White privilege

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dogmom

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Decided to add my thoughts of white privilege on here....part of white privilege is not knowing about it <because you don't have to>-

in my experience.....someone perceived as white is more likely to....NOT be followed by store staff while shopping;

NOT to be pulled over police/falsely arrested/assaulted by police <and I am NOT saying "all police are "bad"> ;

to be able to easily get loan/credit at bank or many other places and get a lower rate on it;

more easily be able to rent an apt as opposed to being told - already rented;

someone perceived as white will be more likely allowed to walk through an all-white neighborhood without raising suspicion


.....in an elevator, someone perceived as white comes in, where another Caucasian person is already there. Just two of them. No interaction....passenger who was already there doesn't do anything differently. Next scenario, someone perceived as African-American comes in to find the same passenger. Overall, passenger is more likely than in previous example to grip their bag tighter, or draw up their purse to themselves. These are things I've heard about from people of color who have experienced it as well as things I've seen. Not only have individuals told me about it but over and over these experiences are relayed at anti-racism/white privilege conferences and speak-ins I've been to. Yes, there are all kinds of oppression and one individual may have to deal with several types <I am female, Jew, bi, etc> BUT due to the history as whole of this country, sadly institutionalized oppression continues to come out to the degree that white males as overall group <not as individuals> tend to have the most degree of privilege.
 
dogmom said:
Decided to add my thoughts of white privilege on here....part of white privilege is not knowing about it <because you don't have to>-

in my experience.....someone perceived as white is more likely to....NOT be followed by store staff while shopping;

NOT to be pulled over police/falsely arrested/assaulted by police <and I am NOT saying "all police are "bad"> ;

to be able to easily get loan/credit at bank or many other places and get a lower rate on it;

more easily be able to rent an apt as opposed to being told - already rented;

someone perceived as white will be more likely allowed to walk through an all-white neighborhood without raising suspicion


.....in an elevator, someone perceived as white comes in, where another Caucasian person is already there. Just two of them. No interaction....passenger who was already there doesn't do anything differently. Next scenario, someone perceived as African-American comes in to find the same passenger. Overall, passenger is more likely than in previous example to grip their bag tighter, or draw up their purse to themselves. These are things I've heard about from people of color who have experienced it as well as things I've seen. Not only have individuals told me about it but over and over these experiences are relayed at anti-racism/white privilege conferences and speak-ins I've been to. Yes, there are all kinds of oppression and one individual may have to deal with several types <I am female, Jew, bi, etc> BUT due to the history as whole of this country, sadly institutionalized oppression continues to come out to the degree that white males as overall group <not as individuals> tend to have the most degree of privilege.
Click to expand...

If you ask non-whites, Black, Mexican, Indian (I look white but have a lot of Native American Indian blood in me), or others, almost all of them will tell you they have had experiences that confirm dogmom's post.

If you ask whites a large segment will tell you it is all hogwash.
 
hi, Berry:wave:

I wrote "this country" in my post and I should have written "United States" because there are folks from all over world here!:D Am sorry, I made mistake-

:ty: for adding on your thoughts!
 
It'd be interesting to see some kind of survey to go along with these anecdotes.
 
kokonut said:
It'd be interesting to see some kind of survey to go along with these anecdotes.
Click to expand...

Being an uneducated person I place more value on personal experience than I do surveys or statistics. At one time I was fascinated by public relations and thought that would be a great way to earn a living and perhaps do a bit of good in the world. I still believe public relations at its best can and does do that.

Unfortunately the human condition is such that people and companies prefer manipulation over communication, and I discovered surveys and statistics can be manipulated and then used to manipulate.

After all more doctors smoke Camels than any other cigarette.
 
Berry said:
Being an uneducated person I place more value on personal experience than I do surveys or statistics. At one time I was fascinated by public relations and thought that would be a great way to earn a living and perhaps do a bit of good in the world. I still believe public relations at its best can and does do that.

Unfortunately the human condition is such that people and companies prefer manipulation over communication, and I discovered surveys and statistics can be manipulated and then used to manipulate.

After all more doctors smoke Camels than any other cigarette.
Click to expand...

Let me rephrase it. It'd be interesting to see if there is a survey(s) that ask the question for a particular race or ethnic group regarding past public or even personal experiences because of their race. I'm not about to discard every statistics or surveys without knowing more behind it and the questions being ask. Personal experiences can show great insight to those not familiar with the details. Surveys could as well add to that dimension.
 
For white people, it's hard to see the white privilege, even though it's there. A white person may chose to ignore white privilege, but that doesn't make it any less real. People of color cannot ignore it because it effects their lives daily.

Here's a great list of white privileges:

http://www.case.edu/president/aaction/UnpackingTheKnapsack.pdf

This one is particularly illustrative:

"I can chose blemish cover or bandages in 'flesh' color and have them more or less match my skin."
 
YES, Sally....

the bandage is a common, "everyday, little" example that has been brought up among people at the anti-racism things I've gone to
 
Once a teacher of mine told me that when she was boarding a plane, she took one look at the two black pilots and questioned their competence. She wondered what their flying records were like, if they had ever flown drunk, if they had ever crashed or almost crashed a plane. That thinking, which goes even deeper than the little actions like grasping a purse, add to white privilege all the time. If those pilots were both white, she probably wouldn't have thought twice about their competence.

We all get caught up in that thinking sometimes. It doesn't matter what race we are. No one is exempt from it. The teacher that told me that story was black herself. But we constantly absorb that kind of thinking through ads, through movies where the main character is white and competent and has a "stupid black friend." The list of examples is endless.

And it's that thinking combined with the inability to admit it to oneself that is the most destructive. My teacher was lucky to catch herself in that thought process and to call herself on it and realize how absurd her thinking was, but there are tons of people that have those kinds of thought processes that don't think twice about it and would never admit they think that way. And since no one on the outside can call them on their thoughts, it's up to the person to call themselves on that racist white-privilege thinking.
 
yes, you are right, CJB, being aware of thinking in oneself very important-
 
I dont think I am racist at all. After all I've gotten pretty much every race from Pink to the darkest of dark in the bag. All of them, except an Asian.
 
Everyone is at least a little racist. It's in the air we breathe.
 
You don't even need to stray far from being white to recognize these things exist.

I get associated with Eastern European immigrants (Russian mafia, Polish criminals, genocidal Serbs to name a few stereotypes et cetera) just because I am not as ghostly or pasty white as the Nordic, British, Irish or Scottish. :\
 
Berry said:
If you ask non-whites, Black, Mexican, Indian (I look white but have a lot of Native American Indian blood in me), or others, almost all of them will tell you they have had experiences that confirm dogmom's post.

If you ask whites a large segment will tell you it is all hogwash.
Click to expand...

This is quite true, Berry. It is those that take advantage of that privilege on a daily basis with no conscious thought to the matter, that deny it's existence.
 
kokonut said:
It'd be interesting to see some kind of survey to go along with these anecdotes.
Click to expand...

There has been reams of sociological research done on the topic. Empirical research. Surveys are not considered to be empirical, and in fact, are considered by those engaged in serious research to be full of limitations, not the first of which is the fact that they are self report.
 
kokonut said:
Let me rephrase it. It'd be interesting to see if there is a survey(s) that ask the question for a particular race or ethnic group regarding past public or even personal experiences because of their race. I'm not about to discard every statistics or surveys without knowing more behind it and the questions being ask. Personal experiences can show great insight to those not familiar with the details. Surveys could as well add to that dimension.
Click to expand...

Statistics and surveys do not go hand in hand. Surveys are not considered to be the most reliable nor valid method of collecting data. In fact, they are generally only used as a starting point for empirical studies. However, the research is available. One only need search the professional journals to find it.
 
CJB said:
Once a teacher of mine told me that when she was boarding a plane, she took one look at the two black pilots and questioned their competence. She wondered what their flying records were like, if they had ever flown drunk, if they had ever crashed or almost crashed a plane. That thinking, which goes even deeper than the little actions like grasping a purse, add to white privilege all the time. If those pilots were both white, she probably wouldn't have thought twice about their competence.

We all get caught up in that thinking sometimes. It doesn't matter what race we are. No one is exempt from it. The teacher that told me that story was black herself. But we constantly absorb that kind of thinking through ads, through movies where the main character is white and competent and has a "stupid black friend." The list of examples is endless.

And it's that thinking combined with the inability to admit it to oneself that is the most destructive. My teacher was lucky to catch herself in that thought process and to call herself on it and realize how absurd her thinking was, but there are tons of people that have those kinds of thought processes that don't think twice about it and would never admit they think that way. And since no one on the outside can call them on their thoughts, it's up to the person to call themselves on that racist white-privilege thinking.
Click to expand...

Spot on, CJB. It is not the thinking that is the most destructive. It is the denial of the thinking, the refusal to admit to it, that is the most destructive. Once one admits to it, one can take the necessary measures to correct it. Denial simply allows it to profer.
 
jillio said:
Statistics and surveys do not go hand in hand. Surveys are not considered to be the most reliable nor valid method of collecting data. In fact, they are generally only used as a starting point for empirical studies. However, the research is available. One only need search the professional journals to find it.
Click to expand...

Still, it'd be interesting to see what people say about these issues in whatever format.
 
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