiograms!



This is why ive decided to wait 5 years for stem cells instead of getting a CI now and having to wait 15-20 years. There's many other reasons for my choice.



For you, they would have to remove the CI so yea they can insert the stem cells directly in the cochlea base opening. For me, stem cells will be injected into my arm and some will migrate upwards like it did to this guy who got 25db improvement. Ill take the safe route and 25db improvmement over risky surgery to implant the stem cells that might give me 50db improvmement if im lucky or end up losing it all among other complications. Stem cells should repair the auditory nerves too!
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Might, should, hope, expect.....That is all a maybe, when we HAVE the ability to improve hearing by 100 db TODAY! I just don't get it...
 
aprox 2007 "I serve on UCI's Stem Cell PAC. Bone marrow blastocysts best choice for hair cell regeneration. A lot of these 'well versed' doctors are not part of stem cell research centers and they wont even mention were hardly 'far' from trying this on humans already. In fact we have servicemen from Iraq regaining their hearing as quickly as 45 days from treatment.

Richard Roehm"
source: http://www.alldeaf.com/our-world-our-culture/43946-any-new-updates-stem-cell-research.html


:hmm:
 
faire_jour said:
No we don't!!!!! Show me ANY disease that has been cured using stem cells!
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There isn't one. It is still in the early research stages. There is potential, but at this point that is all there is. But there is a lot of misrepresentation going on regarding scientific fact.
 
neuro said:
aprox 2007 "I serve on UCI's Stem Cell PAC. Bone marrow blastocysts best choice for hair cell regeneration. A lot of these 'well versed' doctors are not part of stem cell research centers and they wont even mention were hardly 'far' from trying this on humans already. In fact we have servicemen from Iraq regaining their hearing as quickly as 45 days from treatment.

...
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:deal: "I heard that the Brooklyn Bridge is for sale...wanna buy it?"

Sorry, but I don't believe that for a second. It would have been headline news and I don't miss things like that.
 
Sighs........ :zzz: goes back to bed.

Soars got the point.... there is no living human with a name broadcasting the news talking about their cure....

Faire jour is right about blindness... read properly...

Few questions.... how do we obtain stem that is suitable for that person ??
Would it mean waiting lists?? Bit like transplant list??
 
overthepond said:
Sighs........ :zzz: goes back to bed.

Soars got the point.... there is no living human with a name broadcasting the news talking about their cure....

Faire jour is right about blindness... read properly...

Few questions.... how do we obtain stem that is suitable for that person ??
Would it mean waiting lists?? Bit like transplant list??
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Not for adult stem cells coming from your own.

Cord blood stem cells? Perhaps....

Embryonic stem cells? They give you warts. But you can always take a chance if you want.
 
faire_jour said:
WILL BE, not has been. BIG difference.
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Clinical trials for blindness starts in 2011. I expect to see adult clinical trials for deafness in 2011 as well.

faire_jour said:
Might, should, hope, expect.....That is all a maybe, when we HAVE the ability to improve hearing by 100 db TODAY! I just don't get it...
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Show me anything that can improve unaided/aided hearing by 100db. Nothing can improve hearing by 100db! The best HAs offer a gain of 75-80db max! I don't expect stem cells to improve my hearing 100db, try 20-40db.

overthepond said:
Sighs........ :zzz: goes back to bed.

Soars got the point.... there is no living human with a name broadcasting the news talking about their cure....
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Really? It's already on the news, see link below!

Alexandria native Humphries fights through MS to compete in Deep South golf tourney | thetowntalk.com | The Town Talk

In February, Humphries underwent another experimental stem cell treatment to regrow inner ear nerve hairs. It not only improved his hearing but helped him tolerate heat, which can be a problem for people with MS.
 
deafdude1 said:
Clinical trials for blindness starts in 2011. I expect to see adult clinical trials for deafness in 2011 as well.



Show me anything that can improve unaided/aided hearing by 100db. Nothing can improve hearing by 100db! The best HAs offer a gain of 75-80db max! I don't expect stem cells to improve my hearing 100db, try 20-40db.
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If they have announeced a clinical trial for blindness next year, and there is one planned for deafness as well, why is there NO information about it out there except you spouting theories???

A CI can improve a 120 db loss up to 20 db. That is a gain of 100db.
 
faire_jour said:
If they have announeced a clinical trial for blindness next year, and there is one planned for deafness as well, why is there NO information about it out there except you spouting theories???

A CI can improve a 120 db loss up to 20 db. That is a gain of 100db.
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There is already information on clinical trials using cord blood stem cells for young children under 18 months. For adults who want stem cells today, they can go to China or Costa Rica. I discussed this with dad and when I get more information/facts and see more results, we will travel there(to Costa Rica) Phi4sius is still trying to get audiograms of this guy who experienced a 25db improvement. I would love a 25db improvement because this will mean ill hear better than 20db with HAs in most frequencies plus all the other advantages.

20db with CI is unusual, I would not expect 20db as realistic, most people do not get to 20db, try 30-40db. But regardless, a 120db loss is useless for HAs and is probably just cochlear dead region. So yea, CI is of course great for 100+ db losses, no arguments there. For lesser degees of losses, you can get to 20db or better already with HAs. Yea CI can give you as much as 100db improvement if you happen to have a 120db loss but for an 80db loss, the improvement is only 60db with CI, but with HA you can attain the same improvement! HA's have their limitations for very profoundly deep losses of 100+ db but are great for losses below 100db.
 
That's rather misleading since those gains are along specific areas where the electrodes excite the nerves and that's with like 24 electrodes versus thousands and thousands of hearing nerves to be excited. It's not a 100 db gain across all levels of frequency inside the ear. Which is why listening to music is such a problem. Scientists continue to try and increase the number of electrodes. I believe they're working on a 240 electrode array, correct me if the number is higher elsewhere.

What stem cells would do as a goal is to restore ALL of the nerves that are damaged in the cochlea.
 
kokonut said:
That's rather misleading since those gains are along specific areas where the electrodes excite the nerves and that's with like 24 electrodes versus thousands and thousands of hearing nerves to be excited. It's not a 100 db gain across all levels of frequency inside the ear. Which is why listening to music is such a problem. Scientists continue to try and increase the number of electrodes. I believe they're working on a 240 electrode array, correct me if the number is higher elsewhere.

What stem cells would do as a goal is to restore ALL of the nerves that are damaged in the cochlea.
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Link to 240 electrodes? It won't matter as it won't come close to stem cells by the time 240 electrode CI comes out, if it ever does. Compared to HAs for those with residual hearing, it may be a 10-20db gain at the high(er) frequenies vs. the best HAs(without transposition) But many have so much low frequency residual hearing that they may hear worse with CI below 1000Hz and better with CI above 1000Hz. Basically just a tradeoff! Plus you can use transposition in the HAs to access the highs anyway. This is why CI only really makes sense for those with no residual hearing anyway. I would love to have some of my nerves restored with stem cells. To restore them all will take much longer, a partial improvement will first happen and as stem cell technology becomes very advanced, eventually a full restoration.
 
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